What if....

[seattlegal]

Originally Posted by Muslimwoman

Can a test be a test if you are given the answers beforehand?

This is known as teaching/schooling.

The test is faith, to believe in something you do not have the answers for.

Salaam

Faith, hope, and love, in the Christian tradition.

[Snoopy]

Hi 17th,

In a rare attack of seriousness I offer some of my thoughts. If you don’t like them, I have others. From your OP:

Originally Posted by 17th Angel

What if the religion you follow is wrong?

Maybe one shouldn’t be “following”?

What if your holy book is wrong and X holy book is right? What if none of these holy books/religions/ways are right?

Maybe one should step back from this either/or idea of right and wrong?

What if..... We have no reason, no purpose.... But, to die.

If the purpose is only to die then what is the purpose to be born?

I am getting this feeling like life... Life is like a condition.... You know?... And religion is the sedative.... Given in dose's to ease the pain and make you forget.... To put that false smile on your face as you sit alone in a chair slowly rocking back and forth, back and forth.... Everything is now ok and you feel bliss...... But, your missing the truth and reality.... Like freaking blinkers....

Then don’t take a sedative and stay awake.

I pondered one night pleading for god to proove that all my what if's are nothing to dwell on, then it made me think..... There is no answer, what if god isn't there... what if it is allah, or some space alien thingy bob.... Or something else that no one has figured.... Or nothing is there?

That’s up to each of us to dwell on. Hence, amongst other things, this forum!

Then looking at the statistics... Of likleyness to be born... That is unreal.... How freaking lucky am I? How lucky are you? We freaking made it...

Exactly. Dwell on that! But don’t expect an “answer” from anyone but yourself.

There has to be more than just death...

So you’ve answered your question above.

Why isn't anything/one coming and resting my mind putting me at ease?

Did you get some piece of paper at birth you mean advising you that this would happen at some point? That may sound facetious but I am wondering what it is that you might be expecting, and why you would expect it. If you want to “put your mind at ease” you have to find some solitude, look inwards and start your self enquiry there. Listen to yourself.

Then I go through the stage of...... Well How unlucky am I? Why did I have to be born? A human... With, adequate... Intelligence....

As you say, statistically…


But if your feeling of being unlucky persists, take solace in the fact that our existence in this current form, as a living entity is, of course, like all phenomena, a temporary arrangement. But while you’re here, you could enjoy the view.


s.

[17th Angel]

Originally Posted by Snoopy

Hi 17th,

In a rare attack of seriousness I offer some of my thoughts. If you don’t like them, I have others. From your OP:

Maybe one shouldn’t be “following”?

The opposite of follow is to lead? So you're suggesting I start my own religion?

Originally Posted by Snoopy

Maybe one should step back from this either/or idea of right and wrong?

So no right or wrong? What do you judge your actions by then?

Originally Posted by Snoopy

If the purpose is only to die then what is the purpose to be born?

To die?

Originally Posted by Snoopy

Then don’t take a sedative and stay awake.

Why, do I need to stay alert?

Originally Posted by Snoopy

That’s up to each of us to dwell on. Hence, amongst other things, this forum!

Exactly. Dwell on that! But don’t expect an “answer” from anyone but yourself.

So you’ve answered your question above.

So I can ask, but the answer has to come from myself? I can't trust me lol... I freaking know me.... Why would I want to trust me?

Originally Posted by Snoopy

Did you get some piece of paper at birth you mean advising you that this would happen at some point? That may sound facetious but I am wondering what it is that you might be expecting, and why you would expect it. If you want to “put your mind at ease” you have to find some solitude, look inwards and start your self enquiry there. Listen to yourself.

Well I don't expect anything as I myself believe in nothing... How sad eh? But, If I am wrong, I would expect the true ruler if it is a supreme being and not man.. To come and say hey hey hey son, look you're freaking doing this wrong... Do this.... It will be worth it in the end..

