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Old 04-05-2009, 06:33 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Re: Second Isaiah as a point of inter-faith unity.

Juantoo3, if I didn't want to stay focused on Isaiah I'd express how strongly I believe that the life and teachings of Jesus do not need the crutch or the heavy hand of any state or state sanctioned resurrection theology as back-up. The lives and teachings of Mohandas Gandhi and Martin Luther King Jr., to name but two, have transcendence more powerful than that of "just another wise man out to save the world". And, no doubt, both of these great figures would adamantly say that the transcendence of Jesus' teachings far outstrips their own.

Last edited by juantoo3; 04-09-2009 at 05:16 AM.
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Old 04-05-2009, 08:37 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Second Isaiah as a point of inter-faith unity.

Quote:
Originally Posted by juantoo3 View Post
I dunno. Seems I have heard repeatedly from various Protestant sources how Jesus fulfilled this and that from the Old Testament (Psalms 22 leaps to mind)...and let us not lose sight that Jesus was in fact a Jew.

Kinda difficult to model one's execution on scripture, no?
My reading of Christian literature makes a big point that different Gospel writers are writing for different audiences, and therefore trying to focus on different points.

Matthew is always pointed out as specifically written for the Jews, with the suggestion that most claims of Messianic fulfilment are underlined in his Gospel.

However, a non-Christian approach might even suggest that the text is being used in propagandist way, meaning that certain events may not have happened, and yet were written in to add colour and meaning to the narrative.

It's quite obvious that there is a major struggle with Christianity - even a paradox - in play, in that Jesus is claimed to be God in human form, and yet there is also a very concerted effort to prove the human aspects full Jewish credentials.

When you read other ancient literature, it's quite plain that each writer has an agenda and they are happy to repeat rumour or add their own inventions in order to support their bias.

The Roman writer Tacitus is an easy one to draw on - he ascribes miracles to Roman Emporers to justify their legitimacy - a feature of ancient writing that is hard not to read in the Gospels as being a perfectly common device, but ultimately fictional.

Additionally, among the Greek writers such as Herodotus it seems quite clear that certain prophecies are used as a device to underline a point being made by the writer.

And yet the Gospels are presumed to have been written by men and yet be perfect and incorruptible, yet still analysis suggests that there have been key additions and edits to some of these.

The end of Mark is probably the most infamous, as early versions of the text finish at the death on the cross, yet later versions have a resurrection account added on.

So it would be easy to presume that any historical Jesus figure did not fulfil specific prophecies from the OT, but that later writers did add these in. At the time is was seen as perfectly acceptable for writers to add fictional details to their narrative, as there was little interest in objectivity, simply that the essence of the message be maintained - and that anything that could be made up and added in to support that message was seen as normal.

The more amazing thing would be to presume that the Gospels and other canonised texts were somehow immune from the ordinary indulgences of common storytelling devices of the time - which I guess is what it's seen as a matter of faith otherwise.
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Old 04-05-2009, 09:01 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Second Isaiah as a point of inter-faith unity.

Interesting Brian. I can certainly see an important spiritual message in the bible and that a man called Jesus caused a religious movement which has had a direct and indirect effect on society till today, I'm just curious as to how far the fabrication goes and if it’s at all possible that Jesus was completely made up?
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Old 04-06-2009, 12:19 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: Second Isaiah as a point of inter-faith unity.

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Originally Posted by I, Brian View Post
Matthew is always pointed out as specifically written for the Jews, with the suggestion that most claims of Messianic fulfilment are underlined in his Gospel.
You highlight some very interesting things to consider, Brian, and I don't want to veer too far astray...although the subject could easily command a thread of its own. While Matthew is generally considered to have been written to the Jews, Mark is generally considered to have been written to the Romans and Luke is generally considered to have been written to the Greeks...and as synoptic Gospels they share a great deal of storyline.

I would have to do a bit of research to see if my thoughts here bear any merit, but I am thinking it a bit strange to use appeal to Jewish mythos when addressing a Greek or particularly a Roman audience...unless there is some degree of weight to the claims. When considering the rest of the cosmopolitan Greco-Roman world, the Jews and all associated with them rated about as high as red-headed step-children when it came to credibility and "appeal-power."

