death is swallowed up

[mee]

Originally Posted by pattimax

You give the impression that your mind has not been transformed but molded or "fashioned".

yes my mind has been transformed, now i always look to Gods word the bible , and nolonger rely on my own thoughts, or the thoughts of this system of things . but some people do not like what the bible has to say. but for me the hope from the bible is great to look foreward to ,
How i long for the day when the benefits of Jesus’ ransom sacrifice are fully applied to obedient and faithful humankind!—Revelation 21:3, 4.

[mee]

Originally Posted by 17th Angel

JW's are the robotic sheep

I am not interested in that. I want to know what you think... You say you do it because you haven't a bible? or cannot remember bits of the bible? There is a bible on the watchtower site... Couldn't you quotes us a few verses and then say what they truly mean to you? Not what you are being told they mean to you.

yes we certainly are sheep , we are all putting our trust in the king Jesus christ , and we are welcoming Jesus as king of Gods kingdom .revelation 7;9-10 my vote is well and truely in the right place. along with others from all nations and tribes . yes to be one of the gathered ones is the thing to do in this time of the end. and if i ever stray from this great crowd of sheep i would be very lost indeed. and i might even get to be among a herd of goats . now that would be a bad place to be , because those who are goats will not get everlasting life . but the sheep will get everlasting life , so i know the right place to be it is with the sheep , and they are all listening to Jesus and they are also listening to the ones that Jesus is feeding . matthew 24;45-47 its great so back to the thread title , here is a verse to look foreward to .
With that I heard a loud voice from the throne say: "Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his peoples. And God himself will be with them. 4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away.................. revelation 21;3-4....... no more mourning, no more death.
(Revelation 7:17) because the Lamb, who is in the midst of the throne, will shepherd them, and will guide them to fountains of waters of life. And God will wipe out every tear from their eyes."

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by 17th Angel

IF man was made by god... IF. And they were supposed to all live on the Earth why do some go to heaven? "because they help rule!" Oh, so your god needs the help of people to rule?? If I ask another question... Why did jesus sacrafice himself? "Oh, because there needed to be a sacrafice equal to adam.... and then we can go back to how we were. And everything will carry on again from the garden of eden, back to normal!" ERM!?!! What about the sacrafice for Eve's sin? You need to sacrafice TWO perfect humans to make it equal... and to go back to normal??? Did it say in GEN; And god made the earth and gave it light blah blah blah and he saw it was good... THEN he made 144,000 men in heaven to help him rule because he couldn't do it alone.... ? No I don't think it does.... So putting 144,000 people in your heaven wouldn't put things back to how they were... It makes no freaking sense lol Why would such an almighty being need humans to help him rule?

Also one of the JW's main debates is Humans DO NOT go to heaven.. as they were not intended to live in heaven thats why there were angels they were ment to live there.... So erm... Then you change and contradict yourselves and say Oh wait these guys can go in... yeah I know we said humans are meant to be earth creatures but erm OH LOOK OVER THERE!!

One last thing Mee..... If we go by your story... Awesome we all live forever.... and ever and ever and ever.... *sighs..* and.. ever. We are meant to breed and spread over the earth but none of us are dying... Get a glass... Fill it halfway... Then leave it under a tap that has a little leak, watch as each water drop, drops into that glass... untill finally? It fills and over flows.... Then what happens?

Eve was disilliusioned. Adam, knowingly sinned (he ate the fruit knowing he was throwing his lot in with woman, he chose Woman over God, and God granted that, because God knew man and woman would have to learn together, to come back to Him). There is where you are having trouble 17th. There is no equals in humanity when it comes to original sin. Man knew better. Woman did not. But since woman is tied in with man, she shares all rewards and all consequences. Man on the other hand has the burden, and God will hold him accountable first.

I noticed something when I entertained my son and his new wife, this past Christmas holiday. It wasn't her that I became irritated with (for certain indisgressions), it was him. He knew better, but let things slide. I on the other hand did not. And I held him accountable.

We had a long talk, on his responsibilities as a man, a lover and a husband, one night over a game of chess. Now he realizes he is the head of the marriage, for a reason. She seemed quite happy with that new found revelation, of her husband's and he looked at me in pleased shock, but also responsible understanding.

What does this have to do with God and co-rulership? God wants people who look out for eachother, and look to Him for guidance.

