Why do people try to change Christianity? - Page 9

RevKelly · 11-14-2006, 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Francis king

That really is a shame for all those people. They should realize one can't go online and order up God, with customized details like a Toyota. He is who He is, and it is we who must adapt to Him and His ways...not the other way around.

Matthew 18:18
What you shall hold true on Earth, I shall hold true in Heaven.

Straight from the mouth of Jesus.

Dor · 11-14-2006, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cage

Many are searching the scriptures and are pulling out what resinates as truth, and leaving what goes against the very spirit of God, as Christ declared it.

Some Christians are taking great strides towards the light, and away from the darkness. I can see it; I see it almost everyday. These are the ones accused of "changing" Christianity in OP. I say some [many actually] have found a simpler way of approaching, finding, and accepting God through Jesus, and the Bible.

The all or nothing attitude is dangerous; we can verify this by taking a look at Christian history, yes?

What is wrong with sifting through the Bible, and accepting that which is good, and rejecting the wrong...The things that contradict the way God is presentd by Jesus, and his followers?

Love is not complicated, imo...

Peace,

You are saying your version of right and wrong is better than God's is what you are doing.

Quahom1 · 11-14-2006, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kiwimac

Actually, according to Isaiah and Ezekiel, Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed because of economic Injustice rather than any sexual sin. Moreover I would argue that the OT statements have more to do with Ritual prostitution than homosexuality and the NT, Pederasty.

Kiwimac

Please point me to the verses that expound upon this economic injustice. Considering that Lot offered his daughters in lieu of the two male "guests" he was hosting, to satisfy the cravings of the crowd in front of his home, that sounds like nothing economical that I'm aware of.

Quahom1 · 11-14-2006, 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RevKelly

Matthew 18:18
What you shall hold true on Earth, I shall hold true in Heaven.

Straight from the mouth of Jesus.

"What is bound on earth, will be bound in heaven...and what is loosed on earth will be loosed in heaven..." Nothing there about holding truth.

RevKelly · 11-14-2006, 12:30 AM

Which version are you looking at? This is part of the problem.

And if you read the Hebrew meaning of Binding and Loosing, it means Forbidding and Permissing. So, what you just said was: 'what you forbid on Earth, shall be forbidden in Heaven, and what you permit on Earth, shall be permitted in Heaven.'

So God isn't the one that makes the choice.

We are.

According to Jesus.

JewishEncyclopedia.com - BINDING AND LOOSING

RevKelly · 11-14-2006, 12:33 AM

The Destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah.

BBC - History - The Destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah

Cage · 11-14-2006, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dor

You are saying your version of right and wrong is better than God's is what you are doing.

No, I'm saying God is Love, and through his Love we are able to find truth in the Bible. The spirit guides, and helps us discern that which is good, and that which is not. The Bible is a means for finding God, but I don't think it is meant to be taken so absolute. He is giving us an opportunity to 'find' him, yet allows us to fail when we deny his true nature, and attribute to him things ungodly. A good tree bears good fruit, but an evil tree cannot. This is why I pick and choose; I judge by spirit, and by fruit, as we are told to do so by Jesus...

Anything that opposses Love is error, and much in the Bible does just that, imo. I think that fear is the base of all evils, but perfect Love casts out that fear.

I am merely suggesting that change is a good thing when it comes finding the light of Christ. Jesus was our light, our example, and if we allow him...our saviour as well. All else lies inside each person, and it will either comfort, or create a raging fire.

Much Love,

RevKelly · 11-14-2006, 12:47 AM

It's been an interesting discussion day. And I am personally glad to have talked with all of you. But I am tired and my patience is growing thin. So, I'm off to get a few things done before work tomorrow.

Peace be with you all,

Kelly

Quahom1 · 11-14-2006, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RevKelly

Which version are you looking at? This is part of the problem.

And if you read the Hebrew meaning of Binding and Loosing, it means Forbidding and Permissing. So, what you just said was: 'what you forbid on Earth, shall be forbidden in Heaven, and what you permit on Earth, shall be permitted in Heaven.' So God isn't the one that makes the choice. We are.

The point of the verse is about forgiveness, or unforgiveness, not permission or forbidding or truth being held. Jesus is saying that if we refuse to forgive on earth, He will not forgive. But by our forgiving, we are then forgiven. In fact it is re-enforced in the Nicene Creed..."forgive us our trangressions, as we forgive those who transgress against us..."

Please present the two words you are reffering to, so that I may compare them to my Hebrew lexicon.

v/r

Joshua

edit, went to the web link you gave, and look what I found at the bottom of the page?

"Whosesoever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whosesoever sins ye retain, they are retained."

China Cat Sunflower · 11-14-2006, 12:59 AM

The OT doesn't say specifically what Sodom and Gemorrah were destroyed for. The incident with the mob illustrates just how depraved the people were, but the text doesn't imply that the cities were destroyed specifically for being such hotbeds of homosexual activity.

It's interesting to consider that Abraham and Lot had history with these two cities. Remember the Melchizedek incident? Abraham was returning from kicking some butt on behalf of the kings of Sodom and Gemorrah.

Chris

Quahom1 · 11-14-2006, 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RevKelly

The Destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah.

BBC - History - The Destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah

I prefer Genesis 19. It's the original version.

Quahom1 · 11-14-2006, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by China Cat Sunflower

The OT doesn't say specifically what Sodom and Gemorrah were destroyed for. The incident with the mob illustrates just how depraved the people were, but the text doesn't imply that the cities were destroyed specifically for being such hotbeds of homosexual activity.

It's interesting to consider that Abraham and Lot had history with these two cities. Remember the Melchizedek incident? Abraham was returning from kicking some butt on behalf of the kings of Sodom and Gemorrah.

Chris

Chris, the OT does say what Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed for. God told Abraham specifically why He was about to destroy them. Abraham then argued with God about the issue ("...and if there were ten righteous men, would you spare the city...").

v/r

Joshua

shadowman · 11-14-2006, 01:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RevKelly

Thanks!

That's a tough one. The Old Testament says no, but the New Testament says God Is Love. If they Love each other, I don't think it's our place to interfere. Nobody is saying that we should all go and have Gay Orgies, but it does say that Anyone That Knows Love, Knows God. There is a verse in the New Testament that says that Love Does Not Seek Its Own, in another version/interpretation, it says that Love Is Not Self-Seeking. I interpret that as Egotistical or non-Charitous (is that a word?). It's Own What? It doesn't say. This is where it becomes hard. I'm inclined to leave them alone. They say they Love each other - let them Love, I would think.

Peace,

Kelly

does that mean someone can know god, or "be ok in gods eyes" (i still cant get over the idea of god that realy doesnt think we are ok)

without accepting christ as their redeemer. I know a lot of people say love is all. some hindus also say they nkow god like christians because its all about love.

kiwimac · 11-14-2006, 01:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Faithfulservant

they tried to gang rape Gods heavenly host....

Actually re-read Genesis and you wil see God had purposed their destruction long BEFORE the angels got there.

kiwimac · 11-14-2006, 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quahom1

Chris, the OT does say what Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed for. God told Abraham specifically why He was about to destroy them. Abraham then argued with God about the issue ("...and if there were ten righteous men, would you spare the city...").

v/r

Joshua

Take a look at Genesis, tell me why Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed FROM the account of Abraham's meeting with the Malik yahweh at Mamre.