All the more amazing that a backwater Jewish carpenter cum radical rabbi should become a rallying point for Roman civilization some 300 years later.

Now I return us to our regularly scheduled discussion...
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Old 04-06-2009, 11:10 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: Second Isaiah as a point of inter-faith unity.

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Originally Posted by juantoo3 View Post
You highlight some very interesting things to consider, Brian, and I don't want to veer too far astray...although the subject could easily command a thread of its own. While Matthew is generally considered to have been written to the Jews, Mark is generally considered to have been written to the Romans and Luke is generally considered to have been written to the Greeks...and as synoptic Gospels they share a great deal of storyline.

I would have to do a bit of research to see if my thoughts here bear any merit, but I am thinking it a bit strange to use appeal to Jewish mythos when addressing a Greek or particularly a Roman audience...unless there is some degree of weight to the claims. When considering the rest of the cosmopolitan Greco-Roman world, the Jews and all associated with them rated about as high as red-headed step-children when it came to credibility and "appeal-power."

All the more amazing that a backwater Jewish carpenter cum radical rabbi should become a rallying point for Roman civilization some 300 years later.

Now I return us to our regularly scheduled discussion...
No worries - I'll try not to derail.

However, it is worth considering that early Christianity was effectively a Jewish sect, so it was important to try and address Jewish concerns - it isn't until Paul comes along a few decades later that the sect turns away from Judaism to the Gentiles.
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Old 04-09-2009, 05:15 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: Psalms 22 and the synoptic Gospels

I've been thinking about a study in this direction for some time now, but a recent conversation brought it back to light.

Besides, I am hoping it will give me a chance to try a couple of the tools and see how they work, if I can get them to.

I expect this to be a lengthy study, which is one reason I have put it off. But with the season the thoughts in my mind are at the fore, so let's give it a try:
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Old 04-09-2009, 05:19 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: Psalms 22 and the synoptic Gospels

Psalms 22:

Quote:
Psalms 22:1 My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? why art thou so far from helping me, and from the words of my roaring?

Psalms 22:2 O my God, I cry in the day time, but thou hearest not; and in the night season, and am not silent.

Psalms 22:3 But thou art holy, O thou that inhabitest the praises of Israel.

Psalms 22:4 Our fathers trusted in thee: they trusted, and thou didst deliver them.

Psalms 22:5 They cried unto thee, and were delivered: they trusted in thee, and were not confounded.

Psalms 22:6 But I am a worm, and no man; a reproach of men, and despised of the people.

Psalms 22:7 All they that see me laugh me to scorn: they shoot out the lip, they shake the head, saying,

Psalms 22:8 He trusted on the LORD that he would deliver him: let him deliver him, seeing he delighted in him.

Psalms 22:9 But thou art he that took me out of the womb: thou didst make me hope when I was upon my mother's breasts.

Psalms 22:10 I was cast upon thee from the womb: thou art my God from my mother's belly.

Psalms 22:11 Be not far from me; for trouble is near; for there is none to help.

Psalms 22:12 Many bulls have compassed me: strong bulls of Bashan have beset me round.

Psalms 22:13 They gaped upon me with their mouths, as a ravening and a roaring lion.

Psalms 22:14 I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint: my heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of my bowels.

Psalms 22:15 My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death.

Psalms 22:16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet.

Psalms 22:17 I may tell all my bones: they look and stare upon me.

Psalms 22:18 They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture.

Psalms 22:19 But be not thou far from me, O LORD: O my strength, haste thee to help me.

Psalms 22:20 Deliver my soul from the sword; my darling from the power of the dog.

Psalms 22:21 Save me from the lion's mouth: for thou hast heard me from the horns of the unicorns.

Psalms 22:22 I will declare thy name unto my brethren: in the midst of the congregation will I praise thee.

Psalms 22:23 Ye that fear the LORD, praise him; all ye the seed of Jacob, glorify him; and fear him, all ye the seed of Israel.

Psalms 22:24 For he hath not despised nor abhorred the affliction of the afflicted; neither hath he hid his face from him; but when he cried unto him, he heard.

Psalms 22:25 My praise shall be of thee in the great congregation: I will pay my vows before them that fear him.