There you go with that listen to myself thing again! NUTS! NUTS I TELL'S YA.

Originally Posted by Snoopy

But if your feeling of being unlucky persists, take solace in the fact that our existence in this current form, as a living entity is, of course, like all phenomena, a temporary arrangement. But while you’re here, you could enjoy the view.

I don't feel lucky nor unlucky... Just trying to put everyone's view on it... I just crawl along stoned out of my face 80% of the time..... And that does it for me... I then just sit talking of insane notions and such..... Believe me... I do enjoy the view.... Even though at times it can be distorted, blurred and not a true perception I enjoy it.

[Snoopy]

Originally Posted by 17th Angel

The opposite of follow is to lead? So you're suggesting I start my own religion?

There you go with that either/or thinking again. I wasn’t suggesting you start your own religion but of course you could. The only danger seems to be that you’d make a lot of money. Or none at all.

So no right or wrong? What do you judge your actions by then?

I was suggesting “holy books” be seen in a more different way than right or wrong. In a non-religious analogy: Blur, Oasis, The Killers and Scissor Sisters are not right or wrong. As to my own actions I evaluate them with my internal ethical code (as does everyone?), which I guess comes from, er, my entire life’s experience, which includes, but is not limited by, my interest in a “religion.”

To die?

This “either/or” thinking is really popular with you, isn’t it!!

Why, do I need to stay alert?

I thought you were saying about avoiding religion, because you saw it as a sedative. So I was just saying don’t take the sedative. Whether or not you want to stay alert is clearly a matter for you! (Personally I think it's crucial)

So I can ask, but the answer has to come from myself?

Ultimately, yes. It could not be otherwise.

I can't trust me lol... I freaking know me.... Why would I want to trust me?

I don’t know you, so I can’t say. Don’t people trust you in the offline world? Didn’t people trust you when you were in the Armed Forces? Have you reneged when people have trusted you on this forum?

Well I don't expect anything as I myself believe in nothing... How sad eh? But, If I am wrong, I would expect the true ruler if it is a supreme being and not man.. To come and say hey hey hey son, look you're freaking doing this wrong... Do this.... It will be worth it in the end..

There you go with that listen to myself thing again! NUTS! NUTS I TELL'S YA.

No-one knows this stuff for sure 17th, IMO. We’re all just farting around in the dark. And all any of us can do, is listen to ourselves, after perhaps doing the research, the reading, the talking, whatever…

I don't feel lucky nor unlucky... Just trying to put everyone's view on it... I just crawl along stoned out of my face 80% of the time..... And that does it for me... I then just sit talking of insane notions and such..... Believe me... I do enjoy the view.... Even though at times it can be distorted, blurred and not a true perception I enjoy it.

All Hail 17th Angel, the Life Oil of the CR engine!

s.

[17th Angel]

Originally Posted by Snoopy

There you go with that either/or thinking again. I wasn’t suggesting you start your own religion but of course you could. The only danger seems to be that you’d make a lot of money. Or none at all.

Either/or thinking... I do that alot? I have no idea what you are talking of..... Please for me, could you define it in a simple way?

Originally Posted by Snoopy

I was suggesting “holy books” be seen in a more different way than right or wrong. In a non-religious analogy: Blur, Oasis, The Killers and Scissor Sisters are not right or wrong. As to my own actions I evaluate them with my internal ethical code (as does everyone?), which I guess comes from, er, my entire life’s experience, which includes, but is not limited by, my interest in a “religion.”

Ok yeah, I see where you be coming from.

Originally Posted by Snoopy

I thought you were saying about avoiding religion, because you saw it as a sedative. So I was just saying don’t take the sedative. Whether or not you want to stay alert is clearly a matter for you! (Personally I think it's crucial)

But as someone else stated everything is a sedative? Job, hobbies, whatever.... lol.... I dunno man...

Originally Posted by Snoopy

Ultimately, yes. It could not be otherwise.

