The Message

[wil]

Originally Posted by Joedjr

Hi Wil,
Agree with when it is not easy. But common sense would dictate that we should keep ourselves safe, maybe for no other reason than that we could be servants for another day.

Namaste Joe,

If I were to contemplate the choices of Jesus, Gandhi and Martin Luther King in regards to non-violence. It seems to me they all were servants for many more days than they would have been had they chosen a different path. Would there be a holiday for Dr. King if he'd lead a revolt? Would independence have been won and hundreds of movies and books been written if Gandhi would have staged a bloody coup? Where would we be if Jesus would have given up that cup?

It is a choice we make, but I do believe he has provided direction.

[Dor]

Originally Posted by China Cat Sunflower

There's a lot more to it than just roping off the beatitudes.

Chris

That is the problem with most "Christian" they want to pick and choose what makes them feel good anything that causes just the slight disturbance or uncomfortability is pushed away and over looked.

[wil]

Originally Posted by Dor

That is the problem with most "Christian" they want to pick and choose what makes them feel good anything that causes just the slight disturbance or uncomfortability is pushed away and over looked.

Namaste Dor,

Great to see you around!

Is there anything more uncomfortable than loving your enemy? Than turning the other cheek? Than giving up your next article of clothing?

[Gatekeeper]

Originally Posted by Dor

That is the problem with most "Christian" they want to pick and choose what makes them feel good anything that causes just the slight disturbance or uncomfortability is pushed away and over looked.

Perhaps some simply see things in a broader sense than others. You know that there is much allegory in the writ, so also is there much room for interpretation of the allegorical.

I also wonder how the authors of scripture, could effectively communicate what they were implying, when the use of language in and of itself is quite vague, and flexible.

Even if every word of Scripture is perfectly chosen, it still doesn't "forgive" the imperfection of the "pool" of words from which modern translations have been created.

Love,

James

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by Dor

That is the problem with most "Christian" they want to pick and choose what makes them feel good anything that causes just the slight disturbance or uncomfortability is pushed away and over looked.

I think the term you are looking for is "Cafeteria Christian"...

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by wil

Namaste Dor,

Great to see you around!

Is there anything more uncomfortable than loving your enemy? Than turning the other cheek? Than giving up your next article of clothing?

Let's disect what "love your enemy", "turn the other cheek" and "giving the shirt of your back" means...Is it "agape" love? "Philos" love? What is it?

[Tao_Equus]

Originally Posted by Quahom1

Let's disect what "love your enemy", "turn the other cheek" and "giving the shirt of your back" means...Is it "agape" love? "Philos" love? What is it?

Agape is restricted to those you would like to mate with, filo is everyone else.

Tao

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by Tao_Equus

Agape is restricted to those you would like to mate with, filo is everyone else.

Tao

I can't believe you screwed that up Tao! Agape is non emotional love "Do what is best for another, because it is best for them". Philos is brotherly love "familial love". Eros is physical love, and there are two more that evade my thinking at the moment...

[wil]

Originally Posted by Quahom1

Let's disect what "love your enemy", "turn the other cheek" and "giving the shirt of your back" means...Is it "agape" love? "Philos" love? What is it?

Jesus describes it as agape love, basically instructing others to love others including our enemies as G!d loves us.

But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.

[cyberpi]

Originally Posted by wil

So you believe feeding and nurturing is incorrect? Caring and compassion is wrong?

The issue I make is this: any feeding, nurturing, care, and compassion reflects on the gardener. To help someone else obtain green thumbs, you wish to help others become their own gardeners... not your plants. The answer is no, it is not incorrect, but that judgment and rebuke is a necessary part of feeding and nurturing. Man does not live by bread alone...

If my children came to me asking if we were growing cabbages or roses and they weren't growing as we wished then what would we do, then my reply would be: People are not plants. Each individual chooses the seeds to plant and where to plant them in this world, and wishes different things from them. You are responsible for your plants and I am responsible for mine. If there is a plant that you are fond of that I do not think bears fruit, then you can plant yours and I am going to plant the variety that I believe does bear fruit so that we will each be able to judge which of these plants bears fruit and to keep and plant it again next year. So then children, what seeds do you wish to plant?

