Mahatma Gandhi, Christian fundamentalism and Politics of conversion

[Mr.Bean]

Firstly, I dont believe Respected Jesus is the 'only' son of God, if he is then we all are son of god. Secondly, I dont believe Jesus or Prophet Mohammad are last messenger of God (eg. What will you call ten Gurus of Sikhs????). Thirdly, I believe No one need to change their religion to find God. I think 'India' is the most spritiual country where all theories(religions) are welcomed.

[elize]

Originally Posted by Mr.Bean

Firstly, I dont believe Respected Jesus is the 'only' son of God, if he is then we all are son of god. Secondly, I dont believe Jesus or Prophet Mohammad are last messenger of God (eg. What will you call ten Gurus of Sikhs????). Thirdly, I believe No one need to change their religion to find God. I think 'India' is the most spritiual country where all theories(religions) are welcomed.

Yes, I agree that we are all his "children" if we believe in God, BUT my mother was not a virgin mother, I did not live a 100% pure life, I did not do any wonders, apostles did not travel the world to tell and write about me and have been prosecuted and tortured in the process. I also did not die for your sins and can promise you an everlasting life if you believe in me.
Lastly I agree that we must have respect for all religions especially if you have been raised up in one and you only know that religion, BUT we must still be open to hear what God has to say to us.

[radarmark]

Mr. Bean--

As another not caught up in the dogma or exclusivity, let me say you make a very good point. When I lived in Southern California (oh these many years ago) the national campus crusade for Christ used to send me their almost grads for a final test (yes this has to do with Gandhiji).

I would go through his life and point out that he had formally denied Jesus (as Savior and Son of God) three times, hence he was doomed to eternal fire. On the other hand, if Hitler had truly repented and accepted during that fraction of a second between pulling the trigger and death, he would be forgiven (and sitting in heaven).

My last line, "if G!d is so whimsical and can be so unjust, I choose to spend eternity next to Gandhi in the eternal lake of lightless fire". I usually could push the tested to the point where he or she would scream at me (or, on one occasion throw a punch).

Pretty much feel the same today. If "virgin" is true (and that can objectively never be proved), a 100% pure life does not include (IMHO) casting demons into swine who drown themselves (Jesus could have cast them out without killing something), the "wonders" can all be refuted, the apostles did not write the NT, the dying for sins and everlasting life are interpretations of words Jesus most likely did not say, and if there are so many other Middle Eastern Godmen whose lives predate and are arguably the tem[plate for the beliefs of the Christian Church, why should I choose to accept Christ alone?

No, it makes (IMHO) much better sense to accept that the core of all Religions (with a capital I mean exoteric forms, like Jainism or Hinduism or Southern Baptists) is one the one religion (small "r" denotes the esoteric spiritual experience hidden behind the Religion); behind all the ten thousand names of the Divine is the one G!d.

[arthra]

I don't know if this was mentioned earlier on this thread but there was quite a correspondence between Leo Tolstoy and Gandhi.. and this was an excerpt from Tolstoy's letter to Gandhi:

The longer I live-especially now when I clearly feel the approach of death-the more I feel moved to express what I feel more strongly than anything else, and what in my opinion is of immense importance, namely, what we call the renunciation of all opposition by force, which really simply means the doctrine of the law of love unperverted by sophistries.

Love, or in other words the striving of men's souls towards unity and the submissive behaviour to one another that results therefrom, represents the highest and indeed the only law of life, as every man knows and feels in the depths of his heart (and as we see most clearly in children), and knows until he becomes involved in the lying net of worldly thoughts. This law was announced by all the philosophies- Indian as well as Chinese, and Jewish, Greek and Roman.

Most clearly, I think, was it announced by Christ, who said explicitly that on it hang all the Law and the Prophets. More than that, foreseeing the distortion that has hindered its recognition and may always hinder it, he specially indicated the danger of a misrepresentation that presents itself to men living by worldly interests- namely, that they may claim a right to defend their interests by force or, as he expressed it, to repay blow by blow and recover stolen property by force, etc., etc. He knew, as all reasonable men must do, that any employment of force is incompatible with love as the highest law of life, and that as soon as the use of force appears permissible even in a single case, the law itself is immediately negatived

More about the letters can be found at

Correspondence between Tolstoy and Gandhi - Wikisource

I think Gandhi though learned a good deal from Tolstoy and his book "The Kingdom of God is Within You" also..

Gandhi later wrote of Tolstoy's book,

"Its reading cured me of my skepticism and made me a firm believer in ahimsa [nonviolence]."17

It also helped him resolve the question of religious identity, for Tolstoy's Christianity was not based on special revelation, but was simply one instance of a universal law. The law of love was the mark of true religion in every tradition. Gandhi thereafter understood Christianity in Tolstoy's way. It liberated him from orthodoxy, as it had liberated Tolstoy, and provided a foundation for his identification with Hinduism.

Adin Ballou, Tolstoy, and Gandhi

[radarmark]

Yep... Ballou to Tolstoi to Gandhiji to MLK. There are others before and since that chain, but you can pretty well say that chain is a chain of Peace Witnesses influencing each other. Gandhiji was also very influenced by the Pranami sect of his mother (a neo-Hindu/Muslim sect according to some).