Why?!! - Page 2

juantoo3 · 02-16-2007, 01:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wil

I'd think their reactions would be quite interesting when they look at our bible, the books we chose to cannonize, Paul especially. The fact that in so many of our churches we have Jesus on the Cross as his defining moment. The plethora of idols and chains and medalions and industry surrounding the church, someone might have an urge to tip over tables. That so many of us zip to church for an hour and leave to race home to watch the football game or cars drive around in circles... Sunday, the sabbath is on Sunday?? I'd say they'd all have quite a bit to say, how much would be complimentary is subject for yet another book or movie...

Bingo!

Prober · 02-16-2007, 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wil

The plethora of idols and chains and medalions and industry surrounding the church, someone might have an urge to tip over tables. That so many of us zip to church for an hour and leave to race home to watch the football game or cars drive around in circles... Sunday, the sabbath is on Sunday?? I'd say they'd all have quite a bit to say, how much would be complimentary is subject for yet another book or movie...

I'd have to agree, although I wouldn't call any of this orthodox...

Dor · 02-16-2007, 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wil

I'd think their reactions would be quite interesting when they look at our bible, the books we chose to cannonize, Paul especially. The fact that in so many of our churches we have Jesus on the Cross as his defining moment. The plethora of idols and chains and medalions and industry surrounding the church, someone might have an urge to tip over tables. That so many of us zip to church for an hour and leave to race home to watch the football game or cars drive around in circles... Sunday, the sabbath is on Sunday?? I'd say they'd all have quite a bit to say, how much would be complimentary is subject for yet another book or movie...

Really seems to me the apostles met on Sundays before it was all said and done.

Seems you need to come visit me and go to a bible teaching church we have no chains, medallions etc.

Dor · 02-16-2007, 02:14 AM

The church with the industry around it is not what Id call Christian.

Ask me and I will tell you what I think of WoF movement, Rick Warren, and Joel Osteen and all them.

Silas · 02-16-2007, 02:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dor

The church with the industry around it is not what Id call Christian.

Ask me and I will tell you what I think of WoF movement, Rick Warren, and Joel Osteen and all them.

Joel Osteen is such a great motivational speaker. It would be cool if he were a Christian.

Faithfulservant · 02-16-2007, 03:36 AM

the sabbath is saturday wil... the Lords day is on Sunday.. we do not call it the sabbath. Its all written out in the book of Acts if your interested in reading it.

Ive been researching the growing emerging church phenomenon.. We have a feel good fast food church chain monopolizing the sunday only church-goers and its disturbing to say the least..

I happen to not want to be one of the people that Christ says left their first love... and I definitely dont want to be vomited out of His mouth

Dont people read their bibles anymore?

Quahom1 · 02-16-2007, 03:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silas

Can someone please tell me why we have such a thing called "Liberal Christanity?" If you arent going to adhere to historical orthodox Christanity, why even call yourself Christians? How come no one does this sort of stuff with Islam or any other religion? Because of these so called "Christians," many unsaved folks lump you in with us and the name of the Lord is blasphemed. Can you please quit it?! Why not get a new name for yourselves; the world is confused enough about us.

Because there are many variations of Christianity, as well as interpretations. Some folk are not comfortable with the strict orthodox view as presented by mainline Christianity, and wanted a place to explore their thoughts and views.

And before the Pauline version of Christianity even existed in its infancy there were Christians (those who believed in the promise Christ gave).

In reality, the "only" requirement to being a Christian (in the literal sense), is to accept the gift that Jesus offered and to believe unto Him as savior and redeemer.

Paul on the other hand, sets up rules and regulations and guidelines for the core values of mainstream Christianity. But belief or non belief in Paul's writings does not preclude one from the promise of salvation that is offered by Jesus, if the offer is accepted.

The rest I suspect is simply growing stages for the development of those who call themselves (and believe themselves to be), Christian.

However, as you succintly pointed out, there is an "us" vs "them" mentality that immediately puts others on the defensive...definitely not something Jesus ever did to anyone who wished to follow Him...

In fact Jesus never said "belittle and judge". What He did say was "Pray for others". Ironic that praying for those not in line is sooooo much harder than critisizing them, don't you think?

v/r

Joshua

Faithfulservant · 02-16-2007, 04:02 AM

Paul brought the gospel to the gentiles.. He didnt make the rules and regulations.. God did.

Jesus also said..

Matthew 10:34 Do not think that I came to bring peace on earth. I did not come to bring peace but a sword. 35 For I have come to 'set a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law'; 36 and 'a man's enemies will be those of his own household.'

Quahom1 · 02-16-2007, 04:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Faithfulservant

Paul brought the gospel to the gentiles.. He didnt make the rules and regulations.. God did.

Jesus also said..

Matthew 10:34 Do not think that I came to bring peace on earth. I did not come to bring peace but a sword. 35 For I have come to 'set a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law'; 36 and 'a man's enemies will be those of his own household.'

Not quite true. Paul's writings are from his perspective, and he often states that fact.

Silas · 02-16-2007, 04:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quahom1

Not quite true. Paul's writings are from his perspective, and he often states that fact.

Paul wrote under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. One time he wrote that he was giving his own opinion.

Quahom1 · 02-16-2007, 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silas

Paul wrote under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. One time he wrote that he was giving his own opinion.

All scripture is God inspired. Paul often expressed his own opinion of things. His writings were not historical issues leading up to Christianity, but rather the development of the finer points of Christianity. (I call a spade a spade). Indeed Paul can be considered one of the first "moderators" within the Christian world of dialogue...

v/r

Joshua

Silas · 02-16-2007, 04:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quahom1

In fact Jesus never said "belittle and judge".

Mat. 15:21-28 comes to mind.

Silas · 02-16-2007, 04:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quahom1

All scripture is God inspired. Paul often expressed his own opinion of things. His writings were not historical issues leading up to Christianity, but rather the development of the finer points of Christianity. (I call a spade a spade). Indeed Paul can be considered one of the first "moderators" within the Christian world of dialogue...

v/r

Joshua

What do you mean that Paul was a moderator? I agree Paul taught the inner and finer points of what is means to be Christian.

Quahom1 · 02-16-2007, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silas

Mat. 15:21-28 comes to mind.

Ah, you mean when Jesus affectionately chided the woman about being a "little dog"? Remember He did so in front of Jews who looked down on non-Jews, and turned a derogatory term into a term of endearment (He already knew what she was about, and suspected she would not be swayed from her goal), and no one looks down on a baby puppy, no matter how calloused in heart. Jesus knew the strength of her resolve and faith, and the fact that she would take whatever He dished out, as long as her daughter was made well...that is a good parent. Jesus also took the opportunity to show the world what strong faith was.

However, because she would not cowl, and back away, nor did she become angry or indignant, Jesus was "amazed" at her faith. In short she amazed Him with the outcome she chose (of the many she could have chosen).

v/r

Joshua

Quahom1 · 02-16-2007, 04:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silas

What do you mean that Paul was a moderator? I agree Paul taught the inner and finer points of what is means to be Christian.

The seven churches come to mind. Paul was trying to get them all in line, and stop their particular squabbling or vacilating, or complacency, or stupidity.

His letters initially were to them...