How Come Christians Do Not Follow The Violent Verses?

[MattWolf]

Originally Posted by Faithfulservant

Thats the thing though.. Christianity is so diverse because they are followers of Christ.

Ive always been taught this.. that the OT and its laws was Gods way for preparing the world for Jesus Christ.. To show the impossibility of being good enough on our own merit.. To show that we needed a savior and that there was atonement that needed to be made.. Sin is essentially disobedience to God.. And like any father on earth they discipline their children when that child is disobedient because that child needs to learn that their father is trying to show them right from wrong. Christ is that atonement.. he was the whipping boy for us so that we didnt need to pay for our sins.. There is no more need for OT sacrifices.. Christ was the ultimate and final sacrifice. If we bind ourselves to the OT we are binding ourselves from everything that Christ came to do.. He came to free us. He came to show us that we are saved by grace and not by works.. The grace of God and not OT laws.

This is a common misunderstanding, in my opinion. Yes, the need for sacrifices ended. But there is a bigger matter involved than any of this.

When Christ died, the veil to the Holy of Holies was supernaturally torn. This was not merely a divine attempt to dramatize the moment. The main point of Jesus was to remove the intermediary role of the priesthood. Man was no longer required to look to earthly mediation with God -- was no longer required to follow their rules and declarations. Just as importantly, he is also no longer protected by doing so!

This is WHY sacrifices were no longer required. The priesthood had lost its authority over man, and their administration of sacrifices, etc. was obsolete. Because man could now commune directly with the Creator, and answer directly to Him. Conscience, conviction, love -- things that could not be faked or regulated by anyone -- these were the regulators of one's spiritual state.

Yes, Christ freed us from the requirements doled out by men. He freed us from conformism. Freed us from the idea that we were not individually worthy of God's time and attention. Freed us to work out our own salvation humbly before Him. But the story of Jesus is not simply a dismissal of the Old Testament or its values. On the contrary, evil remains evil and good remains good. We are still to avoid one and persue the other. The difference is that Christ showed us how to do this with passionate conviction instead of the reluctant or vain conformity that was encouraged while under the priesthood's abuse of the divine authority granted them.

In my humble opinion, the constant reiteration that "mankind is no longer under the law, because Christ fulfilled it all" misses the point, and can become something of a distraction away from the many vital aspects of Christ's sacrifice.

[Silverbackman]

Originally Posted by Dor

Does that statement mean you follow all the verses of Quran such as
24:2 Strike the adulteress and the adulterer one hundred times. Do not let compassion for them keep you from carrying out God’s law—if you believe in God and the Last Day—and ensure that a group of believers witnesses the punishment.
4:34 Men are in charge of women, because Allah hath made the one of them to excel the other, and because they spend of their property (for the support of women). So good women are the obedient, guarding in secret that which Allah hath guarded. As for those from whom ye fear rebellion, admonish them and banish them to beds apart, and scourge them. Then if they obey you, seek not a way against them. Lo! Allah is ever High, Exalted, Great.
5:38 Cut off the hands of thieves, whether they are male or female, as punishment for what they have done—a deterrent from God: God is almighty and wise.
5:33 Indeed, the punishment of those who fight Allah and His Messenger and who go around corrupting the land is to be killed, crucified, have their hands and feet cut off on opposite sides, or to be banished from the land. That is a disgrace for them in this life, and in the life to come theirs will be a terrible punishment.

Just a few examples most muslims I know do not do today!

Yea, but the Bible has many violent verses such as you must kill anyone that does not follow your God, Kill adulterers, Kill homosexuals, ect. in the first 5 books Of course as someone here mentioned Jesus said you don't even have to follow the law anymore, however many Christians still do. What I don't get is that they will follow some verses of the first 5 books but not these violent verses. What difference does it make if muslims do those things? I think in general Christians have done even more harm in the past to people in the name of religion *cough cough* The Spanish *cough cough* the British.

There was one religion though that Christian colonials could not destroy. They managed to convert all the natives in the Americas, all the Africans they came in contact with, and any Chinese that they got in control of in Northern China. However they could not destroy hinduism, thankfully.