Psalms 22:26 The meek shall eat and be satisfied: they shall praise the LORD that seek him: your heart shall live for ever.

Psalms 22:27 All the ends of the world shall remember and turn unto the LORD: and all the kindreds of the nations shall worship before thee.

Psalms 22:28 For the kingdom is the LORD's: and he is the governor among the nations.

Psalms 22:29 All they that be fat upon earth shall eat and worship: all they that go down to the dust shall bow before him: and none can keep alive his own soul.

Psalms 22:30 A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.

Psalms 22:31 They shall come, and shall declare his righteousness unto a people that shall be born, that he hath done this.
King James Version
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Old 04-09-2009, 05:22 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Re: Psalms 22 and the synoptic Gospels

Quote:
A Cry of Anguish and a Song of Praise.

For the choir director; upon Aijeleth F191 Hashshahar. A Psalm of David.

1 My R562 God, my God, why have You forsaken me?

Far R563 F192 from my deliverance are the words of my groaning. R564 F193

2 O my God, I cry R565 by day, but You do not answer;

And by night, but I F194 have no rest.

3 Yet You R566 are holy,

O You who are F195 enthroned upon the R567 praises of Israel.

4 In You our fathers trusted; R568

They trusted and You delivered R569 them.

5 To You they cried out and were delivered;

In R570 You they trusted and were not disappointed. F196


6 But I am a worm R571 and not a man,

A reproach R572 of men and despised R573 by the people.

7 All who see me sneer R574 F197 at me;

They separate F198 with the lip, they wag R575 the head, saying,

8 "Commit F199 yourself to the LORD; let R576 Him deliver him;

Let Him rescue him, because He delights in him."


9 Yet You are He who brought R577 me forth from the womb;

You made me trust when upon my mother's breasts.

10 Upon You I was cast from R578 birth; F200

You have been my God from my mother's womb.


11 Be R579 not far from me, for trouble F201 is near;

For there is none R580 to help.

12 Many bulls R581 have surrounded me;

Strong bulls of Bashan R582 have encircled me.

13 They open R583 wide their mouth at me,

As a ravening and a roaring lion. R584

14 I am poured R585 out like water,

And all my bones R586 are out of joint;

My heart R587 is like wax;

It is melted within me. F202

15 My strength R588 is dried up like a potsherd,

And my R589 tongue cleaves to my jaws;

And You lay R590 me in F203 the dust of death.

16 For dogs R591 have surrounded me;

A F204 band of evildoers has encompassed me;

They F205 pierced R592 my hands and my feet.

17 I can count all my bones.

They R593 look, they stare at me;

18 They divide R594 my garments among them,

And for my clothing they cast lots.


19 But You, O LORD, be R595 not far off;

O You my help, hasten R596 to my assistance.

20 Deliver my soul F206 from the R597 sword,

My only R598 life from the power F207 of the dog.

21 Save me from the lion's R599 mouth;

From the horns of the wild R600 oxen You answer R601 me.


22 I will tell R602 of Your name to my brethren;

In the midst of the assembly I will praise You.

23 You R603 who fear the LORD, praise Him;

All you descendants F208 of Jacob, glorify R604 Him,

And stand R605 in awe of Him, all you descendants F208 of Israel.

24 For He has not R606 despised nor abhorred the affliction of the afflicted;

Nor has He hidden R607 His face from him;

But when R608 he cried to Him for help, He heard.


25 From You comes my R609 praise in the great assembly;

I shall pay R610 my vows before those who fear Him.

26 The afflicted F209 will eat and be R611 satisfied;

Those who seek Him will praise R612 the LORD.

Let your heart R613 live forever!

27 All the ends R614 of the earth will remember and turn to the LORD,

And all the families R615 of the nations will worship before You. F210

28 For the kingdom R616 is the LORD'S

And He rules R617 over the nations.

29 All the prosperous R618 F211 of the earth will eat and worship,

All those who go R619 down to the dust will bow before Him,

Even he who cannot R620 F212 keep his soul alive.

30 Posterity R621 F213 will serve Him;

It will be told of the Lord to the R622 coming generation.

