Tolerance within spirituality - Page 2

Sacredstar · 02-16-2005, 08:13 PM

Dear Bandit

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bandit

If it were true we are all on the same path or all paths lead to the same place, then EVERYONE would be helping and watching out for each other.
(

Not all on a spiritual path have healed the root causes of their core issues some have just exchanged the corporate market for the spiritual one. They may have changed their beliefs but it takes a great deal more to integrate the knowledge and live it. But yet those that are on the healing spiritual path certainly do support and watch over each other. I have even been blessed to receive from other's on this very forum in this respect and my heart as been moved by those that have contacted me on and off forum.

I would say yes all paths of light eventually arrive at the same place of LOVE the source of all creation.

Rebellion well scholars would say that Jesus led the rebellion against anti-love and the more radical his sayings the more sure you can be that Jesus said them.

So was Jesus a Radical Sage?

Love beyond measure

Sacredstar

Bandit · 02-16-2005, 08:14 PM

I have one more thing to leave here. this is not about a spiritual path or religious belief, but it relates.

Back home we have a certain lake that spawns out from a river. It is primarily used for runoff in the time of flooding, yet it stays full of water year round.
In the summer there is a tiny beach area the city keeps clean and people are allowed to swim when a lifguard is on duty, on the weekends.

Everyone knows it is a very dangerous lake because the seaweed on the outside of the ropes is so thick, that people most likely get caught in it and drown.
I took my little raft down the river and into the lake. I jumped in the water for a quick swim and within about a minute the seaweed had wrapped itself around my legs and stomach and it was pulling me down fiercly and I became very scared because I could not break free by kicking it off. I had taken in some water into my lungs because that was how bad the seaweed was pulling me under.

I went down into the water and faced the seaweed and began to tackle it ripping it from off of my legs making sure to not get my arms caught in it. I am a very good swimmer but this was a very horrible frightening experience.
I cut myself loose and got back into the boat, feeling and seeing the seaweed all around me... Rowed the boat to the sand area and got out on land and just sat there in awe and considered all the deaths that had taken place in that lake. Then looked at the signs that say NO SWIMMING.

NO SWIMMING. NO SWIMMING

Across the lake I saw two guys come up to the lake on bikes and stand there talking to each other.
I thought to myself, "I hope they do not go into this water if they are not good swimmers"
But I never shouted anything to them about what had just happened to me, but we all made eye contact.

I got back into the raft and headed back into the river and paddled back to my car.
That evening about 3 hours after the episode, while watching the 6:00 News, there were two boys who were just found drowned in that Lake.
I felt something was wrong about that whole scene and I knew it was the same two boys that I had seen arrive at the Lake because the report mentioned there bikes at the scene and there age met the description.

No one could stop there death. Not even me. But if I am ever at that Lake again and I see someone wanting to swim in it, I am going to talk them out of it. However, the city has finally put up a fence around it and the public is no longer allowed into the area.

I hope someone here can relate to this in a spiritual way and realize it is possible to die spiritually or not be fully awake to it and that spiritual growth can be stunted, and that is not what we want.

Bandit · 02-16-2005, 08:41 PM

Hey Star

Quote:

I would say yes all paths of light eventually arrive at the same place of LOVE the source of all creation.

Maybe, but so far I am not convinced of that, because all paths are not of light. In the path of light I think that is true.

Quote:

Rebellion well scholars would say that Jesus led the rebellion against anti-love and the more radical his sayings the more sure you can be that Jesus said them.

So was Jesus a Radical Sage?

I don't see his teaching as rebellion, if someone else wants to see it that way that is up to them.
I think rebellion has a spirit to it, that sometimes can be good but most likely it goes against universal law which I see as Gods law. We can only swim against the current for so long until it will wear us out.
I dont think Jesus was all that radical in his message. If someone else wants to see it that way, that is up to them.

I spent quite a bit of my life being a rebel just to see what I could get away with, but we dont get away with anything. Though it might appear that way for awhile.

Quahom1 · 02-16-2005, 09:17 PM

Interesting story.

The "spiritual" similarity to this could be:

1. Don't go into the lake without the LifeGuard watching (don't go into the world without God watching you).

2. If you ever get tangled in the seaweed, stop moving, take a deep breath and do the "dead man's float" (the air in your lungs acts as a life vest or floatation device). If the tangles of the world get hold of you, stop thrashing, and be still. Let the words of God (breath of life) keep you afloat. Eventually the weeds will let go.

