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Old 06-11-2009, 10:33 PM   #1 (permalink)
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4 Bible verses that support predestination

Rom 8:21-30 " For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified."

Rom 9:15-16 " For He says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion.”[a] 16 So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy."

Rom 9:21 "Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?"

Rom 9:11-13 "(for the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works but of Him who calls), 12 it was said to her,“The older shall serve the younger.”[a] 13 As it is written, “Jacob I have loved, but Esau I have hated.”
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Old 06-11-2009, 10:35 PM   #2 (permalink)
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4 Bible verses that oppose predestination

Matt 7:7 "Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you."

James 5:14 "Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord."

Gen 2:17 " but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.”

Gen 6:6 "And the LORD was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart."
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Old 06-11-2009, 10:49 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

Hi Sol,

I believe these are a good start, but should be kept within the same thread.

But I a curious, what are your thoughts on this "chess game"?

v/r

Q
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Old 06-11-2009, 11:09 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

It usually doesn't take too many punches in the nose for one to realize there is no predestination.
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Old 06-11-2009, 11:20 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

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Originally Posted by wil View Post
It usually doesn't take too many punches in the nose for one to realize there is no predestination.
Lol amen
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Old 06-11-2009, 11:24 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quahom1 View Post
Hi Sol,
I believe these are a good start, but should be kept within the same thread.
But I a curious, what are your thoughts on this "chess game"?
v/rQ
I like to know what other people are thinking.

Can I change the title to Bible verses that support and oppose predestination ?
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Old 04-16-2011, 09:53 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

Quote:
Originally Posted by wil View Post
It usually doesn't take too many punches in the nose for one to realize there is no predestination.
Impossible with human planning, predestination is a part of God's plan to glorify Himself (which is for our benefit.)

COOL IN CHRIST JESUS

When only God is truly good,
“I’m good”, how can I say?
Jealous to make a plan just right,
Our God has made the way.

Chorus:
Be cool in Christ Jesus.
Our righteousness, it really is,
Shine cool in Christ Jesus,
Not ours at all, but his.

In paradise, the plan began.
It’s how we’re made to live.
But we were bad and disobeyed.
Part 2 of the plan: forgive.

While we are chose’, we have free will.
The plan, our wise God made.
Do you accept the gift of God?
Be cool. Have your debt blood-paid.
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Old 03-09-2012, 05:37 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

John 1:12-13; 12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. (NKJV)

Did Abraham choose God? Did the apostle Paul have anything to do with His salvation? Did Jesus choose His disciples (hand picked), or did the disciples decide themselves to follow Christ?

Ephesians 1 5:6; 5 having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will, 6 to the praise of the glory of His grace, by which He made us accepted in the Beloved.(NKJV)

This debate has gone on for a long time and not many people will change their opinion on it. But I just wanted to through my two cents into it, I see more verses pertaining to God being 100% sovereign in our salvation. Believing that we had anything to do with salvation makes a co-author of it. God is the author of our salvation (Heb. 5:8; "He became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him,) But, I don't think God will be to0 angry with me if I give Him all the credit.

One more verse Numbers 16:5; 5 and he spoke to Korah and all his company, saying, “Tomorrow morning the Lord will show who is His and who is holy, and will cause him to come near to Him. That one whom He chooses He will cause to come near to Him.

I love you all, regardless. God's peace
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Old 11-23-2012, 03:24 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

I have questioned this topic myself for many years. The answer that I have come up with, is that predestination and "free will" work together. Is it not possible that God lays out the path for us, and it is our choice, "Free will" to go down the path laid before us, or to go our own way. Pilgrims progress style. I know in my own life I have see first had how Gods predetermined plan can be altered because of someones desire to go there own way. God still works things out for the good of those who love him, but its not the same as what it could have been. Plan A (Gods original way) and Plan B (the working out for the good). Perhaps I am in error here, but I have not seen anything to say to the contrary.
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Old 11-26-2012, 12:49 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

The Scriptures does teach predestination. but not the kind John Calvin taught.
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Old 11-26-2012, 03:42 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

Predestination just does not make a lot of sense. If it is true, the G-d is tricking us. Ditto with science (age of universe, evolution, quantum theory). Why would the L-rd give us a mind (or even for us to perceive anything) if mind and perception are stacked?
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Old 11-26-2012, 03:49 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

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Originally Posted by radarmark View Post
Predestination just does not make a lot of sense. If it is true, the G-d is tricking us. Ditto with science (age of universe, evolution, quantum theory). Why would the L-rd give us a mind (or even for us to perceive anything) if mind and perception are stacked?
Just because we don't understand something, does not necessarily mean it isn't true. God's ways and thoughts are much higher than man's.

John Calvin taught a false predestination. That God made some for heaven and the rest are doomed for hell. That is not what the Scriptures teaches. God in His sovereignty, being all knowing, knows who will accept Christ and who will not. Those who do, are predestined for all the promises and privileges that God has for them.
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Old 11-27-2012, 10:55 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

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Just because we don't understand something, does not necessarily mean it isn't true. God's ways and thoughts are much higher than man's.
Well then, how do we know then what God's ways are with regards to predestination?

For example, let's say a young Christian is sick in the hospital with cancer. Many people in her church will be praying for her to get better, perhaps even conducting a fundraiser to pay for future medical expenses. Yet, perhaps it is god's will (predestination) that she dies from cancer? Maybe the church members are going against god's will by trying to raise money to "cure" her cancer? How would one ever know if this were the case?
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:23 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

I think there's an error here, with regard to understanding the nature of God.

People assume that because God is Omniscient, He necessarily predestines all things to be as they are. Actually it's not necessary, nor even necessarily implied, by Omniscience.

God bless,

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Old 11-28-2012, 12:00 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Re: 4 Bible verses that support predestination

God's not Omniscient.
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