I agree that humans are really screwed up - Page 2

Dondi · 04-30-2007, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 17th Angel

So the gems of mankind... (heroes) That don't believe in god... They have used "their gift" of freewill... deserve hell? Course they don't.... They have done every... no more than they could possible have done in situations and still at any moment try hard.... The only thing they have done "wrong" is that they haven't accepted your god? Bad men... bad bad bad men.... please.

Not saying that there aren't men who have done noble things apart from God. Our makeup is through our various experiences, learning, background, and relationships that have been forged, good or bad. Not saying that man cannot do "any" good, in and of himself. But we are just not that good enough. When God made us, He not only called it good, but very good. He made us in His Image. Only that image has been tarnished. Yet there is an element of brilliance underneath that has the potential to shine. But only God has the means of removing that tarnish, to restore us to our original condition. It is impossible for us to do it alone. Perfection can only come from Someone who is perfect. You cannot calibrate an instrument without a standard.

17th Angel · 04-30-2007, 03:03 PM

When my face was "tarnished" as a kid... My grandmother, wouldn't hesitate in grabbing that hanky giving it a lick and rubbing my face like she was sanding down a rough 2x4.... Can't god do that? Just grab that old hanky give it a good spit then grasp you by the face and give it a nice clean?

Dondi · 04-30-2007, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 17th Angel

When my face was "tarnished" as a kid... My grandmother, wouldn't hesitate in grabbing that hanky giving it a lick and rubbing my face like she was sanding down a rough 2x4.... Can't god do that? Just grab that old hanky give it a good spit then grasp you by the face and give it a nice clean?

Not if you keep running away from Granny.

17th Angel · 04-30-2007, 03:15 PM

You can't run!!! I never seen an old person move so fast... If they ain't wipping their grandchilds face with spit, or getting pension or an award... They aren't fast... but if any of the above? Stand back... There's a hurricane coming through.

wil · 04-30-2007, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss Amy

I will not believe it, I honestly believe that we create the screwed up people. If we follow what is true and right we are all making a difference in the world.

Hey, that's what gets me out of bed in the morning...

Amen.

Nameste Amy,

It is our job to see the good in everyone...and in that way assist in raising them to their highest potential.

Every encounter we have with another spiritual being in this physical experience either leaves them feeling better about themselves and the world or worse...we either raise their consciousness and awarness and goodness or as you say...assist in creating mre screwed up people!

tis free will, our free will, our choice to act like Ghandi, like Mother Theresa, or like Hitler....yes extreme opposite ends of the spectrum....but we choose to either support growth in one another....or kill it.

If we are trying to grow a rose bush...when it doesn't bloom doesn't grow as we like...we prune it, train it, fertilize it, water it....we don't beat it, yell at it, or put it in jail.

The question is....with our thoughts, words and actions are we currently creating a better world...supporting growth in those around us...or supressing it?

Dondi · 04-30-2007, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 17th Angel

You can't run!!! I never seen an old person move so fast...

Especially if they have hold of your pinchable cheeks.

17th Angel · 04-30-2007, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondi

Especially if they have hold of your pinchable cheeks.

With that iron tight grasp ;\

Miss Amy · 04-30-2007, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wil

Amen.

Nameste Amy,

It is our job to see the good in everyone...and in that way assist in raising them to their highest potential.

Every encounter we have with another spiritual being in this physical experience either leaves them feeling better about themselves and the world or worse...we either raise their consciousness and awarness and goodness or as you say...assist in creating mre screwed up people!

tis free will, our free will, our choice to act like Ghandi, like Mother Theresa, or like Hitler....yes extreme opposite ends of the spectrum....but we choose to either support growth in one another....or kill it.

If we are trying to grow a rose bush...when it doesn't bloom doesn't grow as we like...we prune it, train it, fertilize it, water it....we don't beat it, yell at it, or put it in jail.

The question is....with our thoughts, words and actions are we currently creating a better world...supporting growth in those around us...or supressing it?

I would like to say we are supporting growth, but I cannot. The systems that are around us, are suppression. I think that you can only change the world a person at a time though.

wil · 04-30-2007, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss Amy

I would like to say we are supporting growth, but I cannot. The systems that are around us, are suppression. I think that you can only change the world a person at a time though.

