What is the Christian perspective of Muhammed (pbuh)?

[dailogue is the best]

Can you tell me, sonoman, what you see in Islam as inequivalent in the 21century? By the way, the madia isnt a reference at all. The media has its own agenda, and that is very clear.

Is Muhammed a false prophet? I always remember William Montgomery Watt's question: " how could God help in spreading a religion if its prophet is false, and it is based on lies?!!

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by dailogue is the best

Can you tell me, sonoman, what you see in Islam as inequivalent in the 21century? By the way, the madia isnt a reference at all. The media has its own agenda, and that is very clear.

Is Muhammed a false prophet? I always remember William Montgomery Watt's question: " how could God help in spreading a religion if its prophet is false, and it is based on lies?!!

The question is simple. What prophecies did Mohhamad present (and you can not use the fall of Rome)...

Was Mohhamad a "man of God"? I think so. Was his message lost? Again, I think so. Has it been convoluted? Again, I think so.

v/r

Q

[sonoman]

Originally Posted by dailogue is the best

Can you tell me, sonoman, what you see in Islam as inequivalent in the 21century? By the way, the madia isnt a reference at all. The media has its own agenda, and that is very clear.

Is Muhammed a false prophet? I always remember William Montgomery Watt's question: " how could God help in spreading a religion if its prophet is false, and it is based on lies?!!

Where would I begin? Muhammad's 7th Century idea of an ideal society following Islamic rules is a social governing theory that went out when theocracies were overthrown in the West by democratic government. Wherever Muslims try to reintroduce this 7th Century model, they meet with resistance which will grow as Muslims discover the freedom of being that exists within democratic society untroubled by religious fundamentalist totalitarian ideology. We've been there, done that, with the Catholic Church and Communism. Don't want another go at it. Middle East Muslims haven't had their fill of oriental despotism yet, don't recognize it in Muhammad's theology, and we in the West have to wait for them to catch up.

I do believe Muslims will catch up and eventually chuck the Muhammad idolization out the window so they can embrace Islam as it was meant to be--a religion of peace where one surrenders to the will of God as peace, the root meaning of "Islam" that must be learned for the religion to last. Right now, the only Muslims who practice Islam as a true religion of peace are the Ahmadiyah Muslims who follow the guidance of a Muslim messiah of peace. If Islam, doesn't change, it will go down as the Religion of Suicide Bombers.

[dailogue is the best]

Originally Posted by Quahom1

The question is simple. What prophecies did Mohhamad present (and you can not use the fall of Rome)...

Was Mohhamad a "man of God"? I think so. Was his message lost? Again, I think so. Has it been convoluted? Again, I think so.

v/r

Q

Well, Quahom1, I won't talk about the fall of Rome, the division of moon, the spider and the dove, the talking sheep........and many other "materialistic" prophecies.

Look, Quahom1, if you are a magician, and I present to you something that go far beyond magic, you will of course believe in my powers.

If you are very "materialistic", and you believe just in material things, and that people cant be ressuracted, and I show you materialistic things like bringing dead people alive, and turning blind into one who can see, and deaf into one who can hear, I m sure then that you are going to believe in my powers.

If you are a great poet, and I present you a book of non-comparing poetry and at the same time very revealing, then for sure you will believe in my powers.

God sent every prophet by prophecies that suited those people.

By the way, those who refused Muhammed from his tribe accused him of being a poet (and they knew he wasnt), a magician (and they knew he wasnt), a crazy (and they knew he wasnt). Muhammed' morals and ethics were highly regarded by his own people even before the message was sent down to him.

[dailogue is the best]

Originally Posted by sonoman

I do believe Muslims will catch up and eventually chuck the Muhammad idolization out the window so they can embrace Islam as it was meant to be--a religion of peace where one surrenders to the will of God as peace, the root meaning of "Islam" that must be learned for the religion to last. Right now, the only Muslims who practice Islam as a true religion of peace are the Ahmadiyah Muslims who follow the guidance of a Muslim messiah of peace. If Islam, doesn't change, it will go down as the Religion of Suicide Bombers.