31 They will come and will R623 declare His righteousness

To a people who R624 will be born, that He has performed it.
Interlinear Version
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Old 04-09-2009, 05:40 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: Psalms 22 and the synoptic Gospels

I am lookiing for an online study version of the Pesh!tta Bible, it seems to be a little difficult to find:

Quote:
Eli Eli lema sabachthani
Matthew 27:46

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

: Around the ninth hour, Jesus shouted in a loud voice, saying "Eli Eli lema sabachthani?" which is, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"


~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

Mark 15:34

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

: And at the ninth hour, Jesus shouted in a loud voice, "Eloi Eloi lema sabachthani?" which is translated, "My God, my God, for what have you forsaken me?"


~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

This phrase, shouted by Jesus from the cross, is given to us in these two versions. The Matthean version of the phrase is transliterated in Greek as ηλι ηλι λεμα σαβαχθανι. The Markan version is similar, but begins ελωι ελωι.


~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

Jesus seems to be quoting the first line of Psalm 22. However, he is not quoting the canonical Hebrew version (l l lm `azabtn), but is using an Aramaic translation of it (see targum).

Related Topics:
Psalm - Targum

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

In the following verse, in both accounts, some who hear Jesus' cry imagine that he is calling for help from Elijah (Eliyy). This is perhaps to underline the incomprehension of the bystanders about what is happening. Matthew's use of ηλι may indicate a more 'official' rendition of the psalm verse, more in line with the Hebrew. Mark's version probably represents the Aramaic colloquial better. The Aramaic behind Matthew is l l lm švaqtan. Whereas Mark has eloh eloh.

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

A few ancient Greek manuscripts show signs of trying to normalise this text. For instance, the peculiar Codex Bezae renders both versions with ηλι ηλι λαμα ζαφθανι (li li lama zaphthani).

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

As the phrase is clearly translated into Greek in both instances there can be little doubt as to its meaning. However, a minority have speculated on different meanings, among them is George Lamsa, but his methodology has been shown to be seriously flawed.

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

The Aramaic word švaqtan is based on the verb švaq, 'to leave, forget', with the perfect tense ending -t (2nd person singular: 'you'), and the object suffix -an (1st person singular: 'me').
Aramaic of Jesus - Aramaic phrases in the Greek New Testament

Quote:
1. My God, my God, why hast thou let me to live? And yet thou hast delayed my salvation from me, because of the words of my folly.

2. O my God I call the in the daytime but thou answerest me not: and in the night season thou abidest not with me.

3. For thou art holy, and Israel dwells under thy glory.

4. Our fathers trusted in thee; they trusted, and thou didst deliver them.

5. They cried unto thee and were delivered; they trusted in thee and were not confounded.

6. But I am a worm, and not a man; a reproach of men, and despised of the people.

7. All they that saw me have laughed me to scorn; they shoot out with their lips, they shake their heads saying,

8. He trusted in the Lord; let the Lord deliver him; let him save him if he be delighted in him.

9. For thou art my trust since I came out of the womb, and my hope since I was upon my mother’s breasts.

10. I was put under thy care from the womb; thou art my God from my mother’s belly.

11. Be not far from me; for trouble is near; for there is none to help.

12. Many bulls have surrounded me: strong bulls of Bashan have besieged me.

13. Their mouths snarl against me, as a ravening and roaring lion.

14. I am poured out like water and all my bones are out of joint; my heart is like wax, and my bowels are wasted in the midst of me.

15. My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaves to my jaws; thou hast thrown me into the dust of death.

16. For the vicious has surrounded me; the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me; they have pierced my hands and my feet.

17. My bones ached with pain; they looked and stared upon me.

18. They parted my garments among them and cast lots upon my vesture.

19. But O Lord, be not thou far from me; O God, O God, abide to help me.

20. Deliver my soul from the sword, my only one from the hand of the vicious.

21. Save me from the lion’s mouth; save my meekness from the haughty,

22. That I may declare thy name to my brethren; in the midst of the congregation will I praise thee.

23. You that revere the Lord, praise him; all you the offspring of Jacob, glorify him; and fear him, all you descendents of Israel.

24. For he has not despised nor abhorred the affliction of the poor; neither has he turned away his face from him; but when he cried unto him, he heard him.