And isn't it funny that the only person we can change and the only person we need to change is ourselves yet so often the first person and the second and the third....the people we want to change is always someone else!!!

Miss Amy · 04-30-2007, 05:04 PM

Hey hey now. I don't mean change as much as mean share, encourage, care for. Remember that I approach everything as someone who cares for children.

pattimax · 04-30-2007, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 17th Angel

You can't run!!! I never seen an old person move so fast... If they ain't wipping their grandchilds face with spit, or getting pension or an award... They aren't fast... but if any of the above? Stand back... There's a hurricane coming through.

But God is very different. Not only is he where you left, he is also where you are running to. Granny has nothing on God.

pattimax · 04-30-2007, 07:30 PM

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Forgot to capitalize He's. Pretty important oversight.

cyberpi · 04-30-2007, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wil

tis free will, our free will, our choice to act like Ghandi, like Mother Theresa, or like Hitler....yes extreme opposite ends of the spectrum....but we choose to either support growth in one another....or kill it.

If we are trying to grow a rose bush...when it doesn't bloom doesn't grow as we like...we prune it, train it, fertilize it, water it....we don't beat it, yell at it, or put it in jail.

The question is....with our thoughts, words and actions are we currently creating a better world...supporting growth in those around us...or supressing it?

If a person comes after me or a neighbor with pruning sheers, fertilizer, a water hose, or other gardening tools (pitchfork, spade, sickle) despite my best efforts to deter them then they will be laid out cold on their back, weapons removed, probably restrained, and then we'll have a conversation on the difference between a rose bush and a person. Big difference.

If that person can't handle hearing my judgment then he will not be walking away with the rightfully confiscated garden tools. The tools will be given to someone else who knows how to use them. The town, city, state... anyone who will listen will know of the incident. If the person hears me and repents then they will not only have their garden tools back but I will invite them to dinner as well.

I have yet to see a rose bush that wilts or doubles over from hearing words, but it seems as if some people pretend to double over being tortured by hearing someone else's judgment in words. Perhaps a person prefers to train their own children with shock collars, pruning sheers, and corporal punishment. Words and tools are complete opposites. 'Judge' and 'condemn' are polar opposites. One adds and one subtracts. Words do not remove from a person... they add. Undesired pruning tools do not add to a person... they remove. A person can remove the words he hears and ignore them, but a person can not add back what has been pruned. The librarian that prunes a library is a book burner... Hitler and friends were fans of censorship. Sure the Nazis had effective propaganda, but it was because they pruned back their opposition.

The greek words: krites, krino, krisis, krima, katadikazo, and katakrino are different words for a reason. So are the words judge and condemn. The world has twisted condemnation to mean judgment and a Judge to be a condemner... untwisting them in the Gospel may prove beneficial for someone who wishes to hear, learn, and thus avoid continuous judgment. If a word hurts then it is because God hears it and does something with it... or maybe because it is too many decibels over and it damages the ear.

shadowman · 05-01-2007, 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quahom1

If we are talking about a God that is creator of all, then it is God's game, and God's rules. It has also been said that it is not God who sends man to hell, man does of his own accord. God states over and over that He want's man to be with Him forever...if man says no, then God says "ok", and man (not God) seperates himself from the Creator.

Forgiveness is not for the benefit of the transgressor, but rather for the one who has been transgressed. Because if he cannot forgive (or refuses to forgive), the rot of the wrong festers within his soul. Yes the transgressor may or may not suffer from the wrong inflicted upon another...but the one transgressed who cannot forgive is destroyed inside, by his own rage.

Likewise, if the transgressor refuses to accept forgiveness, he too is destroyed from within.

Indeed, man is in charge of his own destiny, but even destiny has rules that must be played by, to determine the final outcome.

my thoughts

v/r

Joshua

If it's god's game and god's rules and he wants us with him, why not make rules that guarentee that we will be?

pattimax · 05-01-2007, 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shadowman

If it's god's game and god's rules and he wants us with him, why not make rules that guarentee that we will be?

Because He didn't create us that way. You must choose and if you choose not to choose, then that's your choice. If you choose other than Him, then that is your choice also.
But it is HIS game and HIS rules.