Not Proven

enlightenment · 03-27-2007, 07:21 AM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Not_proven_verdict

Read and tell me what you think of this verdict, that we have in Scottish law..

wil · 03-27-2007, 12:26 PM

I like it...

There are countless cases in the US where 'not proven' verdict would be rendered...to begin with every one that was not guilty in criminal court yet found responsible in civil court... would make the civil trials easier and quicker I would think...

enlightenment · 03-27-2007, 02:18 PM

Do you..?

I am not sure.

See, if I did happen to be the accused, and I was innocent, I would want a not guilty verdict, this verdict just sort of hangs over you, with a finger pointing....

Pathless · 03-27-2007, 06:14 PM

Yeah, I haven't read the whole wiki, but it does seem like a bit of the shifty verdict:

"Well, we think you did it, you *******, but we just can't prove it. Naaa-nyyaaaaah! Thhhhbbbbbttth!!!

"

I do think it is funny that it is known also as "the ******* verdict." That, at least, I like.

wil · 03-27-2007, 09:02 PM

In the US our system is not to get to the truth, it is an attempt to insure an innocent person is not punished. Our requirement is guilty beyond a resonable doubt...

Our prosecutors once they are set free are not concerned with truth...just convictions.

Our defenders once employed are not concerned with truth, just getting a not guilty verdict.

Our system allows any mistake of the prosecutors or policeman to cause evidence to go inadmissable...simple chain of custody, or administrative procedures that can bring in the possiblity of doubt get compelling evidence thrown out...

Not guilty has never meant innocent, just that they can't be proven guilty within the framework of the law. This verdict seems to fit the void...and will increase the meaning of being found not guilty.

Just my opinions...I haven't passed the bar...and will probably change my tune when I am found...not proven.

Pathless · 03-27-2007, 09:36 PM

Good points, wil, about the nature (*cough*corruption*cough) of the legal system. Is it like a high stakes game of strategy played with tangible jail sentences and death-dealing devices? Goodness

gracious, count me out. I think I'll sit on the sidelines, throwing dice.

Personally, I like to maintain a philosophy of not proven for the most part. Does that make me a philosphical *******?

flowperson · 03-27-2007, 11:41 PM

Isn't this something like "no contest" here in the U.S. ?

Seattle ?...never a lawyer around when you need one.

flow....

wil · 03-28-2007, 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flowperson

Isn't this something like "no contest" here in the U.S. ?

Seattle ?...never a lawyer around when you need one.

flow....

not admitting guilt and throwing yourself on the mercy of the court prior to evidence me thinks nolo contendre? similar to probation before judgement??

If I remember correctly it is basically an unregistered guilty verdict. The court may award some fine and then so many years probation...with the stipulation that if you brought before the court again on this or some other offense the guilty verdict is registered and your sentence is automatic....scary part.

I'd love to know how right or wrong my memory is and why I know this....