25. My praise shall be of thee in the great congregation; I will fulfil my wows before them that worship him.

26. The poor shall eat and be satisfied; they shall praise the Lord that seek him; their hearts shall live for ever.

27. All the ends of the world shall remember and turn to the Lord; and all the kindreds of the Gentiles shall worship before thee.

28. For the kingdom is the Lord’s; he is the governor over the Gentiles.

29. All they that are hungry upon earth shall eat and worship before the Lord; all they that are buried shall kneel before him; my soul is alive to him.

30. An offspring shall serve him; the generations thereof shall proclaim the Lord.

31. They shall come and declare his righteousness to a people that shall be born, and tell that which the Lord has done.
Psalm 22
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Old 04-09-2009, 05:51 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: Psalms 22 and the synoptic Gospels

An interesting interpretation that points in the direction I was hoping to go with this:

Quote:
My El! My El! Why have you spared me?

Matthew 27:46

Perhaps no Scripture evokes more emotion than the cry from the stake in Matthew 27:46. How is it possible that these powerful words have been misunderstood for nearly two millennia? For many, Y’shua’s last utterance was either understood as a cry of desperation or a declaration of his Messiahship from Psalm 22:1; "My El, My El, why have you forsaken me." Greek versions attempt to transliterate the Psalm as Eli, Eli lama sabacthani. However, the Aramaic Pe****ta NT reads: "Eli, Eli lemana shabakthani," while Hebrew Psalm reads: "Eli, Eli lama azbatani." Greek transliteration reflects the Aramaic word as does the Pe****ta. However, there is a key difference between azbatani, which only means "to forsake" and its Aramaic counterpart shabakthani which has multiple meanings but also includes the same concept.

... we must look at the final words that come out of Y’shua’s mouth; so let’s examine the Aramaic word shbakthani. As mentioned above, it shares the "forsake" meaning with the Hebrew word used in Psalm 22. However, the root of the word shbak has several other meanings including: (1) reserve (2) keep (3) spare (4) forgive. In Luke 23:34, Y’shua uses the exact same word to say, "Father, shbak (forgive) them for they know not what they do." This multiplicity of meaning in Aramaic, naturally groups related concepts under the umbrella of the same word. In this case, reserve, keep and spare all are variations from the same concept of setting aside. The same can be said idiomatically of forgive, where offenses are metaphorically also "set aside." Conversely, the rabbis throughout the centuries have always translated the Hebrew azbatani in Psalm 22 exclusively as "forsaken." That is not to say the other meanings of shbak do not exist also in its Hebrew equivalent, because they do in other verses of Scripture. In the end only one solution reveals itself, which is that another meaning of shbakthani is intended. The context safely eliminates forgive as a possibility as it makes no sense; therefore, the highly similar concepts of reserve, keep or spare are left to investigate.
Why did Yeshua cry out, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"
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Old 04-09-2009, 05:56 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Re: Psalms 22 and the synoptic Gospels

Matthew is the Gospel generally considered by scholars as having been written to a Jewish audience:

Quote:
Matthew 27:1 When the morning was come, all the chief priests and elders of the people took counsel against Jesus to put him to death:

Matthew 27:2 And when they had bound him, they led him away, and delivered him to Pontius Pilate the governor.

Matthew 27:3 Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders,

Matthew 27:4 Saying, I have sinned in that I have betrayed the innocent blood. And they said, What is that to us? see thou to that.

Matthew 27:5 And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself.

Matthew 27:6 And the chief priests took the silver pieces, and said, It is not lawful for to put them into the treasury, because it is the price of blood.

Matthew 27:7 And they took counsel, and bought with them the potter's field, to bury strangers in.

Matthew 27:8 Wherefore that field was called, The field of blood, unto this day.

Matthew 27:9 Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet, saying, And they took the thirty pieces of silver, the price of him that was valued, whom they of the children of Israel did value;

Matthew 27:10 And gave them for the potter's field, as the Lord appointed me.

Matthew 27:11 And Jesus stood before the governor: and the governor asked him, saying, Art thou the King of the Jews? And Jesus said unto him, Thou sayest.

