The second coming = WWJD

[wil]

There is only one church and that is the Church of Christ. ....These are my beliefs and I am not forcing anyone to accept it, it is their choice.

Ahhh...the only one true non denominational church with two djstinct branches of nondenomination. Do you find it interesting or hypocritical to be on an interfaith forum claiming the one true church when your church (that is split) amounts to one tenth of one percent of all the Christians in the world?

And since you chose to comment on this post, what do you think about what I posit...that every time you ask yourself WWJD you are putting Christ mind in your mind and my contentention that in this respect He has already returned in you?

Since your one church focuses on scripture... I got some for your consideration.

Galatians 2:20: "I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me." (NIV)

Colossians 1:27: "...to whom God has chosen to make known among the Gentiles the glorious riches of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory." (NIV)

Romans 8:10: "But if Christ is in you, then even though your body is subject to death because of sin, the Spirit gives life because of righteousness." (NIV)

2 Corinthians 13:5: "Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves. Do you not realize that Christ Jesus is in you—unless, of course, you fail the test?" (NIV)

*note idk which version of the Bible your one and only church uses as it appears that varies amongst the Churches of Christ since they don't have a denomination to dictate this ?

 

[wil]

Are you thinking of the Jesus in Bible stories

What other Jesus were you thinking I could be referring to in the context of my post?

are you thinking of some kind of historical Jesus, different from the one in Bible stories?

Is there one? Please provide links.

I'd be curious about examples of how you read the bible and what you have gotten out of it!

While there are some contained within this post and sprinkled thru out my thousands of posts on this site...if you have a particular verse I would be glad to contemplate and respond.

I believe interpretation is often personal, as our experiences in life are personal and our experience and thought process influences our perception...so if you asked me each decade since birth what a particular scripture means to me....the answer would often be varied.

"You cannot step twice into the same river." -
Heraclitus

I reserve the right to change my mind.Based on new information - Charles Fillmore

"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" - John Maynard Keynes

 

[Yahweh kid]

Ahhh...the only one true non denominational church with two djstinct branches of nondenomination. Do you find it interesting or hypocritical to be on an interfaith forum claiming the one true church when your church (that is split) amounts to one tenth of one percent of all the Christians in the world?

And since you chose to comment on this post, what do you think about what I posit...that every time you ask yourself WWJD you are putting Christ mind in your mind and my contentention that in this respect He has already returned in you?

Since your one church focuses on scripture... I got some for your consideration.

Galatians 2:20: "I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me." (NIV)

Colossians 1:27: "...to whom God has chosen to make known among the Gentiles the glorious riches of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory." (NIV)

Romans 8:10: "But if Christ is in you, then even though your body is subject to death because of sin, the Spirit gives life because of righteousness." (NIV)

2 Corinthians 13:5: "Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves. Do you not realize that Christ Jesus is in you—unless, of course, you fail the test?" (NIV)

*note idk which version of the Bible your one and only church uses as it appears that varies amongst the Churches of Christ since they don't have a denomination to dictate this ?

Not sure if you are suggesting that I am referring to a specific church, because you do find churches that uses the name Church of Christ..... I am referring to all the followers of Christ(as a whole) who base their faith on the Word with Him being our Shepherd. I don't care about a specific church or a denomination, I only care about the Word. When it comes to Bibles, your are correct there are many different translations/versions/etc. It does not necessary mean that the Message is different. I like to look at different translations when I do some research.

 

[Longfellow]

See .... 1 Corinthians 6:20 The wages/payment of sin is death, Jesus(who knew no sin) came to die on the cross so that we may have life. Jesus made the payment my friend for us.

I read the whole chapter again, and I’ll explain my understanding of what Paul is saying there. Before we accept Jesus as our lord, we are like slaves to the sinful side of human nature, just doing whatever our desires and impulses tell us to do, and making up excuses for it. What happened in the death of Jesus was like when the people of Israel paid a ransom to free some of its people who had been captured and enslaved by others. In this case we have been captured and enslaved by the sinful side of human nature, and in the death of Jesus was a ransom that was paid to release us into his kingdom.

I agree, repentance is linked to Salvation. “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness” Who are the "we" in this verse...... the believers in Christ. Will we get Salvation just by repentance or do we have to become believers first?.... John 3:16.

Maybe faith in Him is what makes it possible to truly repent.

 

[Longfellow]

I am referring to all the followers of Christ(as a whole) who base their faith on the Word with Him being our Shepherd. I don't care about a specific church or a denomination, I only care about the Word.

The only people who are called “Christians” in the Bible are the disciples in Antioch, and it isn’t Jesus or the apostles who are calling them that. It probably means “people who think that Jesus was the Christ.” It doesn’t say anything about what they are saying about Him, other than being a promised king of Israel.

 

[Ahanu]

He calls His gospel "gospel of the kingdom." What is your understanding of His teachings about the kingdom?

