What is a Meek?

[Tao_Equus]

Originally Posted by Saltmeister

Do not complain about our leaders? What do you mean by that?

There are two ways of seeing that.

View 1:
I could decide not to complain about my leaders because I know they don't speak the truth. I choose not to complain because I can't do anything about it, and most importantly, I know the truth myself and don't need to pay attention to them. While being silent may mean conceding, being silent may also be a way of deceiving them. They think they've got me under control, but in truth they don't. They think they're so good, so maybe I should just let them believe that.

View 2:
The other way of seeing it is if I actually believe what they say . . . and therefore there is nothing about which to complain.

OR (same/similar/different aspect of same view)

I can't really complain. I know they've got a lot of power, I don't like that, but maybe, just maybe, they're right for once.

I'm inclined to think Jesus meant View 1 . . . or do you reckon, cynically, that Jesus actually meant View 2?

First off I do not believe Jesus actually said it. As I have stated many times on CR I believe the Bible(s) and the Q'uran to be a fusion of old social morals and political devices. This definitely falls into the latter.

In your example 1 though you state you may remain quiet but disapproving the end result is no different than being of the mind of example 2. Christ as portrayed was anything but meek. He was supposedly willing to die for his right to challenge the corrupt authority of the Jewish/Roman status quo. So is Jesus to be denied the Kingdom of Heaven on Earth for this?

Meekness is one of four things. 1:It is a state imposed on one by circumstance not allowing any other option. 2: It is being too dumb or uneducated to want to improve the world around you. 3:It is being aware but too selfish to do your bit. 4:It is being aware but too cowardly to make the challenge.

Of course some of those options intermingle in the individual but the purpose of the line in the Bible and its counterpart in the Q'uran is always the same. It is that there is grave and eternal risk from challenging the status quo. It is as important psychologically for what it does not say as what it does. The line is both carrot and stick because you are promised salvation for being a quiet docile member of the flock, (bahHhHhH). The unsaid reward of not being meek is silent. Psychologically that is no accident.

You have to remember that such things were not written for a contemporary audience of cyber-debaters but for the uneducated serfs and townsfolk of history. As I understand it Jesus only ever said "love thy neighbour", (which I tried but she had a restraining order served on me), or "do unto others as you would have done unto you". The rest is commentary, fables, conjecture added in the centuries following. The church was not, indeed is not, an institution of charity and salvation as it would like itself painted. It was/is a power base that ruled with ruthless authority murdering millions to protect its wealth and power down the centuries. Why would you find it difficult to believe that they tampered with the good book somewhere down the line?

Anyhow enough rant. I state again tho just in case anyone is in any doubt one of its primary purposes is the Church/State telling you its ok to be a yellow bellied coward. Infact you are assured eternal salvation if you are!!

Tao

[bob x]

Christ as portrayed was anything but meek. He was supposedly willing to die...

That's precisely what "meek" means (as opposed to "willing to kill...")

[Tao_Equus]

Originally Posted by bob x

That's precisely what "meek" means (as opposed to "willing to kill...")

Maybe the way you see it bob.

[bob x]

And the way Jesus saw it.
I do not disagree with you about the likelihood that many of the things attributed to Jesus were not actually spoken by him (Yogi Berra is a sports figure in America famous for mis-speaking, lines like "Nobody ever goes there anymore-- it's too crowded" and "90% of baseball is half mental", but once he denied one of the lines attributed to him, saying "You know, I never even said half those things I said"). But in this case I think it is much easier to assume that what he meant was fully consistent with what he was.

[Tao_Equus]

1.humble in spirit or manner; suggesting retiring mildness or even cowed submissiveness; "meek and self-effacing"
2.very docile; "tame obedience"; "meek as a mouse"- Langston Hughes

How can Jesus be said to have been meek? He declared himself the son of God. (My own take on that is he did so no more than he would have claimed anyone to be a child of God). He tried to start a revolution in the synagogue. He chose martyrdom over compliance. These things are not indicative of a meek personality but of an extrovert reactionary. I think you confuse his purportedly pacifist ideology for something it was not. Too many technicolor holywood epics have given people this impression. I believe the almost schizophrenic angst of someone outraged by injustice portrayed in Scorseses' "Last Temptation of Christ" does far more justice to the story. In that you find nothing meek.

Tao

[mee]

But the meek ones themselves will possess the earth,
And they will indeed find their exquisite delight in the abundance of peace.psalm 37;11

(Matthew 5:5) “Happy are the mild-tempered ones, since they will inherit the earth.

(Psalm 119:165) Abundant peace belongs to those loving your law, And for them there is no stumbling block.


Turn away from what is bad and do what is good,
And so reside to time indefinite.

For Jehovah is a lover of justice,
And he will not leave his loyal ones. psalm 37;27-28

[Tao_Equus]

Mee,

That is fine if you rely on that old religious cop-out of an afterlife in which you are essentially the same person you are now. I believe that notion to be fanciful self-deceit and a fear of ones mortality. But it is wrong on a deeper level too as it acts to defer action in this life. Just be meek and passive and by golly you gona get some reward!! Bollocks!!

Things do not change without struggle. And any God worth his salt would surely want to see his creation succeed on every level. To eradicate poverty, injustice, corruption and to achieve a global harmony is achievable on this Earth. Religions that preach they know the way and theirs is the true religion are counter to such a goal. Its flocks are the sheep to the slaughter of a grand design to keep religious and political leaders in power. There is no truth in being meek helping you or anybody else. We are all worm food or greenhouse gasses and the only way we live on is genetically through our progeny. Why cant that be enough? To me that is beautiful enough and right. All this crap about eternity is really just the ultimate selfishness. And that you get it by handing out glossy pamphlets is frankly naive. Wakey wakey...smell the coffee. Life can be wonderful and beautiful here and now. If people were not so self-absorbed in things like fanciful religions. If globaly people were to spend the same hours working for heaven on Earth here and now, rather than on religions, then our planet could be transformed into a paradise indeed. But no... you will come back with some quote from an old tome of dubious merit and show my words to be satanic. And so the world will remain unjust, impoverished and corrupt.