Matthew 27:12 And when he was accused of the chief priests and elders, he answered nothing.

Matthew 27:13 Then said Pilate unto him, Hearest thou not how many things they witness against thee?

Matthew 27:14 And he answered him to never a word; insomuch that the governor marvelled greatly.

Matthew 27:15 Now at that feast the governor was wont to release unto the people a prisoner, whom they would.

Matthew 27:16 And they had then a notable prisoner, called Barabbas.

Matthew 27:17 Therefore when they were gathered together, Pilate said unto them, Whom will ye that I release unto you? Barabbas, or Jesus which is called Christ?

Matthew 27:18 For he knew that for envy they had delivered him.

Matthew 27:19 When he was set down on the judgment seat, his wife sent unto him, saying, Have thou nothing to do with that just man: for I have suffered many things this day in a dream because of him.

Matthew 27:20 But the chief priests and elders persuaded the multitude that they should ask Barabbas, and destroy Jesus.

Matthew 27:21 The governor answered and said unto them, Whether of the twain will ye that I release unto you? They said, Barabbas.

Matthew 27:22 Pilate saith unto them, What shall I do then with Jesus which is called Christ? They all say unto him, Let him be crucified.

Matthew 27:23 And the governor said, Why, what evil hath he done? But they cried out the more, saying, Let him be crucified.

Matthew 27:24 When Pilate saw that he could prevail nothing, but that rather a tumult was made, he took water, and washed his hands before the multitude, saying, I am innocent of the blood of this just person: see ye to it.

Matthew 27:25 Then answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children.

Matthew 27:26 Then released he Barabbas unto them: and when he had scourged Jesus, he delivered him to be crucified.

Matthew 27:27 Then the soldiers of the governor took Jesus into the common hall, and gathered unto him the whole band of soldiers.

Matthew 27:28 And they stripped him, and put on him a scarlet robe.

Matthew 27:29 And when they had platted a crown of thorns, they put it upon his head, and a reed in his right hand: and they bowed the knee before him, and mocked him, saying, Hail, King of the Jews!

Matthew 27:30 And they spit upon him, and took the reed, and smote him on the head.

Matthew 27:31 And after that they had mocked him, they took the robe off from him, and put his own raiment on him, and led him away to crucify him.

Matthew 27:32 And as they came out, they found a man of Cyrene, Simon by name: him they compelled to bear his cross.

Matthew 27:33 And when they were come unto a place called Golgotha, that is to say, a place of a skull,

Matthew 27:34 They gave him vinegar to drink mingled with gall: and when he had tasted thereof, he would not drink.

Matthew 27:35 And they crucified him, and parted his garments, casting lots: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, They parted my garments among them, and upon my vesture did they cast lots.

Matthew 27:36 And sitting down they watched him there;

Matthew 27:37 And set up over his head his accusation written, THIS IS JESUS THE KING OF THE JEWS.

Matthew 27:38 Then were there two thieves crucified with him, one on the right hand, and another on the left.

Matthew 27:39 And they that passed by reviled him, wagging their heads,

Matthew 27:40 And saying, Thou that destroyest the temple, and buildest it in three days, save thyself. If thou be the Son of God, come down from the cross.

Matthew 27:41 Likewise also the chief priests mocking him, with the scribes and elders, said,

Matthew 27:42 He saved others; himself he cannot save. If he be the King of Israel, let him now come down from the cross, and we will believe him.

Matthew 27:43 He trusted in God; let him deliver him now, if he will have him: for he said, I am the Son of God.

Matthew 27:44 The thieves also, which were crucified with him, cast the same in his teeth.

Matthew 27:45 Now from the sixth hour there was darkness over all the land unto the ninth hour.

Matthew 27:46 And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

Matthew 27:47 Some of them that stood there, when they heard that, said, This man calleth for Elias.

Matthew 27:48 And straightway one of them ran, and took a spunge, and filled it with vinegar, and put it on a reed, and gave him to drink.

Matthew 27:49 The rest said, Let be, let us see whether Elias will come to save him.

Matthew 27:50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.

Matthew 27:51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

Matthew 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,

Matthew 27:53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Matthew 27:54 Now when the centurion, and they that were with him, watching Jesus, saw the earthquake, and those things that were done, they feared greatly, saying, Truly this was the Son of God.