“The Kingdom of Heaven is within you." The kingdom is a state of consciousness. Christ-consciousness leads to an inside-out transformation. Not only does the one with Christ-consciousness transform herself, but she transforms society as a result of her active mode of being, transforming the world into a more and more beautiful rose garden.

See Ken Wilber's stages of consciousness over humanity's long evolutionary journey, which is built on Spiral Dynamics theory:

 

[Yahweh kid]

I read the whole chapter again, and I’ll explain my understanding of what Paul is saying there. Before we accept Jesus as our lord, we are like slaves to the sinful side of human nature, just doing whatever our desires and impulses tell us to do, and making up excuses for it. What happened in the death of Jesus was like when the people of Israel paid a ransom to free some of its people who had been captured and enslaved by others. In this case we have been captured and enslaved by the sinful side of human nature, and in the death of Jesus was a ransom that was paid to release us into his kingdom.

I agree.

Maybe faith in Him is what makes it possible to truly repent.

Amen

The only people who are called “Christians” in the Bible are the disciples in Antioch, and it isn’t Jesus or the apostles who are calling them that. It probably means “people who think that Jesus was the Christ.” It doesn’t say anything about what they are saying about Him, other than being a promised king of Israel.

Christians is a synonym for believers in Christ. (followers), God's children, the sheep, saints, the elect........ etc. Am I missing something here that you are trying to convey to me..... sorry, my english(second language) is horrible..

“people who think that Jesus was the Christ.”

Maybe people who thought and believed that Jesus was the Christ. (heart and mind)

 

[Longfellow]

Christians is a synonym for believers in Christ. (followers), God's children, the sheep, saints, the elect........ etc. Am I missing something here that you are trying to convey to me..... sorry, my english(second language) is horrible..

I'm not exactly sure what I was trying to convey. Maybe that what's important is not to be a Christian, because Jesus doesn't call His disciples "Christians." What's important is to be His disciple. Other people called the disciples Christians, but now many and possibly most people called Christians are not disciples, and I think that there are many disciples who are not called Christians. It has been that way from the time of Constantine, and maybe before that.

(later) Also, calling disciples of Jesus "Christians" is missing the point. Yes, they accept Jesus as a promised king of Israel, but that isn't the point. The reason that it matters that He is that king is that He is the one that God has appointed for us to serve and obey above all others.

 

[wil]

Not sure if you are suggesting that I am referring to a specific church, because you do find churches that uses the name Church of Christ..... I am referring to all the followers of Christ(as a whole) who base their faith on the Word with Him being our Shepherd.

Oh yes my bad, I see my mistake. When you said church of christ I thought you Meant church of christ...

 

[wil]

“The Kingdom of Heaven is within you." The kingdom is a state of consciousness. Christ-consciousness leads to an inside-out transformation. Not only does the one with Christ-consciousness transform herself, but she transforms society as a result of her active mode of being, transforming the world into a more and more beautiful rose garden.

I like this and like contemplating Ken Wilbur, def can't grok it all.

 

[Longfellow]

“The Kingdom of Heaven is within you." The kingdom is a state of consciousness. Christ-consciousness leads to an inside-out transformation. Not only does the one with Christ-consciousness transform herself, but she transforms society as a result of her active mode of being, transforming the world into a more and more beautiful rose garden.

I've been thinking of the ground for living the best life we can as an appreciating, nurturing kind of love for all of nature including all people everywhere, seeing the best possibilities in ourselves, in other people, in society and in the world around us, and wanting to help bring them out. I can see how a person could look at that saying of Jesus and think that He's talking about that, but looking at the larger context, I think that what He means by it is much more than that.

 

[TheLightWithin]

and there are thousands of denominations/versions/sects of Christianity, some of which point fingers at other sects saying they (the other) aren't Christian as they don't believe as we (whatever we) deem correct...and the finger pointing continues regarding belief.

Yup. How common it is to see the finger pointing and hear "oH yOu'Re nOt rEaLly ChRisTiAn yOu'Re hErEtIcS yOu'Re iN a cULt..." And on and on.
My grandfather's church thought ALL other churches were WRONG, and of COURSE his church would be dismissed as a cult, not for its cult like qualities, which were several and many, but for its heterodox doctrine and theology, no matter how well thought out. And on and on and on....

 

[Yahweh kid]

What's important is to be His disciple

Yes, we are called to be His disciples.

many and possibly most people called Christians are not disciples

Yes, true, but Christians are in all walks of life.... not all are called to be pastors or missionaries....My belief is that Jesus wants us to be fishers of men, to share the gospel wherever we might find ourselves (because He loves all people and we should strive to do the same), to represent Christ in our life (you know how critical the world is towards Christians, looking at their lives and say that they no different than the souls without Christ)... we are new creations, we have received the Holy Spirit and for us to know if we are truly a child of God, we have to ask ourselves, did we change from our old life, are we moving towards holiness (be holy as your Father is Holy) Do we see the fruits of the Spirit in our lives?

But yes, not every person calling himself a Christian is Saved...sad but true...referring to Matthew 7.

