Evangelical minister stops believing in hell and gets fired

[wil]

Namaste Earl, yeah he lost that flock and will surely gain another. Some folks grow over time, appears he is one of them.

Originally Posted by Quahom1

Indeed Earl. Jesus talks more about hell, then He does about heaven...and what He says is "Don't go there"...

Originally Posted by shadowman

this isnt true, he talks mostly about having a relationship with his father, and the kingdom of heaven.....

I think the actual stat for Jesus is closer to six times as much heaven talk as hell talk! Love and forgiveness are higher then condemnation as well... Peace more than violence or retribution, someday we may consider following this guys path, he had some good ideas! The wonder of the computer... we no longer have to rely on someone elses stats or have our clerks and scribes sit and count for hours on end...simple word searches will do. However even the word search can be distorted as sometimes the essence of the subject is brought up without the actual word. Despite this, the old fire and brimstone thought has been put to bed.

Hell is used 54 times in the KJV Bible , 15 times in the gospels.
Heaven is used 582 in the KJV Bible, 143 times in the gospels.

Always interesting to me how the Jews have not the hell afterlife we Christians hold so dear, yet it is their writings, their books we use to prove it so...

[Dondi]

Originally Posted by earl

Yes I do believe in "hellish" states, but like you, I don't think they're quite what many evangelicals/fundamentalists make them out to be. I think they are as has so often been described in near death experiences such as:
Earthbound - near-death experiences

Interesting quote on that website:

Near-death accounts show that the hell realms in the spirit world are actually the spiritual/mental manifestations of spiritual conditions that humans create within themselves while on earth.

It sorta give new light to the story of the rich man and Lazarus. However, I still think that these "hellish" experiences are indicative of the spiritual condition person in relationship (or lack thereof) with God, or at least the spiritual principles of love that God has set forth. Regardless of whether hell exists on a physical level, the implication is that there is something wrong with the spiritual state of that person which somehow or another needs to be rectified. What you sow is what you are going to reap.

[Basstian]

Loads of questions in my mind here from a Christian told
if you do/dont do that your going to hell
--- Aww but your saved and no-one shall pluck you out of His hand its called grace my friend
--- wait a minute buddy you live like that your name could be blotted out of the lambs book of life
--- which wont matter anyway Christ will establish his kingdom here on earth and heaven will decend because the wicked will never inherit the earth
--- But we will be caught up in the clouds to meet him and so we shall ever be with the Lord amen.

*pffts in Disgust*

Life and the eternity of it are not like a Jigsaw puzzle where you look at t picture and know what the outcome is before you even start. If the Lord really wanted us to know exactly how it will all work in the future after death it would not be all shrouded in the mystery.

Despite how you believe Christ is the answer to salvation.

This guy studied and found what to him is a truth. Cheers for him for not standing behind a pulpit teaching something he doesnt believe with all his heart... The Bible is for no mans pirvate interpertaion and yet so many have done just that and then lead a million people to believe what they have wrong.
I dont wanna believe my dad is watching down over me like a little angel I dont wanna believe that his dad who drank beat his wife and kids and said there was no God till his dieing day is being toasted like a marshmellow over a campfire.
What I choose to believe is this God has it worked out and when I Die I trust Him to be fair and merciful and longsuffering and full of grace.

SO I work out my own salvation with fear and trembling.

[wil]

Namaste Basstian,

I'd like to stand in the back of the room and do my BB impersonation banging my staff on the floor in applause while participating in the general murmur.

"Here...here"

[Eclectic Mystic]

I thought hell meant seperation from God. And I thought God is all there is.

[Snoopy]

God may indeed be all there is.

Anyway, hi EM and welcome to CR

I can’t see that you’ve done the formal boring intro thing so can I ask: are you a Discordian or do you just like the Sacred Chao symbol?

(I’m not a lionfish, I just like the picture).

Snoopy.

[Snoopy]

Originally Posted by Tao_Equus

Tennants : the No.1 best selling Scottish lager.

(just for information)

Is this to wash the deep-fried Mars bars down?

(just to be naughty)

s.

[seattlegal]

Originally Posted by Snoopy

Is this to wash the deep-fried Mars bars down?