I don’t know you, so I can’t say. Don’t people trust you in the offline world? Didn’t people trust you when you were in the Armed Forces? Have you reneged when people have trusted you on this forum?

I only know like three people in the offline world lol...... I guess some trusted me, some even with their lives... But that was then and we are now. If I have an objective goal and so on... I can focus and yes I can be trusted to get it done... But my own personal judgement. Mumbling and muttering in my cranium? Oh no, we don't listen to that.... That ends in bad things.

Originally Posted by Snoopy

No-one knows this stuff for sure 17th, IMO. We’re all just farting around in the dark. And all any of us can do, is listen to ourselves, after perhaps doing the research, the reading, the talking, whatever…

So with yew, unlike a few others I was talking to, are realy into this spiritual world thing. So why can't they help guide you? :\ save you all this farting aboot!

Originally Posted by Snoopy

All Hail 17th Angel, the Life Oil of the CR engine!

*giggles*

[Snoopy]

Originally Posted by 17th Angel

Either/or thinking... I do that alot? I have no idea what you are talking of..... Please for me, could you define it in a simple way?

I would say that either / or thinking means to view something in terms of either one quality or its opposite e.g. a holy book or religion is right or wrong. But it is not appropriate to view all things like that e.g. you don’t view Oasis as just having one quality or its opposite. For some things “either / or” thinking is appropriate, e.g. virginity (one either is one or one is not one - stop giggling), but for others, it is not.

But as someone else stated everything is a sedative? Job, hobbies, whatever.... lol.... I dunno man...

Can’t speak for others!

I only know like three people in the offline world lol...... I guess some trusted me, some even with their lives... But that was then and we are now. If I have an objective goal and so on... I can focus and yes I can be trusted to get it done... But my own personal judgement. Mumbling and muttering in my cranium? Oh no, we don't listen to that.... That ends in bad things.

Well we’re all unique. All 8 billion of us. If you’re aware how bad things follow, maybe you should address that, if you want to? What starts it off? What is the process?

So with yew, unlike a few others I was talking to, are realy into this spiritual world thing. So why can't they help guide you? :\ save you all this farting aboot!

Now it’s my turn: What do you mean please?

s.


PS freaky avatar!!!

[17th Angel]

Originally Posted by Snoopy

I would say that either / or thinking means to view something in terms of either one quality or its opposite e.g. a holy book or religion is right or wrong. But it is not appropriate to view all things like that e.g. you don’t view Oasis as just having one quality or its opposite. For some things “either / or” thinking is appropriate, e.g. virginity (one either is one or one is not one - stop giggling), but for others, it is not.

Ah I get it now aiiiiiight...

Originally Posted by Snoopy

Can’t speak for others!



Well we’re all unique. All 8 billion of us. If you’re aware how bad things follow, maybe you should address that, if you want to? What starts it off? What is the process?

Fair enough.

No idea... Too many questions in one hit... I got brain freeze.

Originally Posted by Snoopy

So with yew, unlike a few others I was talking to, are realy into this spiritual world thing. So why can't they help guide you? :\ save you all this farting aboot!

Now it’s my turn: What do you mean please?

Well, you know... You're into spiritual thangs... and such and paths.... But you say we are all farting around in the dark... But if there are spirits there, why don't they help you out? Instead of leaving to fart around...

Originally Posted by Snoopy

PS freaky avatar!!!

Oh you know it!

[Snoopy]

Originally Posted by 17th Angel

Well, you know... You're into spiritual thangs... and such and paths.... But you say we are all farting around in the dark... But if there are spirits there, why don't they help you out? Instead of leaving to fart around...

Well, yes farting: nebulous stuff, but vital. However, due to the very nature of the ahem, subject, ain't nobody or no thing gonna go "TA DA Yes, you've got it!!!" (I believe). Hence the farting.