 

[Longfellow]

Yes, we are called to be His disciples.

Yes, true, but Christians are in all walks of life.... not all are called to be pastors or missionaries....My belief is that Jesus wants us to be fishers of men, to share the gospel wherever we might find ourselves (because He loves all people and we should strive to do the same), to represent Christ in our life (you know how critical the world is towards Christians, looking at their lives and say that they no different than the souls without Christ)... we are new creations, we have received the Holy Spirit and for us to know if we are truly a child of God, we have to ask ourselves, did we change from our old life, are we moving towards holiness (be holy as your Father is Holy) Do we see the fruits of the Spirit in our lives?

But yes, not every person calling himself a Christian is Saved...sad but true...referring to Matthew 7.

Thank you. I still feel like you're missing something in what I'm saying. I'd like to try to explain it better if that's okay with you.

When I say "disciples," I don't mean pastors and missionaries. The Bible does not call people who have been saved "Christians." it calls them "disciples," and it means something very different from what it means today when people call themselves and others "Christians."

 

[Longfellow]

Thank you. I still feel like you're missing something in what I'm saying. I'd like to try to explain it better if that's okay with you.

When I say "disciples," I don't mean pastors and missionaries. The Bible does not call people who have been saved "Christians." it calls them "disciples," and that means something very different from what it means today when people call themselves and others "Christians." That's why I'm saying that in my understanding, being a Christian is not what matters to Jesus. What matters to Him is being His disciples, learning together to live the way He says to live.

 

[Longfellow]

I accidentally replied to my own post and created new post with only that in it.

Yes, we are called to be His disciples.

Yes, true, but Christians are in all walks of life.... not all are called to be pastors or missionaries....My belief is that Jesus wants us to be fishers of men, to share the gospel wherever we might find ourselves (because He loves all people and we should strive to do the same), to represent Christ in our life (you know how critical the world is towards Christians, looking at their lives and say that they no different than the souls without Christ)... we are new creations, we have received the Holy Spirit and for us to know if we are truly a child of God, we have to ask ourselves, did we change from our old life, are we moving towards holiness (be holy as your Father is Holy) Do we see the fruits of the Spirit in our lives?

But yes, not every person calling himself a Christian is Saved...sad but true...referring to Matthew 7.

I thought of a different way of trying to explain what I'm thinking. There's a tradition in Israel of paying a ransom to redeem some people of Israel, meaning to free them from being captured and enslaved by others, but that freedom is not an end in itself, it's so that they can return to their life in the kingdom of Israel. I think of part of what Jesus did in the same way. Part of what I think He did was to offer himself as a ransom, to free us from captivity and slavery to the sinful part of our nature. Just like with people of Israel who were redeemed with a ransom payment, our salvation, our freedom from captivity to the sinful part of our nature, is not an end in itself, it is not for us to use any way we want to. It's so that we can enter God's kingdom, the kingdom ruled by His Son Jesus. Paul warned about that in some of his letters, that the freedom Jesus gives us is not to use any way we want to, it's to use in service and obedience to Him, to our Lord, to the one that God has ordained for us to serve and obey above all others. Salvation is not His end purpose for us, it's the beginning of learning to serve and obey Him, learning together to live the way He says to live.

That's what I mean by being a disciple. I don't know if you can see how different that is from what people mean today when they call themselves and others "Christians." I think that a person actually has to choose, do they want to be a Christian, or do they want to be a disciple of Jesus, because wanting and trying to be a Christian gets in the way of being a disciple.

(later) I should say, do they only want to be a Christian, or do they want what Jesus wants for them, to be one of His disciples? In the world today, being a Christian mostly only means having some beliefs about Jesus, but what I think He want for us is much, much more than that. What I think He wants for us is to be His disciples.

 

[wil]

I should say, do they only want to be a Christian, or do they want what Jesus wants for them, to be one of His disciples? In the world today, being a Christian mostly only means having some beliefs about Jesus, but what I think He want for us is much, much more than that. What I think He wants for us is to be His disciples.

I think.many want to be "in the club", like joining the masons so you can twist your ring towards the judge while sitting at.the defendents table. Maybe they wanna get into the heavenly hereafter club, they are askeered of the options and want to hedge their bets. Others join or stay because family or friends are there. Others for the camaraderie, refreshments or soup line...

No, they are not all disciples ...but my hope is they get something out of it that will benefit them and those they encounter.

The ones that decry the poor, or homeless or immigrant...obviously don't get it.

 

[Longfellow]

No, they are not all disciples ...but my hope is they get something out of it that will benefit them and those they encounter.

I imagine that sometimes they do, and I'm learning to appreciate that more than I have before.

 

[Ahanu]

but looking at the larger context, I think that what He means by it is much more than that.

Well, go on. Tell us. The suspense is killing me.

 

[Thomas]

sorry, my english (second language) is horrible..

Hey, @Yahweh kid – never realised that ... for 'horrible' you do well. I would have allowed more scope in my responses.