Tao

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by Tao_Equus

Mee,

That is fine if you rely on that old religious cop-out of an afterlife in which you are essentially the same person you are now. I believe that notion to be fanciful self-deceit and a fear of ones mortality. But it is wrong on a deeper level too as it acts to defer action in this life. Just be meek and passive and by golly you gona get some reward!! Bollocks!!

Things do not change without struggle. And any God worth his salt would surely want to see his creation succeed on every level. To eradicate poverty, injustice, corruption and to achieve a global harmony is achievable on this Earth. Religions that preach they know the way and theirs is the true religion are counter to such a goal. Its flocks are the sheep to the slaughter of a grand design to keep religious and political leaders in power. There is no truth in being meek helping you or anybody else. We are all worm food or greenhouse gasses and the only way we live on is genetically through our progeny. Why cant that be enough? To me that is beautiful enough and right. All this crap about eternity is really just the ultimate selfishness. And that you get it by handing out glossy pamphlets is frankly naive. Wakey wakey...smell the coffee. Life can be wonderful and beautiful here and now. If people were not so self-absorbed in things like fanciful religions. If globaly people were to spend the same hours working for heaven on Earth here and now, rather than on religions, then our planet could be transformed into a paradise indeed. But no... you will come back with some quote from an old tome of dubious merit and show my words to be satanic. And so the world will remain unjust, impoverished and corrupt.

Tao

Indeed, God can not stand a fence walker...

[Bruce Michael]

Originally Posted by China Cat Sunflower

The meeks are going to inherit the earth. What does it mean to be meek?

Chris

Greetings Chris,
Meek has to do with gentleness and mildness. Translated from the Aramaic it reads: "Blessed are the gentle for they shall inherit the earth."

In following the Gentle Master we would hope to be gentlemen. Gentleness is not weakness and neither is it timidity.

Gentleness is a quality of Love:
1 Corinthians 13
Love is gentle -makes no demands, despite all wrong true love still stands.

Gentleness is more than meekness- it has a skill and artistry that is intelligent and determined.

Strive to be Gentle.


-Br.Bruce
The paradox of Gentle is that it comes from Strength and not from weakness. Gentle is not flaccid, just tender. Gentle is deliberate, not hesitant. Gentle corresponds and responds very strongly, in order to be gentle. Gentleness and Strength belong together.

-the Brothers

[cyberpi]

Originally Posted by Quahom1

Indeed, God can not stand a fence walker...

So you are the WBC of fence walkers?

Well a review of the history of fences including the Berlin fence, the Great fence of China, Troy, Castleguard, or more biblical fences like Jerico... I guess you could say there is a definite fate for those who build and walk or guard their fences.

[China Cat Sunflower]

How would you contrast the meek with the poor in spirit?

Chris

[17th Angel]

Originally Posted by lunamoth

The least, the lowly, the last. Those without power.

Gonna be a ****ty world then.... If the majority are the weak... I mean the meek whoops.

[mee]

Originally Posted by Tao_Equus

Mee,

That is fine if you rely on that old religious cop-out of an afterlife in which you are essentially the same person you are now. I believe that notion to be fanciful self-deceit and a fear of ones mortality. But it is wrong on a deeper level too as it acts to defer action in this life. Just be meek and passive and by golly you gona get some reward!! Bollocks!!

Things do not change without struggle. And any God worth his salt would surely want to see his creation succeed on every level. To eradicate poverty, injustice, corruption and to achieve a global harmony is achievable on this Earth. Religions that preach they know the way and theirs is the true religion are counter to such a goal. Its flocks are the sheep to the slaughter of a grand design to keep religious and political leaders in power. There is no truth in being meek helping you or anybody else. We are all worm food or greenhouse gasses and the only way we live on is genetically through our progeny. Why cant that be enough? To me that is beautiful enough and right. All this crap about eternity is really just the ultimate selfishness. And that you get it by handing out glossy pamphlets is frankly naive. Wakey wakey...smell the coffee. Life can be wonderful and beautiful here and now. If people were not so self-absorbed in things like fanciful religions. If globaly people were to spend the same hours working for heaven on Earth here and now, rather than on religions, then our planet could be transformed into a paradise indeed. But no... you will come back with some quote from an old tome of dubious merit and show my words to be satanic. And so the world will remain unjust, impoverished and corrupt.

Tao

the bible does not teach an AFTER-LIFE the God of the bible is gathering ones right now in unity who are being taught PEACE and yes it will be on the earth , and yes it is global . revelation 7;9-10

The prophecy of Isaiah 2:2, 3 and that of Micah 4:1, 2 pointed to the time when “the mountain of the house of Jehovah” would “become firmly established above the top of the mountains” and be “lifted up above the hills,” with people of many nations streaming to it. and yes its all happening right now those who are meek are willing to be taught by God.

(Psalm 25:9) He will cause the meek ones to walk in [his] judicial decision, And he will teach the meek ones his way.

[mee]

Originally Posted by China Cat Sunflower

How would you contrast the meek with the poor in spirit?

Chris

poor in spirit means “conscious of their spiritual need”
so they would be disposed to accept the satisfying Kingdom message.

[pattimax]

Originally Posted by China Cat Sunflower

Have you ever heard the story of St. Francis of Assisi preaching to the birds?

Chris

I believe the Beatitudes were originally spoken by Jesus to people. (no feathers)