Regarding your specific question, I don't believe in "spirits" (assuming we have the same sort of idea as to what "spirits" are) nor am I expecting or looking to any external (to "me") agency (including spirits) to "help me out."

s.

[17th Angel]

Originally Posted by Snoopy

Well, yes farting: nebulous stuff, but vital. However, due to the very nature of the ahem, subject, ain't nobody or no thing gonna go "TA DA Yes, you've got it!!!" (I believe). Hence the farting.

Regarding your specific question, I don't believe in "spirits" (assuming we have the same sort of idea as to what "spirits" are) nor am I expecting or looking to any external (to "me") agency (including spirits) to "help me out."

s.

Well, then I stand corrected....

And you believe in your opinion that the farting around is a must because it gives you some form of spiritual life experience to help you along your way? Ok I got it.

[Snoopy]

Originally Posted by 17th Angel

And you believe in your opinion that the farting around is a must because it gives you some form of spiritual life experience to help you along your way? Ok I got it.

I think we can simply say yes to that, especially since it's dinner time

s.

[Dondi]

Originally Posted by Snoopy

I think we can simply say yes to that, especially since it's dinner time

s.

All that farting has made you hungry, huh?

I feel I ought to comment on the idea of looking into yourself for answers. Sure, we have thing ego that believes that we can figure everything out sometimes. We don't like to think that we are wrong. But then again, who are we to be right. With the aforemention "8 billion people", though I think that numbers is only about 6 billion and some change, that is lot of egos farting in the wind (did it just get warmer in here?). We are all searching for the meaning of life. Perhaps there is more than just one meaning.

That reminds me of a story Paul McCartney told one time about how The Beatles were in India with the Maharishi Mahesh Yogi and at one point the Maharishi was about to take a helicopter ride, but John wanted to go with him and hopped in and they took off. When John got back, he was asked why he wanted to ride in the helo with the Maharishi, and John's reply was "I thought he might slip me the Answer."

I think one of the benefits of this forum is to explore with others the Answer, or perhaps Answers. Possibilities, really, for no one really knows what is beyond the grave (although NDEs are seemingly compelling). I guess what one should ask is what is the most compelling to me? Should I folow along with a pack of fish and hope it leads somewhere, or should I wander off on my own? What will bring the most satisfaction to my life? Should I live for my self, or in the benefit of others? Or both?

But life is a series of either/ors. Everything we do is a choice. Is what I'm doing the best for me? Do I stay within the paradigm of my own path or should I try a different road this time? Am I willing to try something different or am I comfortable in the mundane? Should I go on my own instincts or should I follow a moral code? Do I view moral codes as restrictive or as an agent of change and discipline for the betterment of my life?

I hope for everyone's sake here that you all are willing to explore all the possibilities. If you don't like one thing, try something else. If you don't have conviction about something, find it elsewhere, but have a belief in something, even if it is to have another soda. Don't be content to stay in the cubicle.

If there is a God, I should think he would be happy is that whatever sect we happen to be in, right or wrong, that if we could learn to live with each other amicably and unselfishly, we'd be doing good. But then, that is the trick, isn't it? How do we all get along?

[Snoopy]

Dondi,

Just like there's a limit to how many threads one can start in one day without attracting the attention of the authorities, there's a limit to how many Questions one can ask in a particular thread. I think we may be about to breach that limit.

s.

[Snoopy]

Originally Posted by Dondi

But then, that is the trick, isn't it? How do we all get along?

By keeping the windows open (re: the farting)

s.

[Paladin]

Originally Posted by Snoopy

Dondi,

Just like there's a limit to how many threads one can start in one day without attracting the attention of the authorities, there's a limit to how many Questions one can ask in a particular thread. I think we may be about to breach that limit.

s.

OMG Snoopy is right! I just checked and hull integrity is at 30% and dropping quickly! Quick, someone say something stupid!

[17th Angel]

Say something stupid?

Uhm, I like to dance naked in front of my pets.