Lol, I once asked my mother (as a teen), if God watched while she went to the bathroom..."Of course He does, just to make certain everything comes out alright". I pushed the envelope, "What about sex? Does He watch that with you and Dad?" She smiled.

"If you think God is a pervert, you have the wrong God. If it weren't for God, watching and making sure everything worked out right, you wouldn't be here to ask such silly questions."

She is right of course. God is so far beyond us, the act of sex is not something He would even consider, let alone be "voyeuristic" on. (which means the angels that took women to be wives aren't much better than men). So much for Lucifer and his minions' superiority over man, to be smitten by or lust after a human woman?...

As far as Paradise on Earth, there is a point where the old earth and the old heaven pass away, a new Earth and New Heaven are created...I'm not so sure what that means, but I do know that new babies are not created. And those that exist to see this new "universe" are not married, don't worry about perptuating the species, etc...

But relationships seem to survive, and bring a greater if not similar intenseness, to intimacy, again I do not quite understand this. And then there is God...to stand before Him, to have Him nod in one's direction. To be as a child again, and jump into the lap of the greatest of fathers...What a thought.

Indeed, what a wonder.

v/r

Joshua

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by mee

yes we certainly are sheep , we are all putting our trust in the king Jesus christ , and we are welcoming Jesus as king of Gods kingdom .revelation 7;9-10 my vote is well and truely in the right place. along with others from all nations and tribes . yes to be one of the gathered ones is the thing to do in this time of the end. and if i ever stray from this great crowd of sheep i would be very lost indeed. and i might even get to be among a herd of goats . now that would be a bad place to be , because those who are goats will not get everlasting life . but the sheep will get everlasting life , so i know the right place to be it is with the sheep , and they are all listening to Jesus and they are also listening to the ones that Jesus is feeding . matthew 24;45-47 its great so back to the thread title , here is a verse to look foreward to .
With that I heard a loud voice from the throne say: "Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his peoples. And God himself will be with them. 4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away.................. revelation 21;3-4....... no more mourning, no more death.
(Revelation 7:17) because the Lamb, who is in the midst of the throne, will shepherd them, and will guide them to fountains of waters of life. And God will wipe out every tear from their eyes."

i'm not a sheep. I'm a man who knows His protector. But I also know He expects me to protect, in His name (and He empowers me to do so). So if however, there are only "sheep", then I am a "Ram". Watch out for my damned horns and head butting ability. I can gut a wolf or a wildcat, and I can knock another senseless with a single blow. The "Shepard" needs no dog to round up the rest, because I can. If I fall, then the "Shepard" I will depend on to pick me up.

maybe that is what alot of us are...Rams.

[pattimax]

God created sex.

[mee]

Originally Posted by Quahom1

i'm not a sheep. I'm a man who knows His protector. But I also know He expects me to protect, in His name (and He empowers me to do so). So if however, there are only "sheep", then I am a "Ram". Watch out for my damned horns and head butting ability. I can gut a wolf or a wildcat, and I can knock another senseless with a single blow. The "Shepard" needs no dog to round up the rest, because I can. If I fall, then the "Shepard" I will depend on to pick me up.

maybe that is what alot of us are...Rams.

each to their own ,but i am trying my best to be a sheep that listens to Jesus .
And I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; those also I must bring, and they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock, one shepherdJohn 10;16

[mee]

Originally Posted by pattimax

God created sex.

Gen. 1:28: "God blessed them [Adam and Eve] and God said to them: ‘Be fruitful and become many and fill the earth.’" (Fulfilling this divine command would require that they have sexual relations, would it not? Doing so would not be sinful but would be in harmony with God’s purpose for the populating of the earth. ........... nice

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by pattimax

God created sex.

Yeah, he he...He did.

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by mee

each to their own ,but i am trying my best to be a sheep that listens to Jesus .
And I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; those also I must bring, and they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock, one shepherdJohn 10;16

No, Mee, You just got done telling the rest of the Christians on CR that our God is not a God, that your god is the true god, and the rest of us are full of crap. You don't get off that easy. It is called, an apology.

Maybe you are wayward. Or maybe you are simply proud. In any event I know you will never apologize. You can't. You are incapable, and that separates you from the rest of those who call themselves "Christian".

[Silas]

Originally Posted by pattimax

God created sex.

