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Old 12-30-2003, 04:48 AM   #16 (permalink)
JJM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sachetm
If one accepts the notion of immaculate conception, then the Holy Spirit, who impregnated Mary, had a way to create a Y chromosome. That seems no more illogical than the notion of impregnation by the Holy Spirit in the first place.

I know they've been able to stimulate an egg in a laboratory to create a fetus. Is your point that, by definition, all those fetuses have to be female?

I always figured that if spontaneous conception is possible in a laboratory, then he has to somehow be possible in the physical world, as well. That would certainly explain a virgin birth. But if it would mean that a resulting child would have to be female, then my theory is shot to hell!

I have done very little reading in the Bible and don't know whether or not there's anything about the Holy Spirit visiting Joseph or not. If one accepts the notion of the Holy Spirit's involvement, then it seems fitting he'd have whispered something to Joseph to allay concerns on his part about Mary's veracity.

Is there anything in the Bible about this? I simply don't know.
It was not the holy Spirt Who told Joesph of Mary but rather an angel in a dream. This is stated in Matthew 1:18-25 If you wish to read it The other times Joesph is mentioned in this Gospel He also has prophetic dreams so one can only assume this was a common accurence for him and he would have trusted it. If they where not common then he would have most likley still believed it.

As for the person who metioned Immaculate Conception that refured to mary's Conception without original sin not Jesus's. I still don't know why no one cares to realize that.
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Old 02-05-2004, 02:18 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foundationist
Here's a question -

Jesus was biologicall male. To be biologically male requires both an X and a Y chromosome.

Women have two X chromosomes. The Y chromosome can only come from the paternal line. But if Joseph was not the father of Jesus, then where exactly did Jesus's Y chromosome come from to make him biologically male?

Does God therefore have DNA?

The options are -

1/ God is human and has DNA which was passed on to Jesus, hence the source of the Y chromosome.

2/ God made up perfect DNA and somehow placed it within Mary to fertilise one of her eggs. in which case the Y chromosome was created by miraculous means.

3/ Jesus was made from the flesh of Mary and Joseph - in which case, he was illegitimate and not the Son of God.

4/ Jesus was made only from Mary's DNA - in which case, without a Y chromosome, he would have been female. Is this the greatest secret of the Bible (Christ being short for Christine, of course).

If Adam is a Biological male, then any Y or X chromosomes he had, came from God.

Then again maybe one of these days, with a long enough swab, you could get a sample for yourself, or ask, if you dare. }}}}poof{{{{

best wishes,
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Old 02-23-2007, 07:32 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Re: Whose Dna did Jesus have?

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Originally Posted by I, Brian View Post
The problem with Virgin Birth's is that they were ten-a-penny in the ancient world. A virgin birth signified a direct relationship to "the gods" - and the nobility of Europe and the Near East had a funny habit of always being related to some divinity of other. Homer illistrates this clearly, and we see the practice continuing into the Medaeival period of Europe.

The key point was that the nearer you were to a divine (ie, virgin) birth, then the nearer you were to unquestionable rule. The tradition seems to be particularly Middle-Eastern, and gone through Europe via Greece and Rome.

Alexander the Great was a partcular example of someone who claimed direct descent from God (ie, Zeus).

In a historical context, there's no reason to take the "virgin birth" account to be anything other than an indicator of Divine authority. In simple terms, it's a propaganda statement. That;s the way that Divine Birth's have always been treated - Julius Caesar, I believe, even changed his divine ancestor for PR purposes.

The same problem applies to the claim of being directly descended from David - there's an easy argument to make that the idea of Earthly and Heavenly authority are merely propagandist elements inserted into the Gospel stories by men, for men, according to the routines of the ancient world.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JJM View Post
It was not the holy Spirt Who told Joesph of Mary but rather an angel in a dream. This is stated in Matthew 1:18-25 If you wish to read it The other times Joesph is mentioned in this Gospel He also has prophetic dreams so one can only assume this was a common accurence for him and he would have trusted it. If they where not common then he would have most likley still believed it.

As for the person who metioned Immaculate Conception that refured to mary's Conception without original sin not Jesus's. I still don't know why no one cares to realize that.
Namaste all, didn't I hear this as the determination by one of the councils? That the virgin birth is a missinterpretation.
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Old 02-23-2007, 08:25 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Re: Whose Dna did Jesus have?

He had mary's dna, and she gave birth to him as a virgin. jesus was formed in the womb of mary by god and his holy spirit, and the word that is god became flesh and walked among us.
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Old 02-24-2007, 01:23 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Re: Whose Dna did Jesus have?

One of the first prophecies in the bible..

Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, And you shall bruise His heel."

Since when did women have "seed"? Women have eggs...men have seed.
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Old 02-24-2007, 02:40 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Re: Whose Dna did Jesus have?

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Originally Posted by Faithfulservant View Post
One of the first prophecies in the bible..

Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, And you shall bruise His heel."

Since when did women have "seed"? Women have eggs...men have seed.
it can be used as a general term used in reference to her egg which helped produce the baby. seed does not always specifically mean that which comes from a male. in this case, "her seed" equals her egg.
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Old 02-24-2007, 03:00 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Re: Whose Dna did Jesus have?

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Originally Posted by BlaznFattyz View Post
it can be used as a general term used in reference to her egg which helped produce the baby. seed does not always specifically mean that which comes from a male. in this case, "her seed" equals her egg.
Actually...I disagree..

Using a KJV lexicon

Zera` = seed (Noun Masculine)

seed, sowing, offspring
a sowing
seed
semen virile
offspring, descendants, posterity, children
of moral quality
a practitioner of righteousness (fig.)


Beytsah = egg (Noun Feminine)

egg

The reason I disagree is when did satan produce eggs?

and when in history is a woman responsible a line of people or a seed of people??? That always falls to the male even to this day..

Except for this prophecy
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Old 02-24-2007, 03:08 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Re: Whose Dna did Jesus have?

i think you are getting to technical with the word. satan's seed are those that do evil and follow in satan's footsteps. marys seed is her egg even her womb from which jesus was formed with the help of god's holy spirit, and her giving birth to him.
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Old 02-24-2007, 03:13 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Re: Whose Dna did Jesus have?

You didnt respond to the fact that where else in the bible is a seed from woman documented other than this prophecy???

Do a search on it and let me know because Im telling you that you wont find one. You will find seeds from every male but no female..

I personally think you are taking from this prophecy by not being technical enough..
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Old 02-24-2007, 03:46 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Re: Whose Dna did Jesus have?

maybe i am not understanding?...
what exactly are you arguing in the scripture: "you and the woman, and between your seed and her seed".
the bible clearly states her seed, so i am not exactly sure what else you mean it to say.
and no where else in the bible is there the messiah born to a virgin but to mary, so in reference to mary it's pretty unique.
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