The Greatest Principle of Comparative Studies of Religions

[inhumility]

Originally Posted by Victor

Ron is correct! If Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, had wanted to bring the major religions into discussion he would have found it necessary to employ an area large enough to accommodate approximately 3 billion delegates. Why; because each of us discerns our basic faith in as many divergent forms. Doctrine varies from denomination to denomination, sect to sect, individual to individual.

Sir,It is just to clarify that as I have already mentioned in my post #13 of 04-29-2006, 10:49 AM , neither the Conference of Religions was arranged by Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad nor the five questions were set by him, for refresh memory of the worthy participants of this thread , I copy/paste a few paragraphs from my above mentioned post hereunder.
Swami Shugan Chandar had conceived the idea of holding a Conference of different religions/faiths to provide an opportunity to the truth-seekers in them for an Inter-Religious comparison and he approached all the leading figures of Religions in India and even personally visited and exhorted them to participate in the Conference and answer the five questions from the scriptures they believed in, the answers of which he thought was vital for the moral and spiritual uplift of fellow humans. India was most suited at that time to hold such a conference as followers of almost all big religions were present in India and the proverbial justice of British Rule facilitated it and provided the necessary security.
So, in fact, the questions were not selected by Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmadi as some members of the CR have opined, however, in an announcement published by him; Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, requested the participants to make the most use of the Conference and for that he proposed that Claim & Reason should be given by the participants from the Revealed Book of the Religion of the speakers to facilitate an easy comparison. He himself, voluntarily, adhered to it very sincerely. Even otherwise whenever he addressed a gathering or he wrote an essay or a book on a religious topic he made it a point that he generally quoted the references for Claim & Reason from Quran, the pristine revealed book of Islam.
Now a hundred years have passed by. Still there are many truth seekers in the world who would respond to the call of their conscience and select for themselves the truth at all and every cost. I am also a very humble student in this regard. The world is now a global village; to commemorate the event and the centenary of the Conference and to remember the zeal and sincerity of Swami Shugan Chandar and Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad; I have started the thread.

The say that never say that this thing is impossible, some fool guy would come up and make that impossible, a possible, I amend the above as a wise guy. There is no harm in commemorating the centenary of Swami Shugan Chandar and Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, the way it has been proposed. If all join in,God willing, we can make it a success. Thanks for everybody.

[Quahom1]

• The Physical, Moral, and Spiritual States of Man.
• What is the State of Man After Death?
• The Object of Man's Life and the Means of its Attainment.
• The Operation of the Practical Ordinances of the Law in This Life and the Next.
• Sources of Divine Knowledge.

Question one is actually three parts (or seperate questions).

The physical state of man, is a short one. We start as dust (physically), devlop for a time, then end as dust. There is strength in our fragileness, and fragility in our strength. But of its own merit our physical state is for naught. Our physical state is imperfect. (Genesis)

Moral state of man, is relative. Of our own merit, we determine what is right and wise, but what may be right in our eyes may be foolhardy in the eyes of another, therfore we can not in good conscious rely on our own wisdom to determine man's overall morality. (Deuterotomy)

Spiritual state of man, is a fallen one. When alone, we ponder if this is all there is. We ache for something we can't even put a name to. We try to find solace in eachother, but that fades in time, and we continue to search for that which will make us whole, yet we can't describe what it is we need. All we know is that we need, and we are desperate in our search, even relentless (Ecclesiasties, and Songs)

What is the state of man after death: Our body is dust, our mind is still, leaving the spirit of man. What of our spirit? Some say it is asleep, while others state it is awake and with God. Jesus stated (in effect), "as you believe, so it shall be". I opine that His statements were not meant to be taken lightly (Matthew, Mark, John)

The object of man's life and the means of its attainment: Let's reverse the statement. "And the two shall become one" "And man shall be fruitful and multiply". "And man walked with God in the garden..." (Genesis)

The Operation of the practical ordinances of the law in this life and the next: He who is first shall be last, and he who is last, the first. Spend not your time reaping riches (material wealth), here in this time, but rather helping others (thus reaping riches in heaven). What so ever you do to the least of these my brethren, you do unto me. For you say, we kept your word, and we did deeds in your name...but I say I knew you not. (new testament)

Source of Divine Knowledge: That is a tough one. There is the Bible, but it is not welcomed in all walks of life... Ah, but there is the human conscience. "For the laws of God are written into every man's heart." We know better, because we are born with that knowledge. If all books and all adults were gone, and only babies were left, and somehow they survived, they would still know right from wrong. They would still understand the laws of God, for they are written in the heart of every human.

Idolatry
blasphemy
Homicide
Illicit relations
theft
rending limb from a living creature
establishing just courts and law

I think my "religion" is intact, and not man made.

my thoughts

v/r

Q

[queenofsheba]

Originally Posted by inhumility

• The Physical, Moral, and Spiritual States of Man.
• What is the State of Man After Death?
• The Object of Man's Life and the Means of its Attainment.
• The Operation of the Practical Ordinances of the Law in This Life and the Next.
• Sources of Divine Knowledge.

The object of man's life? Maybe there isn't any, but you can always live as if there was.

