is there a real philosophers stone?

[omner]

Originally Posted by _Z_

alchemists have this view of an original perfection, but why positive and not negative as well? i am imagining that an ‘it’ that is everything would contain all potentials, i would see the ‘prima materia’ as being superseded by something that is not only the basis of physicality but also of spirit, being mind and everything including ‘god’ - would you not agree? it would be an universal 'it' and all things would be conducive to its way and essence.

No negative because opposites do not truly exist. The negation of a thought is a thought itself. You can observe this with any child: tell them not to do something, and what they hear is "something: that might be fun to do!" I think the reason laws prohibiting things are generally failures -- ie people do what is prohibited anyway -- is because of this as well. A good law should tell people what to do, and not what not to do, because either one is an idea, and providing a good idea is better than providing a bad idea and then telling someone not to do it.

The philosopher's stone maybe comes from the idea contained in the Emerald Tablet, which describes life coming from the source into the world and back to the source, enriched, over and over again.

The language of the Emerald Tablet sounds to me a lot like the Tao Te Ching, by Lao Tzu. Just yesterday I ran across a 2nd book by Lao Tzu -- I hadn't known he had any others attributed to him. It's called Hua Hu Ching. The goal is beyond definition or description, as he admits, but can be reached through a process of

There is no way to define it, no combination of symbols to accurately describe it, but a formula for obtaining it which is just the process of life itself: VITRIOL, "go into the world, live and observe, understanding, and discover the hidden jewel" is my translation, of the formula which I see as derived from the Emerald Tablet. But this is exactly what is described as well in Hua Hu Ching, the conclusion of which follows:

(81) With all this talking, what has been said? The subtle truth can he pointed at with words, but it can't be contained by them. Take time to listen to what is said without words, to obey the law too subtle to be written, to worship the unnameable and to embrace the unformed. Love your life. Trust the Tao. Make love with the invisible subtle origin of the universe, and you will give yourself everything you need. You won't have to hide away forever in spiritual retreats. You can be a gentle, contemplative hermit right here in the middle of everything, utterly unaffected, thoroughly sustained and rewarded by your integral practices. Encouraging others, giving freely to all, awakening and purifying the world with each movement and action, you'll ascend to the divine realm in broad daylight. The breath of the Tao speaks, and those who are in harmony with it hear quite clearly.

[_Z_]

omner

thank you for an most interesting post.

No negative because opposites do not truly exist.

they ‘exist’ in electricity as they exist holistically and philosophically. i see what you mean though, in essence they do not, yet that which emerges than becomes them does. thence they are an outer expression both physically and in terms of meaning and entity.

The negation of a thought is a thought itself

indeed! i would say that the negated thought belongs to the essence becoming thoughts, just as physicality arises form the same primal entity. thought and existence begin in/as the whole becoming parts in transience.
A good law should tell people what to do, and not what not to do,
yes, also; is it not so that either way people are not all the same and will always act according to who they are. then laws cannot represent every kind of person, so people will agree and disagree with some laws, then act accordingly thence breaking some laws.

the Tao Te Ching, by Lao Tzu. Just yesterday I ran across a 2nd book by Lao Tzu -- I hadn’t known he had any others attributed to him. It’s called Hua Hu Ching. The goal is beyond definition or description,

i didn’t know that too! here’s a thread i was going to do on this very topic:
http://www.comparative-religion.com/...tml#post120659

nice meeting you.