the islamic god, and the christian God are not the same, what do you think? - Page 5

wil · 04-17-2007, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dor

Yall got me thinking. Seems to me an easy way to look at this. Names are picked out of a hat nothing meant by it.

Say we are all in a big banquet hall.
I walk up to Q and say oh you are my Moderator. meanwhile across the room....
Wil walks up to Juan and says your my Moderator. Are they the same just cause they are called the same name???

Yes and no.

While in your example they are both moderators, but they are different people.

In the questioned case they are G-d and Allah (meaning G-d in Arabic) So different names, same entity. (must be as Prober intimates as we both believe there is only one G-d) But we have developed different insights and different attributes of our G-d based on our socio-economic input.

So in my mind to make it apples to apples...I can call Q moderator or Joshua, and others call him Dad or husband....we all see him a little differetnly based on our experience...but is it all the same entity.

juantoo3 · 04-17-2007, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wil

...I can and do do.

I can do do too. Every morning, like clockwork.

(TMI?)

Prober · 04-17-2007, 10:48 PM

Right after coffee?

juantoo3 · 04-17-2007, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prober

Right after coffee?

wil · 04-18-2007, 03:27 AM

lol 30-40 minutes after every major meal....thank G-d!

If you were running a train system and you had two or three trains head into the tunnel....and only one head out the other end....you may just lose your job.

Your job on this planet is to take care of the body temple and keep those trains regular...wouldn't want a back up at the end of the line.

Prober · 04-18-2007, 03:26 PM

Wonder what Adam thought when this process started. There wouldn't have been any need to eliminate decay in the Garden, would there?

Just always wondered about that...

Muslimwoman · 04-18-2007, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zaim187

Salaam

Muslims and Jews worship the same God. Early Christians including Jesus also worshipped this God. However Christianity then split up this God into three. Therefore Muslims and Christians did worship the same God but no longer do.

As salaam aleykum zaim

I am sorry but there is a part of this I cannot agree with. I was a Christian before I converted to Islam and my faith/belief in G-d is unchanged. As a Christian I believed in the same G-d Muslims, Jews, etc, believe in. I was taught as a Christian (but did not believe) that Jesus (pbuh) was a manifestation of G-d. Yes Christians have the trinity but the part of the trinity that they call G-d is the same God we believe in. Of course we believe that Christians have gone astray because they attribute partners with G-d but they pray to the same G-d we do.

Salaam

ardenz · 05-23-2007, 09:50 PM

If they are the same God, why all the disputes? ( I know there are finer details involved). Thats why I have no religion.

sorry , thats some of my reaction from my personal experience. I was brought up Catholic and I have close relatives who are Evangelical Christian. I could never accept the idea that one religion is right and everything else wrong. There must be a common truth.

Tao_Equus · 05-23-2007, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardenz

If they are the same God, why all the disputes? ( I know there are finer details involved). Thats why I have no religion.

sorry , thats some of my reaction from my personal experience. I was brought up Catholic and I have close relatives who are Evangelical Christian. I could never accept the idea that one religion is right and everything else wrong. There must be a common truth.

I think of it something like a present. Its the same gift inside and they all fight over who has the best gift-wrap.

ardenz · 05-23-2007, 11:19 PM

lovely - I like the present idea.

Another one I brought up somewhere else is the different pairs of glasses. Though not fair to glasses wearers, or those that may actually be blind.

Muslimwoman · 05-25-2007, 03:15 AM

Ardenz

It depends who you speak to and what they were taught as a child, as no doubt you personally are fully aware. I am a Muslim but I do not feel we are right and everyone else is wrong. I believe in the Torah and the Bible and the Quran. I accept that men have 'interfered' with religion and scriptures. The Quran repeatedly talks about the "people of the book", which refers to the line of Abrahamic faith (Torah, Bible and Quran). Quite frankly I have no idea why all the disputes happen, perhaps some people just have to feel that they are right? Humans are after all frail and egotistical creatures!!

Salaam

Tao_Equus · 05-25-2007, 04:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muslimwoman

Ardenz

It depends who you speak to and what they were taught as a child, as no doubt you personally are fully aware. I am a Muslim but I do not feel we are right and everyone else is wrong. I believe in the Torah and the Bible and the Quran. I accept that men have 'interfered' with religion and scriptures. The Quran repeatedly talks about the "people of the book", which refers to the line of Abrahamic faith (Torah, Bible and Quran). Quite frankly I have no idea why all the disputes happen, perhaps some people just have to feel that they are right? Humans are after all frail and egotistical creatures!!

Salaam

I suggest there is a rather simple answer to that. It is because each of them, as taught to people from a young age, claims to be the true religion. Each of them does pay lip-service to the others in having the same God at the heart of it all, but always there is an underlying, almost unspoken supremecy of the one you are taught being the truest. People like both a measure of individuality and inclusion. In the differences between these faiths people can feel their individuality and within their faith the inclusion. So a religion that is a part of a group, such as the Abrahamics, acts as one size fits all for the psyche. But any division is a weak point, a fracture line, and there will always be those few that will want to make it a gaping chasm. As they succeed it causes insecurity for all. Then, as you correctly state Ego steps in and makes it worse. So whether or not it is the same God they all worship becomes irrelevant. Because as we see in action it is the differences that are emphasised in society not the commonality. And the power-hungry are ever vigilant for this, waiting or fomenting, ready to turn it to their advantage.

TE

Muslimwoman · 05-25-2007, 04:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tao_Equus

I suggest there is a rather simple answer to that. It is because each of them, as taught to people from a young age, claims to be the true religion. Each of them does pay lip-service to the others in having the same God at the heart of it all, but always there is an underlying, almost unspoken supremecy of the one you are taught being the truest. People like both a measure of individuality and inclusion. In the differences between these faiths people can feel their individuality and within their faith the inclusion. So a religion that is a part of a group, such as the Abrahamics, acts as one size fits all for the psyche. But any division is a weak point, a fracture line, and there will always be those few that will want to make it a gaping chasm. As they succeed it causes insecurity for all. Then, as you correctly state Ego steps in and makes it worse. So whether or not it is the same God they all worship becomes irrelevant. Because as we see in action it is the differences that are emphasised in society not the commonality. And the power-hungry are ever vigilant for this, waiting or fomenting, ready to turn it to their advantage.

TE

Hi TE

Nothing I can argue with there. Quite frankly I think you have that one completely sussed, damned good answer.

Salaam

bananabrain · 05-25-2007, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tao_Equus

It is because each of them, as taught to people from a young age, claims to be the true religion.

this is a common misconception. whilst it may be true of christianity and islam, it is not exactly true of judaism, which claims to be the true religion FOR JEWS, but has little to say about what non-jews ought to believe, apart from seven basic guidelines known as the noahide laws. and that is an important difference - it is the difference between being an evangelising, universalistic religion intended for everyone (and therefore "one true" etc) and a particularist religion intended for a distinct group with particular responsibilities.

b'shalom

bananabrain

ardenz · 05-25-2007, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muslimwoman

Ardenz

It depends who you speak to and what they were taught as a child, as no doubt you personally are fully aware. ..............................Quite frankly I have no idea why all the disputes happen, perhaps some people just have to feel that they are right? Humans are after all frail and egotistical creatures!!

Salaam

Actually , I have to declare that my background and my religion from childhood is closely linked to cultural loyalties. I was brought up in Ireland, which has had its history and disputes which somehow combined Religion with social groupings. Church leaders in the past have often enflamed these differences.

From the outside it looks like a religious dispute, but inside - from race memory it is to do with land and percieved injustices. I think this is very different than coming to a religion of your own free will and not having the same cultural background.