3. Never think twice about starting a conversation with someone, epecially when they are standing next to where you were before your ordeal. And never be afraid to admit your mistake. You might just stop someone else from making the same mistake.

Here is my story for thought. 1982, I was driving from Manchester, Connecticutt to New York City at 0300 (AM), I was tired, and had to be at work by 0600. Moving down I-95 (interstate Freeway) at 70 mph this man suddenly stepped partially in front of my car frantically waving his arms. At first I intended to ignore him (plus carjacking was becoming all the rage in the city areas), but as I passed him, the desperate look in his eyes just wouldn't go away from my mind's eye. So I slowed, pulled over and backed up to where he was.

"Can I help you?" I asked.

"No, sir, I just helped you."

Then we both walked 200 yards in the direction I was originally moving.

The entire freeway was gone! All six lanes ended in a wide chasm of about 100 yards, before the freeway began again. A hundred or so feet below us were what was left of a couple of dozen cars (and people). The overpass' lynch pins had severed, and the entire bridge dropped off of NewHaven, CT's waterway. The State police had blocked the freeway, but I had slipped past before they did. Mine was the last car coming down that road...

If that man hadn't tried to communicate with me and warn me, well, I wouldn't be ya'll's favorite Coast Guardsman, now would I?

You know, there are two ways to say oh My God !!! I very much prefer the way I said it as opposed to the way those in the cars below had said it, on their way down...

v/r

Q

Faithfulservant · 02-16-2005, 11:35 PM

Thank you Bandit and Q for your stories.. I was extremely moved with both of them.

Bandit · 02-17-2005, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quahom1

Interesting story.

The "spiritual" similarity to this could be:

1. Don't go into the lake without the LifeGuard watching (don't go into the world without God watching you).

2. If you ever get tangled in the seaweed, stop moving, take a deep breath and do the "dead man's float" (the air in your lungs acts as a life vest or floatation device). If the tangles of the world get hold of you, stop thrashing, and be still. Let the words of God (breath of life) keep you afloat. Eventually the weeds will let go.

3. Never think twice about starting a conversation with someone, epecially when they are standing next to where you were before your ordeal. And never be afraid to admit your mistake. You might just stop someone else from making the same mistake.

Here is my story for thought. 1982, I was driving from Manchester, Connecticutt to New York City at 0300 (AM), I was tired, and had to be at work by 0600. Moving down I-95 (interstate Freeway) at 70 mph this man suddenly stepped partially in front of my car frantically waving his arms. At first I intended to ignore him (plus carjacking was becoming all the rage in the city areas), but as I passed him, the desperate look in his eyes just wouldn't go away from my mind's eye. So I slowed, pulled over and backed up to where he was.

"Can I help you?" I asked.

"No, sir, I just helped you."

Then we both walked 200 yards in the direction I was originally moving.

The entire freeway was gone! All six lanes ended in a wide chasm of about 100 yards, before the freeway began again. A hundred or so feet below us were what was left of a couple of dozen cars (and people). The overpass' lynch pins had severed, and the entire bridge dropped off of NewHaven, CT's waterway. The State police had blocked the freeway, but I had slipped past before they did. Mine was the last car coming down that road...

If that man hadn't tried to communicate with me and warn me, well, I wouldn't be ya'll's favorite Coast Guardsman, now would I?

You know, there are two ways to say oh My God !!! I very much prefer the way I said it as opposed to the way those in the cars below had said it, on their way down...

v/r

Q

Hey Q, that is a most overwhelming trip down the freeway. it is interesting how we can be on the right path and out of nowhere this source of lurking and destruction just appears.
Like it is all around us and comes in many forms.
Wether it be seaweed or a huge hole in the road, it can take us down, but it is impossible when we keep our hearts and minds focused on the Lord. He is not going to fail us when we keep the communication open, He will send the answer. I see a spiritual path in that experience. Keep it close to you, our favorite CoastGuardsman!

Sacredstar · 02-17-2005, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bandit

Hey Star

Maybe, but so far I am not convinced of that, because all paths are not of light. In the path of light I think that is true. I dont think Jesus was all that radical in his message. If someone else wants to see it that way, that is up to them. I spent quite a bit of my life being a rebel just to see what I could get away with, but we dont get away with anything. Though it might appear that way for awhile.