[Eudaimonist]

What does "The Operation of the Practical Ordinances of the Law in This Life and the Next" mean?


eudaimonia,

Mark

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by Eudaimonist

What does "The Operation of the Practical Ordinances of the Law in This Life and the Next" mean?


eudaimonia,

Mark

How we live our life now, will determine how our life will be in the next realm.

We reap what we sow.

v/r

Q

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by queenofsheba

The object of man's life? Maybe there isn't any, but you can always live as if there was.

Then I submit that if this is true, the only book of scripture worth anything would be Ecclesiastes (all is for naught, nothing new under the sun). I guess I have a difficult time with that concept.

v/r

Q

[Vajradhara]

Originally Posted by Quahom1

How we live our life now, will determine how our life will be in the next realm.

We reap what we sow.

v/r

Q

ah, karma

metta,

~v

[Eudaimonist]

Originally Posted by Quahom1

How we live our life now, will determine how our life will be in the next realm.

We reap what we sow.

Ah, cause and effect.

I didn't answer this particular category before because I didn't understand what it was about, so I'll give my reply below.

I don't believe in "afterlives" in any form, but I do think that our actions, the actions of others, and nonvolitional happenings all influence our lives to some extent, though most important to us are our own actions, and second most are probably the actions of those who most influenced us when we were young and impressionable. I don't believe in "karma" from past lives, but I sure believe in "karma" (e.g.) from our parents! Unfortunately, many of us have to get over a lot of "bad karma" from our younger years. I have my fair share of things to get over.

I don't believe that all the bad things, or all the good things, that happen to us in our lives are caused by previous actions of our own, though certainly our actions in the present have repercussions in the future, both good and bad.

Think of it as being at sea in a sailboat. We don't control the weather or the choppiness of the waves, but if we are rational and skillful at sailing, we may gracefully avoid many bad outcomes that could have happened if we didn't pay attention, or were doing stupid things, or didn't know how to sail. Wisdom (this includes morality, rationality, prudence, and practical life skills) is the overall skill (or set of skills) of navigating the choppy waters of life. Eudaimonia (personal flourishing) is skillful sailing seen from the context of an entire lifetime ("for one swallow does not make a summer, nor does one day; and so too one day, or a short time, does not make a man blessed and happy" -- Aristotle).

Even though how we live our lives now does not completely determine how our lives will progress, the quality of the choices that we make will certainly influence how we evaluate our lives, and form the overall patterns and themes of our lives, since these are the patterns of our own "soul" -- and so our actions echo throughout our lives more than those from any other source. We might be able to reduce the psychological "echos", and "echos" of habit, through various means (e.g. meditation, reflection), but we need to learn to act well also, for our own sake in this life.


eudaimonia,

Mark

[Vajradhara]

Namaste mark,

indeed.

we cannot change the wind though we can adjust our sails.

metta,

~v

[lunamoth]

Originally Posted by Eudaimonist

Think of it as being at sea in a sailboat. We don't control the weather or the choppiness of the waves, but if we are rational and skillful at sailing, we may gracefully avoid many bad outcomes that could have happened if we didn't pay attention, or were doing stupid things, or didn't know how to sail. Wisdom (this includes morality, rationality, prudence, and practical life skills) is the overall skill (or set of skills) of navigating the choppy waters of life. Eudaimonia (personal flourishing) is skillful sailing seen from the context of an entire lifetime ("for one swallow does not make a summer, nor does one day; and so too one day, or a short time, does not make a man blessed and happy" -- Aristotle).

I like the sailboat analogy too. We can either set our sails, or we can drift (or founder). And some days the waves knock us off course, but if we have the skills and determination we can back back on course, or find a new one. I like it especially because it allows for many different 'schools' of wisdom to be effective for skillful sailing.

luna

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by Vajradhara

ah, karma

metta,

~v

I love when you do that Vaj...

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by Eudaimonist

Ah, cause and effect.

Verywell then, what you do will come back to you...tomorrow. (cause and effect).

I agree whole heartedly.

v/r

Q

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by lunamoth

I like the sailboat analogy too. We can either set our sails, or we can drift (or founder). And some days the waves knock us off course, but if we have the skills and determination we can back back on course, or find a new one. I like it especially because it allows for many different 'schools' of wisdom to be effective for skillful sailing.

luna

Yes, the object is to get to where you are going, not sink...

[inhumility]

Originally Posted by Eudaimonist

What does "The Operation of the Practical Ordinances of the Law in This Life and the Next" mean?

I give hereunder a few lines of the answer given by Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of the question.
The effect of the true and perfect Divine law upon man’s heart in this life is that it lifts him from a savage Condition and converts him into a human being, and thereafter invests him with high morals, and finally makes him godly. One of the effects of the practical ordinances of the law is that a person who follows the true law progressively recognizes the rights of his fellow beings and exercises his faculties of equity, and benevolence and true sympathy, on their proper occasions. Such a one shares with his fellow beings, according to their respective ranks, the bounties with which God has favored him, like knowledge, understanding, wealth and means of comfort.
http://www.alislam.org/books/philosophy/1q3.html
One can improve upon the above.

[Eudaimonist]

Originally Posted by Vajradhara

we cannot change the wind though we can adjust our sails.

That's an excellent extension of my metaphor. Exactly one of the points I was trying to get across. Thanks.


eudaimonia,

Mark