Matthew 27:55 And many women were there beholding afar off, which followed Jesus from Galilee, ministering unto him:

Matthew 27:56 Among which was Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James and Joses, and the mother of Zebedee's children.

Matthew 27:57 When the even was come, there came a rich man of Arimathaea, named Joseph, who also himself was Jesus' disciple:

Matthew 27:58 He went to Pilate, and begged the body of Jesus. Then Pilate commanded the body to be delivered.

Matthew 27:59 And when Joseph had taken the body, he wrapped it in a clean linen cloth,

Matthew 27:60 And laid it in his own new tomb, which he had hewn out in the rock: and he rolled a great stone to the door of the sepulchre, and departed.

Matthew 27:61 And there was Mary Magdalene, and the other Mary, sitting over against the sepulchre.

Matthew 27:62 Now the next day, that followed the day of the preparation, the chief priests and Pharisees came together unto Pilate,

Matthew 27:63 Saying, Sir, we remember that that deceiver said, while he was yet alive, After three days I will rise again.

Matthew 27:64 Command therefore that the sepulchre be made sure until the third day, lest his disciples come by night, and steal him away, and say unto the people, He is risen from the dead: so the last error shall be worse than the first.

Matthew 27:65 Pilate said unto them, Ye have a watch: go your way, make it as sure as ye can.

Matthew 27:66 So they went, and made the sepulchre sure, sealing the stone, and setting a watch.
Matthew 27, King James Version
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Old 04-09-2009, 06:08 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Re: Psalms 22 and the synoptic Gospels

Quote:
27:46 [ Greek Font Size: – / + | Toggle Font ] [ View in: BYZ / NA26 ]
And about the ninth hour Jesus cried (5656) with a loud voice, saying (5723) , Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that (5748) is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken (5627) me?
peri de thn ennathn wran anebohsen o Ihsouv fwnh megalh legwn hli hli lama sabacyani tout estin yee mou yee mou inati me egkatelipev
Matthew 27: 46, Interlinear

Appears to be an excellent interactive resource:

Interlinear Study Bible on StudyLight.org
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Old 04-09-2009, 06:14 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Re: Psalms 22 and the synoptic Gospels

A marvelous study resource, but the PDF format is locked to copy/paste.

http://www.pesh itta.org/

Darn the filters! delete the space between the "h" and the "i".

Another good resource, again copy protected:

http://www.aramaicpeshi tta.com/AramaicNTtools/dr_george_lamsa_bible.htm

Again, delete the space between the "h" and the "i".
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Old 04-09-2009, 06:28 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Re: Psalms 22 and the synoptic Gospels

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St. Mark 15:1 And straightway in the morning the chief priests held a consultation with the elders and scribes and the whole council, and bound Jesus, and carried him away, and delivered him to Pilate.

St. Mark 15:2 And Pilate asked him, Art thou the King of the Jews? And he answering said unto him, Thou sayest it.

St. Mark 15:3 And the chief priests accused him of many things: but he answered nothing.

St. Mark 15:4 And Pilate asked him again, saying, Answerest thou nothing? behold how many things they witness against thee.

St. Mark 15:5 But Jesus yet answered nothing; so that Pilate marvelled.

St. Mark 15:6 Now at that feast he released unto them one prisoner, whomsoever they desired.

St. Mark 15:7 And there was one named Barabbas, which lay bound with them that had made insurrection with him, who had committed murder in the insurrection.

St. Mark 15:8 And the multitude crying aloud began to desire him to do as he had ever done unto them.

St. Mark 15:9 But Pilate answered them, saying, Will ye that I release unto you the King of the Jews?

St. Mark 15:10 For he knew that the chief priests had delivered him for envy.

St. Mark 15:11 But the chief priests moved the people, that he should rather release Barabbas unto them.

St. Mark 15:12 And Pilate answered and said again unto them, What will ye then that I shall do unto him whom ye call the King of the Jews?

St. Mark 15:13 And they cried out again, Crucify him.

St. Mark 15:14 Then Pilate said unto them, Why, what evil hath he done? And they cried out the more exceedingly, Crucify him.