When Bush declared war on Iraq, he used the term "Crusade", and he said something like that God ordered him to do so??!! and look, sonoman, at what is hapenning in Iraq, and how the story of mass weapon turned to be a BIG lie. Shall I understand from this that Christianity is a religion of violence, lies, and contempt? No, I know that all prophets came with message of love and peace.

Islam and voilence is a very repeated subject that the media leaves no effort to fix it in people mind. One, if he/ she really cares, can get the true picture of Islam by individual, independent effort.

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by dailogue is the best

Well, Quahom1, I won't talk about the fall of Rome, the division of moon, the spider and the dove, the talking sheep........and many other "materialistic" prophecies.

Look, Quahom1, if you are a magician, and I present to you something that go far beyond magic, you will of course believe in my powers.

If you are very "materialistic", and you believe just in material things, and that people cant be ressuracted, and I show you materialistic things like bringing dead people alive, and turning blind into one who can see, and deaf into one who can hear, I m sure then that you are going to believe in my powers.

If you are a great poet, and I present you a book of non-comparing poetry and at the same time very revealing, then for sure you will believe in my powers.

God sent every prophet by prophecies that suited those people.

By the way, those who refused Muhammed from his tribe accused him of being a poet (and they knew he wasnt), a magician (and they knew he wasnt), a crazy (and they knew he wasnt). Muhammed' morals and ethics were highly regarded by his own people even before the message was sent down to him.

Don't disrespect me Dialogue. I have never done that to you.

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by dailogue is the best

When Bush declared war on Iraq, he used the term "Crusade", and he said something like that God ordered him to do so??!! and look, sonoman, at what is hapenning in Iraq, and how the story of mass weapon turned to be a BIG lie. Shall I understand from this that Christianity is a religion of violence, lies, and contempt? No, I know that all prophets came with message of love and peace.

Islam and voilence is a very repeated subject that the media leaves no effort to fix it in people mind. One, if he/ she really cares, can get the true picture of Islam by individual, independent effort.

President Bush NEVER said ANYTHING about God ordering him to go to war. And frankly, I think you should check "snopes.com" to find out the truth of things, before you post points that you might regret, later.

Q

[dailogue is the best]

Quahom1

Don't disrespect me Dialogue. I have never done that to you

Again, Quahom1, again!!! you always made a false assumption against me. Can you show me where I showed you disrespect? I dont dare, Quahom1. Neither your gentle behaviour nor my ethics allow me to do so.

President Bush NEVER said ANYTHING about God ordering him to go to war. And frankly, I think you should check "snopes.com" to find out the truth of things, before you post points that you might regret, later.

By the way, it is the first time, and believe me, I heard about "snopes.com". These were the news I heard the time war on Iraq began. I will check it out, and then I will inform you about my findings.

[dailogue is the best]

Originally Posted by dailogue is the best

.

Look, Quahom1, if you are a magician, and I present to you something that go far beyond magic, you will of course believe in my powers.

If you are very "materialistic", and you believe just in material things, and that people cant be ressuracted, and I show you materialistic things like bringing dead people alive, and turning blind into one who can see, and deaf into one who can hear, I m sure then that you are going to believe in my powers.

If you are a great poet, and I present you a book of non-comparing poetry and at the same time very revealing, then for sure you will believe in my powers.

If you see my using the phrase "if you are" as a sign of disrespect, then I am no end sorry, and I really apologize.

I used the phrase "if you are" for the sake of giving exapmles, and I mnt addressing you at all.

By the first example, I meant the people of Pharoah and the prophecies of Moses.

By the second example, I meant the people of Israel and the prophecies of Jesus.

By the third example, I meant the people of Arabian peninsula and the prophecies of Muhammed.

I want to say that different prophecies address different people.

Again, I am very sorry, Quahom1, if you felt that you have been disrespected by me. I dont dare. (not out of fear, but out of real respect)

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by dailogue is the best

If you see my using the phrase "if you are" as a sign of disrespect, then I am no end sorry, and I really apologize.

I used the phrase "if you are" for the sake of giving exapmles, and I mnt addressing you at all.

By the first example, I meant the people of Pharoah and the prophecies of Moses.

