Is it possible to have a dialogue about "the Truth" - Page 7

Abogado del Diablo · 08-14-2006, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paladin

Yes indeed, back to the project

This may require a different thread altogether, but I imagine that any discussion on truth must follow the perceptions of the personality describing it much like the elephant proverb. If the MBTI of the person leads them to a more fundamentalist outlook and say another person comes from a more INFP place wouldn't an unresovleable "software conflict" arise?

Paladin:

There may very well be something like that going on. That's something I think is worth exploring. Can we investigate that possibility by looking at how we distinguish the truth from not the truth? I'm certainly open to the idea that my proposal isn't the most effective way to explore that possibility.

If you have another idea, perhaps another thread about the relationship between personality and perceptions of the truth is warranted.

Here's a question we might explore: Can we change aspects of our personality? By opening ourselves to different concepts of reality, can we alter the fundamental way we reconcile our internal selves with the external world and change our personality?

Can science help us here? There's been some very interesting recent scientific research into the apparent relationship between "religious" practices such as prayer and meditation and the distribution and intensity of electrical activity across the brain.

Abogado del Diablo · 08-14-2006, 05:36 PM

Here are a few articles on this new research:

Love Promotes Health

Meditation and the Brain

Object-referral/Self-referral continuum of self-awareness

There are many, many more.

I have more than a passing interest in the science of cognition and the consciousness of self because of my son's autism.

Paladin · 08-14-2006, 05:39 PM

I think this thread of inquiry has been adequately answered, and the next question you pose would begin another. Maslow's hierarchy was completed when at the top he finally placed a space for Self-trancendance. Being the next step past self-actualization, it is I think necessary to really discuss or approach any ideas of an absolute reality. Without trying to trancend our own dogmas, and ultimately our limited ideas and identifications with self how shall we ever know what truth truly is?

Abogado del Diablo · 08-14-2006, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paladin

I think this thread of inquiry has been adequately answered

I think you are right. We haven't even been able to start a conversation about whether we can start a conversation. QED indeed.

Paladin · 08-14-2006, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abogado del Diablo

Here are a few articles on this new research:

Love Promotes Health

Meditation and the Brain

Love and Stress

There are many, many more.

I have more than a passing interest in the science of cognition and the consciousness of self because of my son's autism.

Very interesting stuff, I first came into contact with some of this research through my wife who is in charge of the counseling department in a local middle school. Though her degree is in education her hobby as it were is brain research and functions.
Daniel Golemans book "Destructive Emotions;How can we overcome them" introduced me to the group in Boulder that concerns itself with bridging the gap between religion and Science. Quite a worthwhile endeavor!

lunamoth · 08-14-2006, 06:05 PM

Thank you for the articles, AdD. I'm looking forward to reading them. At the risk of derailing this thread, even if it is in its death throws, it's occurred to me before that emotions can become habits...and we have some control over which habits we encourage and which we try to drop. Indulging in anger seems to beget more anger...and

love begets love.

luna

Abogado del Diablo · 08-14-2006, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lunamoth

love begets love.

luna

I think that's the perfect sentiment to close this thread with. Thanks.

samabudhi · 08-15-2006, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kenod

Quote:

Originally Posted by samabudhi

Direct perception and inference. Some say scripture as well, but I think it really boils down to direct perception in the end.

So to really know the hell realm and be sure about it, you need to experience it directly. To really know God, you would have to experience him directly. Experiencing anything through your eyes, ears, nose, tongue, body, thoughts...these are all indirect.

What about instinct?
What about love?
What about faith?

Are these "real" experiences?

Hmmmm... The term "real" is slightly different to what I mean. In Buddhism, as with Einstein, everything is relative. In other words, all phenomena depend on each other for their reality - so they are just appearances. No thing is "real", as in "inherently existing".

Those experiences, they rely on an observer to experience them. They depend on causes and conditions. So to answer your question, no.

earl · 08-15-2006, 04:46 PM

I believe there are many common "truths" across traditions and no tradition-the states of non-ordinary consciouness as found via meditation, other spiritual/mystical practices, and near death experiences suggest certain "truths" that escape ordinary waking consciousness. But to think finite, relative beings might attain to "infinite" absolute Truth is not likely though its pursuit likely enables us to find all these wonderful less-than-absolute truths.

take care, earl

17th Angel · 11-09-2006, 02:03 PM

How can all religions claim to be the truth, yet they are so different from each other and deny the next religion? And then say like the JW's I used to "hang" with lol.. They would say... "Well that is simple." They would then open their bible and show me verses. "See god says they are wrong."

But that doesn't answer my question... I am sure somewhere in the islam jewish muslim whatever religion it shows they are obviously right and that the christians are wrong... With all this "at each others throats" thing going on... How can anyone really be comfortable with their version of the "truth"