St. Mark 15:15 And so Pilate, willing to content the people, released Barabbas unto them, and delivered Jesus, when he had scourged him, to be crucified.

St. Mark 15:16 And the soldiers led him away into the hall, called Praetorium; and they call together the whole band.

St. Mark 15:17 And they clothed him with purple, and platted a crown of thorns, and put it about his head,

St. Mark 15:18 And began to salute him, Hail, King of the Jews!

St. Mark 15:19 And they smote him on the head with a reed, and did spit upon him, and bowing their knees worshipped him.

St. Mark 15:20 And when they had mocked him, they took off the purple from him, and put his own clothes on him, and led him out to crucify him.

St. Mark 15:21 And they compel one Simon a Cyrenian, who passed by, coming out of the country, the father of Alexander and Rufus, to bear his cross.

St. Mark 15:22 And they bring him unto the place Golgotha, which is, being interpreted, The place of a skull.

St. Mark 15:23 And they gave him to drink wine mingled with myrrh: but he received it not.

St. Mark 15:24 And when they had crucified him, they parted his garments, casting lots upon them, what every man should take.

St. Mark 15:25 And it was the third hour, and they crucified him.

St. Mark 15:26 And the superscription of his accusation was written over, THE KING OF THE JEWS.

St. Mark 15:27 And with him they crucify two thieves; the one on his right hand, and the other on his left.

St. Mark 15:28 And the scripture was fulfilled, which saith, And he was numbered with the transgressors.

St. Mark 15:29 And they that passed by railed on him, wagging their heads, and saying, Ah, thou that destroyest the temple, and buildest it in three days,

St. Mark 15:30 Save thyself, and come down from the cross.

St. Mark 15:31 Likewise also the chief priests mocking said among themselves with the scribes, He saved others; himself he cannot save.

St. Mark 15:32 Let Christ the King of Israel descend now from the cross, that we may see and believe. And they that were crucified with him reviled him.

St. Mark 15:33 And when the sixth hour was come, there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour.

St. Mark 15:34 And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

St. Mark 15:35 And some of them that stood by, when they heard it, said, Behold, he calleth Elias.

St. Mark 15:36 And one ran and filled a spunge full of vinegar, and put it on a reed, and gave him to drink, saying, Let alone; let us see whether Elias will come to take him down.

St. Mark 15:37 And Jesus cried with a loud voice, and gave up the ghost.

St. Mark 15:38 And the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom.

St. Mark 15:39 And when the centurion, which stood over against him, saw that he so cried out, and gave up the ghost, he said, Truly this man was the Son of God.

St. Mark 15:40 There were also women looking on afar off: among whom was Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James the less and of Joses, and Salome;

St. Mark 15:41 (Who also, when he was in Galilee, followed him, and ministered unto him and many other women which came up with him unto Jerusalem.

St. Mark 15:42 And now when the even was come, because it was the preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath,

St. Mark 15:43 Joseph of Arimathaea, an honourable counsellor, which also waited for the kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus.

St. Mark 15:44 And Pilate marvelled if he were already dead: and calling unto him the centurion, he asked him whether he had been any while dead.

St. Mark 15:45 And when he knew it of the centurion, he gave the body to Joseph.

St. Mark 15:46 And he bought fine linen, and took him down, and wrapped him in the linen, and laid him in a sepulchre which was hewn out of a rock, and rolled a stone unto the door of the sepulchre.

St. Mark 15:47 And Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joses beheld where he was laid.
King James Version
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Old 04-09-2009, 06:29 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Re: Psalms 22 and the synoptic Gospels

Quote:
15:34 [ Greek Font Size: – / + | Toggle Font ] [ View in: BYZ / NA26 ]
And at the ninth hour Jesus cried (5656) with a loud voice, saying (5723) , Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is (5748) , being interpreted (5746) , My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken (5627) me?
kai th wra th ennath ebohsen o Ihsouv fwnh megalh legwn elwi elwi lamma sabacyani o estin meyermhneuomenon o yeov mou o yeov mou eiv ti me egkatelipev
Interlinear, Mark 15:34

Interlinear Study Bible on StudyLight.org
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