I personally love my children, but I find that people who have children often will not hassle with loving their neighbor or accept being loved by others in the same way. An enemy is even further removed. If we each became like children then things would be different.

Originally Posted by wil

I am hearing rebukes and judgment, and you have free will to make your choices in this regard. It does give me information, should I offer you my coat?

Why, do you think I have brought you up against a law? I offer you my coat. I do judge any judgment against judging as being self incriminating, and I do rebuke any rebuke against the act of rebuking. In other words I do judge and openly say that judgment and rebuke are a good tree that does bear fruit.

But, if you deem that my judgment and rebukes are really just weeds, or that I am a spade, or that I am merely throwing stones, or that it simply does not bear fruit, then I will happily withdraw and go plant somewhere else. What do you say?

[wil]

Originally Posted by cyberpi

But, if you deem that my judgment and rebukes are really just weeds, or that I am a spade, or that I am merely throwing stones, or that it simply does not bear fruit, then I will happily withdraw and go plant somewhere else. What do you say?

37-38"Don't pick on people, jump on their failures, criticize their faults— unless, of course, you want the same treatment. Don't condemn those who are down; that hardness can boomerang. Be easy on people; you'll find life a lot easier. Give away your life; you'll find life given back, but not merely given back—given back with bonus and blessing. Giving, not getting, is the way. Generosity begets generosity."

[cyberpi]

wil: Do you wish me to hear and judge your words, or not? Your choice.

Please answer plainly. I do not wish to be a hypocrite. I desire anyone and everyone to judge me and my words. I seek God's judgment.

[wil]

Originally Posted by cyberpi

wil: Do you wish me to hear and judge your words, or not? Your choice.

Please answer plainly. I do not wish to be a hypocrite. I desire anyone and everyone to judge me and my words. I seek God's judgment.

Namaste Cyberpi,

Those are not my words, they are The Message Bible's interpretation of what Jesus said. You may choose to hear or judge Jesus's words or mine.

35But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.
36Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.
37Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven:
38Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.

[Joedjr]

Originally Posted by wil

But my question is, with all our questioning of other Christians as to what and how they should think, with all our looking at other faiths and telling them they have to come over and be saved and learn our 'truth' how does all that fit in with what Jesus is said to have said according to this passage from Luke 6?

Hi Wil,
I had to go back and read the original op, was getting a little lost in thought. Maybe it doesn't have anything to do with Luke 6, but what mainstream Christians are taught and those ideas and topics that get the heavy emphasis.
Chris add something earlier, that the whole of Christian thought doesn't rest on one selection of gospel. My bible has over 2000 pages of text to use, to try to come up with an idea of what G-D wants. I read something one time, can't remember where, it went something like this: If Christianity was practiced like it is described in the bible, then a majority of us Hindus would be Christians.
So maybe it's not so much of what Luke 6 says but how some Christians are brainwashed to act.

Joe

[wil]

Originally Posted by Joedjr

Hi Wil,
I had to go back and read the original op, was getting a little lost in thought. Maybe it doesn't have anything to do with Luke 6, but what mainstream Christians are taught and those ideas and topics that get the heavy emphasis.
Chris add something earlier, that the whole of Christian thought doesn't rest on one selection of gospel. My bible has over 2000 pages of text to use, to try to come up with an idea of what G-D wants. I read something one time, can't remember where, it went something like this: If Christianity was practiced like it is described in the bible, then a majority of us Hindus would be Christians.
So maybe it's not so much of what Luke 6 says but how some Christians are brainwashed to act.

Joe

Namaste Joe,

I agree and I get nailed for selecting texts which indicate that we should be working on ourselves and concern ourselves with our own growth, and treat others with respect always.

Folks want me to focus on other parts of the bible and I ask well how does what it says here work with what it says there?? I'm not going to focus on separation or berating people to come to Jesus, or telling folks they are going to hell. I'll go ahead and focus on loving my fellow man, where ever they are!

Now I've run into a number of Hindu's in temples who revere Jesus as a guru, and his teachings as part of Hinduism. One priest had an "I heart Jesus" chain around his neck and in another temple a picture of Jesus was in the main hall.