No He did not! Sex is evil and should only be used for pro-creation! OK, Im just kiddin!! I can image some of you guy' faces. You probably look like this: LOL!! Nah, seriously though, God created sex for many reasons, none of which I think is for procreation. God is infinite in wisdom and could have made us to procreate any other way - but He didnt. That shows me there is design in it! Why did God make sex to be so enjoyable? Surely, it isnt by accident that sex is so great and wonderful! God did this! But why? I heard a great sermon about why and the crux of it had to do with the fact that God uses sex as a means or picture, that we can in human language, describe how amazing it will be to be in a right standing with God. The intimacy and extacy and peasure that we feel in sex, at its zenith, are only but small glories that points to a greater glory; indeed the greatest glory. Namely, the Glory of God in Jesus Christ.

John Piper is an amazing preacher. Listen to the sermon here and here. The sermons are called "Sex and the Supremacy of Christ 1 and 2, and they are designed to help you guard agaisnt sexual immorality.

[Silas]

Originally Posted by mee

each to their own ,but i am trying my best to be a sheep that listens to Jesus .
And I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; those also I must bring, and they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock, one shepherdJohn 10;16

Isnt that an oxymoron? I mean, what makes people sheep isnt that they try to listen to Jesus. Rather, sheep listen because they are sheep. If you are trying to listen, its because your god is an idol. I'm sure this has to do with the fact that you believe Jesus to be a created being, and an angel. Jesus' sheep listen to His voice and they follow Him. They arent perfect and they could be foolish at times, but they know their sheperd's voice and follow Him.

[mee]

Originally Posted by Quahom1

No, Mee, You just got done telling the rest of the Christians on CR that our God is not a God, that your god is the true god, and the rest of us are full of crap. You don't get off that easy. It is called, an apology.

Maybe you are wayward. Or maybe you are simply proud. In any event I know you will never apologize. You can't. You are incapable, and that separates you from the rest of those who call themselves "Christian".

i only put over what the bible says , as the bible itself says ,your word is truth John 17;17 if in other peoples eyes that is being wayward then so be it . i will never apologize for sticking to Gods word the bible .why would i feel that i need to do that.? being faithful to the God of the bible is more important to me than going along with the majority .people tell me on this forum i am misled but i dont make a big deal out of it because i know that i am on the right road . knowing the truth does not mean that a pesron is proud but i would agree that knowing the truth seperates me from the rest .i cant remember telling anyone that their God is c..... i dont do that. i just put over my bible based beliefs.

[mee]

Originally Posted by Silas

Isnt that an oxymoron? I mean, what makes people sheep isnt that they try to listen to Jesus. Rather, sheep listen because they are sheep. If you are trying to listen, its because your god is an idol. I'm sure this has to do with the fact that you believe Jesus to be a created being, and an angel. Jesus' sheep listen to His voice and they follow Him. They arent perfect and they could be foolish at times, but they know their sheperd's voice and follow Him.

yes i agree they do know the shepherds voice , but those sheep can be led astray if they do not stay close to the shepherd ,and take on board what the shepherd says . if the sheep do not listen to Jesus they would not be sheep at all .
(Luke 9:35) And a voice came out of the cloud, saying: "This is my Son, the one that has been chosen. Listen to him.".................... yes ,my God who is Jehovah psalm 83;18 said listen to Jesus . no idols in sight for me

[Silas]

Exactly! If sheep dont listen to Jesus, they arent sheep! If you listened to Jesus, you'd worship Him and dare not call a man who spoke as Jesus did, a created being. For speaking the way He did, Jesus is either a Liar, Lunatic, or Lord and God. That is the trilemma you are unwilling to face because you have pride and are happy to trust in your own righteousness rather than admitting that you have no goodness in you and that you need to let Christ' righteous be yours. You are like the religous Jews of Jesus' day - you stumble over Jesus and do not trust in Him alone. You have pride and before God its an abomination. You should repent of all your good works and see that before God they are nothing but excrement. Repent and Trust in Jesus alone that God may get the Glory and you may be saved ONLY by grace and NOTHING in you at all. Admit that you deserve Hell and fall to Jesus' feet and beg Him to save you. He will if you admit your need for Him and desier to follow Him!

[mee]

Originally Posted by Silas

Exactly! If sheep dont listen to Jesus, they arent sheep!

very true, they would more than likely be goats.
in the bible Goats were used to represent people, often those in opposition to Jehovah.
In Jesus’ illustration of the sheep and the goats, the goats represent those persons who refuse to do good to the least of his brothers.—Mt 25:31-46.