[MattWolf]

Originally Posted by Silverbackman

Yea, but the Bible has many violent verses such as you must kill anyone that does not follow your God, Kill adulterers, Kill homosexuals, ect. in the first 5 books Of course as someone here mentioned Jesus said you don't even have to follow the law anymore, however many Christians still do. What I don't get is that they will follow some verses of the first 5 books but not these violent verses. What difference does it make if muslims do those things? I think in general Christians have done even more harm in the past to people in the name of religion *cough cough* The Spanish *cough cough* the British.

There was one religion though that Christian colonials could not destroy. They managed to convert all the natives in the Americas, all the Africans they came in contact with, and any Chinese that they got in control of in Northern China. However they could not destroy hinduism, thankfully.

You are a troll. Go away.

[Dor]

Originally Posted by Silverbackman

I think in general Christians have done even more harm in the past to people in the name of religion *cough cough* The Spanish *cough cough* the British.

The key word there is Christians...if you ask most Christians the atrocities done in the name of Christ were not by true Christians just men who called themselves Christian. As Christ himself said:
Mat 7:22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?:23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

I am not about to say some so-called "Christians" have done much harm to people and to Christianity itself. They by no means are alone in that aspect I can think of one of the top of my head where the "leader" not only tells his people to kill non believers but also did it himself. That is one thing Christians can say some people have done terrible things in the name of Christ but Jesus never told them to and he never set an example for them too.

[Faithfulservant]

I believe bad things happen but I believe God makes good things come from the bad.. I believe that God allows the bad so He can work the good for His will. It goes along with acts done by Christians.. we can never know what God had planned and how it might have affected things.. Satan only has so much control over things.. ultimately God wins forever.


BTW Matt nice post. We should never trivialize what Christ did for us.

I look at this thread as another means to criticize Christianity.. Christ said that the world hated Him first.. and everytime I see criticism and scoffing I praise the Lord because the day will come when the world will bow down before Him and pronounce Him King.

[AbdAlRahman]

I dont see any problem on the bible having violent verses , but what the problem is that christians say that the Qu'Ran is nothing but violence and terrorism , so i think who ever sais that should know that also the bible has violent verses , evin thout it has SOME vilonence you cannot judge the book by those verses .

[juantoo3]

Kindest Regards, Silverbackman, and welcome to CR!

What difference does it make if muslims do those things?

It makes a great deal of difference. The whole "pot calling the kettle black" thing.

What this discussion tells me is that no one of any religion has all of the answers. We are imperfect, all of us. If it were not so, why would we need religion to begin with?

So, I am in agreement with those here who are leaning towards thinking you are attempting to stir trouble. Afterall, would it be proper to post a similar thread in the Islam board, or anywhere else for that matter?

A great deal hinges on your intent. If yours is a sincere question, and you are looking for sincere answers, then by all means proceed. If, on the other hand, this is some attempt to try to demonstrate superiority of one faith over another, I think this is inappropriate.

All faiths have believers who understand on varying levels of understanding. Christianity calls this "denominations." Others use different terms, but the principle remains. There are what, 3 major and several minor variations among Islam? Which tells me that Muslims do not follow, as you implied earlier, the Koran "literally." If they did, there would be no factionalism.

Since there is factualism, among not only Islam but all faiths, it is hardly fair or constructive, to dwell on the factionalism in Christianity. How can one possibly point a finger at someone else if they are equally guilty in the eyes of God?

I would think it is far more constructive to focus on where we agree, and to see our disagreements as not worth fighting over. Otherwise, by psyching yourself into a frenzy over dogmatic differences, you are continuing the same old worn out song and dance that leads to religious warfare. And you cannot logically expect anyone, Christian or otherwise, to not defend themselves from aggression.

My two cents.

[AbdAlRahman]

Actully every question about the Qu'Ran can be answered.

[Quahom1]

This thread serves no purpose but to raise hackles. So rather than people becoming agressive on this issue (and towards eachother), this thread is locked until the Administration here at CR decides how to proceed.

v/r

Quahom1