juantoo3
Well-Known Member
Kindest Regards, all!
Interesting topic, Paladin!
I hope ya'll won't mind I pulled a few quotes:
Good points, all. And yet I am left to wonder...are "you" not also defending a *right* position in making statements such as these?
I guess what I am trying to say, is that we all need some sense of right (correct) as opposed to wrong (incorrect). Open mindedness certainly has a place, especially within logic and reason, but I would caution against being so open minded that one's brains fall out. That too, is a fallacy. So logic, and reason, *are* a fine line / tightrope to walk. And sadly, in order to work correctly, both sides must agree to fundamental elements of an argument. Perhaps this is why in some subjects of argument (science vs. religion, for example), the opposing sides seem to be talking past each other, because neither is willing to allow the fundamental elements of the other side.
Another thing I have noticed, is that *average* people are not so moved by facts and figures as they are by emotional appeals. Emotonal appeals can easily be translated as logical fallacies. It does not have to be factual, it just has to sound good. (Look up "behaviorism", John B. Watson, and advertising psychology) Politicians use this to their advantage every voting season, it's around us in force right now. Bumper sticker soundbites are what the vast majority of the voting public will use to make their political decisions, not the *truth* contained in facts and figures. Logical fallacies bedamned.
And, in fairness, few people in my estimation are aware of, let alone functionally capable of noticing and calling out, logical fallacies. By the time I discovered the concept (and the *list*), I found I had uncovered a few of them on my own, but I was very surprized to learn how often I used fallacious reasoning, even to myself. I like to believe I have learned a great deal from that series of lessons, but I still catch myself from time to time. The difference being that now I am aware. So I think it's an important point to make others aware of their logical fallacies in their arguments, the trick is in presenting that awareness in such a manner that it is received for what it actually is, and not a direct frontal assault on their personal philosophical outlook. Goodness knows I have a lot of room for improvement in this category.
Anyway, I think we all feel a need to be correct. It doesn't make any logical, philosophical, or psychological sense to try to guide our lives from a determinedly incorrect position. How we gather and justify just what is right or not is where and when fallacies of logic enter the equation, with emotion being the most dominant culprit. Sadly, emotion trumps logic, everytime. Love is blind. So is rage.
Interesting topic, Paladin!
I hope ya'll won't mind I pulled a few quotes:
Good points, all. And yet I am left to wonder...are "you" not also defending a *right* position in making statements such as these?
I guess what I am trying to say, is that we all need some sense of right (correct) as opposed to wrong (incorrect). Open mindedness certainly has a place, especially within logic and reason, but I would caution against being so open minded that one's brains fall out. That too, is a fallacy. So logic, and reason, *are* a fine line / tightrope to walk. And sadly, in order to work correctly, both sides must agree to fundamental elements of an argument. Perhaps this is why in some subjects of argument (science vs. religion, for example), the opposing sides seem to be talking past each other, because neither is willing to allow the fundamental elements of the other side.
Another thing I have noticed, is that *average* people are not so moved by facts and figures as they are by emotional appeals. Emotonal appeals can easily be translated as logical fallacies. It does not have to be factual, it just has to sound good. (Look up "behaviorism", John B. Watson, and advertising psychology) Politicians use this to their advantage every voting season, it's around us in force right now. Bumper sticker soundbites are what the vast majority of the voting public will use to make their political decisions, not the *truth* contained in facts and figures. Logical fallacies bedamned.
And, in fairness, few people in my estimation are aware of, let alone functionally capable of noticing and calling out, logical fallacies. By the time I discovered the concept (and the *list*), I found I had uncovered a few of them on my own, but I was very surprized to learn how often I used fallacious reasoning, even to myself. I like to believe I have learned a great deal from that series of lessons, but I still catch myself from time to time. The difference being that now I am aware. So I think it's an important point to make others aware of their logical fallacies in their arguments, the trick is in presenting that awareness in such a manner that it is received for what it actually is, and not a direct frontal assault on their personal philosophical outlook. Goodness knows I have a lot of room for improvement in this category.
Anyway, I think we all feel a need to be correct. It doesn't make any logical, philosophical, or psychological sense to try to guide our lives from a determinedly incorrect position. How we gather and justify just what is right or not is where and when fallacies of logic enter the equation, with emotion being the most dominant culprit. Sadly, emotion trumps logic, everytime. Love is blind. So is rage.
)
False dilemma and false dichotomy not the same? Sorry--back to the classroom I go. (And this is something I should know, doing what I sometimes do for a living .)
: OOPS! I DID IT AGAIN!