Hi Bandit well I said path of light.

I wonder what BB would say about the radical message of Jesus, I feel humilating the Jewish priests was pretty radical.

Oh yes so did I my father he was a rebel with a cause, I just chose freedom and rebelled against parental control and domination. I relinguished the spiritual warrior a long time ago on both a human and soul level, but I must say I am enjoying the replacement of the Christ Lionheart.

Love beyond measure

Sacredstar

Sacredstar · 02-17-2005, 09:40 PM

Well if we allow the soul and spirit to navigate we would never be in a space of danger but that does take complete surrender of control to GOD and the guys find it very hard to surrender.....

Onwards and upwards

Sacredstar

Virtual_Cliff · 02-18-2005, 01:55 PM

What a lot of interesting stories. It reminds me of those dinky little tracts I used to read years ago. I commend Bandit's prompt action in intervening in the fight. He did so not for moral reasons but practical ones. We only have one physical life, and although less important than the spiritual one, I'm all for saving it when you can.

We are finding out now that sometimes we need to be careful about being too careful. Kids are now discouraged or prevented from playing any game where they might get hurt, or going anywhere they might get lost. Grown people are being told that a bag of nuts "may contain nuts" and so on. The result is a society of bored bad-tempered frustrated people with no sense of how to take care of themselves. I have touched the live wire and the neutral wire simultaneously, as a child I fell of my bike regularly, fell off trees, got lost far from home; as an adult I have crashed my car more than once... not to mention many other disasters of culpable stupidity

. As a result, I feel I have become progressively wiser, in a way I would not have done if I had just read a book on common sense. All I'm saying is that it's easier to be a moralistic bore than it is to keep quiet.

As for being a rebel, can you honestly look around you and see the blasphemies being carried out as government policy and not feel bound to rebel? We are systematically killing and robbing the poor of the earth to provide toys for the rich. The earth itself is being destroyed as we watch. Isn't this a good time to rebel?

Sacredstar · 02-18-2005, 02:13 PM

Dear VC

What about 'emotive social evolution' and people power?

My father taught me that when the people are united the power is with the people, hand in hand, side by side in the front line creating a Kingdom of Love a new world for our children the future of humanity.

Blessings in abundance

Sacredstar

Bandit · 02-18-2005, 08:13 PM

Quote:

As for being a rebel, can you honestly look around you and see the blasphemies being carried out as government policy and not feel bound to rebel? We are systematically killing and robbing the poor of the earth to provide toys for the rich. The earth itself is being destroyed as we watch. Isn't this a good time to rebel?

Yes. Someone out there is of a bad persuasion is trying to own the planet.
There is a definate lack of love and trust and reguard in all respects to life.
Bigger than the earth has ever seen.
So people are either blind or just ignoring it or don't care.
But there will always be a few who try and they are the ones who stand in the middle and fight for what is right, who are willing to make a stand to make things better and declare this is has to change. Sending out the signal- "Please listen and watch"

1TI 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing
spirits, and doctrines of devils;

(Revelation 16:13-14)
(13) And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs {come} out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
(14) For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, {which} go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

ECC 1:14 I have seen all the works that are done under the sun; and, behold, all is {vanity} and vexation of spirit. (KJV) ECC 4:6 Better {is} an handful {with}quietness, than both the hands full {with} travail and vexation of spirit.

This is how we know, not everyone is on the same path.

It has come to a point where we have to become rebels to straighten out the rebels.

That is how I see Jesus too

.

Bandit · 02-18-2005, 08:45 PM

Over all I think tolerance is a very easy thing, but it is learned. The problem comes in when beliefs infinge on others. In the extreme of organized crime, gangs and taliban that teach violence and destruction.

Maybe even cults that teach sacrifice of human life.

No doubt, It has always been this way.
However I do see an increase in this type of thinking over the last decade. It goes beyond just the basic religious beliefs.
I look back at the 60s, 70s and 80s where the same basic beliefs are there and I dont think we were nearly as stressed and perplexed back then.
I see a spirit of sarcasm filled with pride and less humility, that I did not see in days gone by...and things like this.
People really did care about each other with sincerity and not just a *form* of love. Where as today it takes drastic measure like Ground Zero to hear the call and alert us to bring people together to work together.