By the second example, I meant the people of Israel and the prophecies of Jesus.

By the third example, I meant the people of Arabian peninsula and the prophecies of Muhammed.

I want to say that different prophecies address different people.

Again, I am very sorry, Quahom1, if you felt that you have been disrespected by me. I dont dare. (not out of fear, but out of real respect)

It's ok. Maybe a nerve got touched, and I'm sorry you got the brunt of it.

v/r

Q

[dailogue is the best]

Originally Posted by Quahom1

It's ok. Maybe a nerve got touched, and I'm sorry you got the brunt of it.

v/r

Q

As usual, Quahom1.....Oh! My God!!!....May God give me patience with you. You accuse me of something, I have to clarify I dont mean anything, then you say you are sorry for misunderstanding....

Another time, I will blink my eyes over your accusations. haha

Now, can you reply to my post, Quahom1.

[sonoman]

How do Christians deal with what appears to be great cognitive dissonance in Muslim believers? It's like Westerners, non-Muslims should turn off their tvs and stop reading their newspapers and listen only to the soothing words of Muslim believers about the goodness of their faith. Meanwhile, their Muslim brethren are busy every day of the week blowing fellow Muslims up or non-Muslims in the way of Muslim rule. What Westerner in their right mind would want to be a part of such a violent religious movement?

[sonoman]

Any time you couple religion with weapons, God has fled from that religion. God has no need of guns, only men do.

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by dailogue is the best

Well, Quahom1, I won't talk about the fall of Rome, the division of moon, the spider and the dove, the talking sheep........and many other "materialistic" prophecies.

Look, Quahom1, if you are a magician, and I present to you something that go far beyond magic, you will of course believe in my powers.

If you are very "materialistic", and you believe just in material things, and that people cant be ressuracted, and I show you materialistic things like bringing dead people alive, and turning blind into one who can see, and deaf into one who can hear, I m sure then that you are going to believe in my powers.

If you are a great poet, and I present you a book of non-comparing poetry and at the same time very revealing, then for sure you will believe in my powers.

God sent every prophet by prophecies that suited those people.

By the way, those who refused Muhammed from his tribe accused him of being a poet (and they knew he wasnt), a magician (and they knew he wasnt), a crazy (and they knew he wasnt). Muhammed' morals and ethics were highly regarded by his own people even before the message was sent down to him.

That would be a presumption of my inability to reasonably deduce what is actually happening, and what is being made to appear as something that is not.

Further more, a prophecy is not something that "wows" people with the materialistic, but rather a vision of that which is yet to come. Once the vision is realized the prophecy then is "fulfilled".

I am not in any way Dialogue, arguing the merits of Mohhamad's integrity, morals or ethics. What I question is whether or not he presented prophecies and if so, did any come true.

This is far different than "miracles", which are an every day occurance experienced by every day people.

You bring up the division of the moon as a prophecy. Yet within the ranks of Islam, that "prophecy" is in question as to its meaning, and timing. One camp states that Mohhamad actually split the moon (past tense), yet others claim the splitting of the moon occured on 21 July 1969 at exactly 17:54:1 U, when the American astronauts left the moon, bound for earth with 45 lbs of moon rock in their capsule. In short, Americans (not Mohhamad), literally split a piece of the moon away. The rest of the Q'uranic scripture precludes the "prophecy" from being that of the Americans splitting the moon due to the simple observation of the writer, namely that the people who observed this were not impressed. This we know is not at all true, since the whole world was enchanted by the moon walk (except the Russians who were envious...lol ).

Therefore, the only explanation left is that Mohammad literally split the moon, and the people were not impressed. However, that is not a prophecy, but historical, as Mohommad's writer is speaking in the past tense.

We can look at each "prophecy" if you'd like. I'm game.

However, remember, I am not questioning Mohommad's ethics, integrity or honor.

v/r

Q

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by sonoman

Any time you couple religion with weapons, God has fled from that religion. God has no need of guns, only men do.

You forget the Lord's general...Joshua was his name, and Jericho was his claim to fame.

And what he taught us was this: Anything can be used as a weapon, including sound and the frequency of foot falls in cadence.