(just to be naughty)

s.

Deep fried twinkies.

[flowperson]

The real stuff !

flow....

Twinkies &

Coke

[pattimax]

Originally Posted by flowperson

The real stuff !

flow....

Attachment 595 Twinkies &

Attachment 596 Coke

The preservatives will guarantee a half-life. (atomically speaking)

[pattimax]

Originally Posted by wil

Always interesting to me how the Jews have not the hell afterlife we Christians hold so dear, yet it is their writings, their books we use to prove it so...

I have always been puzzled why they insist on being separate.

[pattimax]

Originally Posted by pattimax

I have always been puzzled why they insist on being separate.

Oops. Scratch that. The thought is there, but the words don't convey it.

A profound statement- before Christ there were no Christians. All writings were Jewish.

[flowperson]

Originally Posted by pattimax

Oops. Scratch that. The thought is there, but the words don't convey it.

A profound statement- before Christ there were no Christians. All writings were Jewish.

Hi Karen...The atomic halflife principle has to do with radioactive substances. Do radioheads figure into your definition ? Actually I was just going with the FLOW of previous posts. I mostly do veggies, fruits, and grains these days. Can't remember my last Twinkie & Coke, raw or deep fried.

Well the Jews and Hebrews did have the concept of "sheol" which was a very dark place that they didn't want to go to after death. Maybe Dauer or BB could expound a bit on that. And there were other forms of writing around at the first time of Jesus. Aramaic comes to mind here, and much of what he said and did was probably written in Aramaic, since that's what he and the apostles likely spoke.

This stuff was later transcribed into Hebrew, Greek, Coptic Egyptian, etc. And the earliest Christians, except for those in Rome, probably weren't as dualistic in their beliefs as the language in the Bible ended up to be around 400 ad after all of the objectionable stories were banished by the Roman Church.

The Christian group under James in Jerusalem, which was oriented towards the continuation of Jewish beliefs, was all but destroyed in 70 ad by the Romans. Gnostic writings were about the only ones that were based upon a concept of "knowing" a unity of beliefs, and that's the stuff that got banished and excluded from the Christian knowledge base over the first 400 year of Christianity. These are also reasons why early Christianiy also came to depend so much upon the Pauline writings in the earlier years

flow....

[pattimax]

Originally Posted by flowperson

Hi Karen...The atomic halflife principle has to do with radioactive substances. Do radioheads figure into your definition ? Actually I was just going with the FLOW of previous posts. I mostly do veggies, fruits, and grains these days. Can't remember my last Twinkie & Coke, raw or deep fried.

Gnostic writings were about the only ones that were based upon a concept of "knowing" a unity of beliefs, and that's the stuff that got banished and excluded from the Christian knowledge base over the first 400 year of Christianity. These are also reasons why early Christianiy also came to depend so much upon the Pauline writings in the earlier years

flow....

Hey flow,

It is so nice to hear that you are taking care of yourself. A diet regularly consisting of paint remover and lard is definitely a bad health move. Although I do like flavored cream in coffee and those preservatives have saved me more than once. There is probably some sitting on my counter right now that needs to go back in the fridge.

Radio heads can dramatically alter the outcome of the equation. It’s even possible to replace half life with eternal life. You just have to know where to land.

I guess I should have clarified my answer. Actually I was referring to writings concerning the living God. Jews were very good about that.

As for Paul and early Christianity, he was personally chosen by God. Do you think maybe that had something to do with it?

Is “knowing a unity of beliefs” more important than eternal life? Healthy food for thought.

Grace to You, Karen

[flowperson]

Hi Karen...

As far as Paul goes, the Biblical stories seem to point to that, but all that I really know is that Paul was transformed, wrote what he wrote, and lay down foundations of belief for early Christianity.

Yes, I even believe that declaring future needs for human unity was the whole point of Jesus' first visit. He showed us through the imagery of His deeds and sometimes confusing linguistic word play... and in no uncertain terms... that a unity of humankind in the future was going to be necessary in order to defeat death and enter into the "kingdom".

Just my two cents.
Better check your counters.

flow....