Please and Thank You is still spoken, but it is felt every time?

Quahom1 · 02-18-2005, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bandit

Over all I think tolerance is a very easy thing, but it is learned. The problem comes in when beliefs infinge on others. In the extreme of organized crime, gangs and taliban that teach violence and destruction.

Maybe even cults that teach sacrifice of human life.

No doubt, It has always been this way.
However I do see an increase in this type of thinking over the last decade. It goes beyond just the basic religious beliefs.
I look back at the 60s, 70s and 80s where the same basic beliefs are there and I dont think we were nearly as stressed and perplexed back then.
I see a spirit of sarcasm filled with pride and less humility, that I did not see in days gone by...and things like this.
People really did care about each other with sincerity and not just a *form* of love. Where as today it takes drastic measure like Ground Zero to hear the call and alert us to bring people together to work together.

Please and Thank You is still spoken, but it is felt every time?

Hello Bandit, et al.

I can't answer for governments and their behaviors, but on local levels of living I have seen quite the opposite. In fact the behavior of the people seem to absolutely contridict what the media tries to roil up into a frenzy.

I also notice that the care begins with "me" (in other words, I begin instead of waiting for the other to begin). From Russia, to Turkey, to Israel, to Greece, Japan, The Philipines, the South Pacific Islands, The Middle East...everywhere I've been, I've noticed that if I initiate, then the response usually is to reciprocate. Small groups of people together seem to work best, while in larger group (like huge cities), it doesn't always work as well.

Simple things like a smile, even with the eyes, or hold a door open, or letting someone go ahead of you, or playing jacks with a child, or listening to a elder person while they tell about yester year, while standing in the middle of a store isle...people notice this with veiled but intense interest.

I have found that as contagious as bad manners and harsh words are, kind words and good manners are just as contagious.

I'd invite you all to try an experiment. Deliberately use your most polite and kind demeanor on some stranger regardless of the situation, and watch what happens to you, to them and to those around you watching

You might be very surprised at the lingering results.

v/r

Q

Sacredstar · 02-18-2005, 11:56 PM

Dear Q

I agree

My heart overflowed with joy by the response of the general public to the South Asia disaster and more and more people and taking action. It was just today I received info about the next 'Be the Change' conference being held in London. There is joy, excitement, love and passion for change in the air.

http://www.bethechange.org.uk

being love

Sacredstar

Bandit · 02-19-2005, 01:04 AM

Maybe Q in your everyday public places. But I would not say in any given situation. You might also get a switch blade pulled on you for smiling or opening a door for the wrong person. I lived on the streets for awhile and I know what kind of people are lurking out there. More numbers than what people realize.

People used to walk down the streets at midnight hand in hand.
In some U.S. cities today if you are walking after 10 PM, you can be arrested for prostitution or intent with drugs and be hauled off to jail, with no evidence. We are also not allowed to stand outside in specific places of business to talk with someone. You go IN, or you go somewhere else and this is not a loitering issue.

The planets destruction in land and water is not being properly addressed. I see a lot of talk but I dont see a good answer yet.

You have a good spirit Q and want the best for everyone and you want to protect and help others, and so do I want that. I cannot ignore what I have seen and I remember where I have been.

You know the glass is either half full or half empty. Right? Well I see the possibility of it 5 different ways.
Half full, half empty. The possiblity of a Full glass and even an overflowing glass. Then it is possible it can be knocked over and you have an empty glass.
So it is not just in the way we view something but the possiblities in it also.

When we have a disaster we have many people who come together, but I don't see this in a regular basis with just the every day people. We also have those who will loot and take advantage of others through price jacking during a disaster.

There was no such thing as police walking the halls of schools 20 years ago and having children walk through detectors searched every day for weapons.
Certainly not every school has to do this, but why do we have to do it period?

When I was kid, we slept every night with the front door open and windows open with no fear, and so did evryone else.
That era is gone and may be gone forever.

I can't change it and I can't bring it back, no matter how much I smile and how much good I do for others. And yes we have to tolerate it.
So now we have a generation behind us, who thinks all this is normal and just the way it is. Are the belief systems and spirituality better today?

I can still remain positive and applaud the good deeds, but Sadly, I am not convinced that things today are better over all.

Thanks for listening. I did not mean to get all side tracked on this, but I guess I just wanted someone to listen.