Why would a God who is perfect create an imperfect world?

[mee]

Originally Posted by robocombot

Simple question. Maybe the answer is simple.

All of us here who believe there is only one God also believe that God is perfect.

No doubt we all also believe the world is imperfect, in that evil is very real and that humankind is rebelling against God.

However, the reason for that imperfection we may have different views on.

Most of us here would believe in satan/iblis/lucifer (although we see him differently) and the answer that relates to us now may be that evil is allowed for us to be tempted by him.

But I would like a focus on why evil was allowed/planned/tolerated to enter the world in the first place. Why create an imperfect world.

Evil is tolaratedbecause rebellion (of satan). against Gods way of ruling(mankind), brought up the issue of universal sovreignty, and who is the rightful ruler of this universe, Jehovah knows that he is the rightful ruler , but it has got to be proved once and forall that mankind was not created to rule himself independent of God .
I well know, O Jehovah, that to earthling man his way does not belong. It does not belong to man who is walking even to direct his step(jeremiah 10;3)

Ezek. 38:17, 23: "This is what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah has said, ‘ . . . And I shall certainly magnify myself and sanctify myself and make myself known before the eyes of many nations; and they will have to know that I am Jehovah

No wonder that 1 John 5:19 says: "The whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one." But his power is only for a limited period of time and is only by the toleration of Jehovah, who is God Almighty.

"And in the days of those kings (human rulership)the God of heaven will set up a kingdom (goverment)that will never be brought to ruin. And the kingdom itself will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it itself will stand to times indefinite(daniel 2;44)

(Psalm 110:5) Jehovah himself at your right hand Will certainly break kings to pieces on the day of his anger

For his part, the God who gives peace will crush Satan under YOUR feet shortly. May the undeserved kindness of our Lord Jesus be with YOU(romans 16;20)

Next, the end, when he (Jesus)hands over the kingdom to his God and Father, when he has brought to nothing all government and all authority and power(1 corinthians 15;24)so Gods name and his right to rule will be vindicated ,it has got to be proved that Jehovah is the true God and not satan ,the resister and opposer.

[believer142]

God did not create an imperfect world but he did create free will. An imperfect world exists when there is an abscence of good(evil) and the use of free will is manipulated. Evil is the absense of good juss like cold is the absence of heat. Both dont exist.

God probably created free will so we can search our hearts to seek him. Otherwise, we would believe in him because we are obligated and not becuase we love him.

[BlaznFattyz]

i dont think the word perfect is the correct word to use. trying to define God and his creation with one word that you find in the English language is inadequate at best.

For one, you would have to have another God to say that the first God is imperfect or perfect.. with nothing to compare the first one with.. this word doesnt work. God is God, he is Almighty and Holy. Look at the universe, the vastness of space and the number of stars.. that is just a thought and a word to God.

[smkolins]

Originally Posted by I, Brian

Indeed.

All too often it seems we humans seem to presume our perception should be The Objective Standard Against Which All Things Are Measured.

Like every baby and adolescent.

[Saltmeister]

I believe that everything God created was perfect, including everything that has now become evil. However, my view is that all living things were also holy and pure.

For living things to be holy and pure, it means that they cannot commit evil and they cannot think evil thoughts.

All living things, including God, the angels He created (divine beings) and human beings (mortals) have instincts. Instincts define a being's character and personality. Good instincts are things like love, patience, kindness, generosity, etc. Evil instincts are the opposite -- hatred, greed, arrogance, selfishness, lust, etc.

This relates to what Paul says in 1 Corinthians 13, Galatians 5:16-26 and Colossians 3:5-11.

Put to death, therefore, whatever belongs to your earthly nature: sexual immorality, impurity, lust, evil desires and greed, which is idolatry . . .
Colossians 3:5-11

Live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature . . .

The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions, envy, drunkenness, orgies and the like. I warn you, those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law . . .
Galatians 5:16-26

So, the question is, how did evil enter our universe?

One theory was that the angel Lucifer was the beginning of all evil.

Lucifer was one of the brightest, most beautiful and most handsome angels that God had created. He was also one of the most intelligent.

Intelligence doesn't mean that a person will never do evil. It's actually the other way around. It's a sign of intelligence for people to do either the right thing or to do the wrong thing. Good character is a sign of intelligence, but bad character is also a sign of intelligence.

So how did Lucifer become evil? He used his intelligence to justify evil. That made him feel smart about himself. He started to justify other kinds of evil too. What he did was actually quite dangerous. Sure, Lucifer was just showing off, but that also made him arrogant.

Lucifer even justified his own arrogance. King Solomon was very much like Lucifer in that he had abundant wisdom but he become too proud.

Lucifer and Solomon are examples of how WISE GUYS can become corrupt. They become too wise for their own good.

In this sense Lucifer was perfect in what God made him to be, even to the point where Lucifer, by his own choice, becomes arrogant and corrupt.

Also, Lucifer was an angel. Angels are far more powerful than human beings, when they choose to change their character or personality, their choice is final.

He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.
John 8:42-44

Lucifer became Satan, the Father of Lies. Lucifer, with his newfound ability to justify evil, deceived himself in believing that he could not become evil himself. By deceiving himself he became the Deceiver.

He caused Adam to eat the fruit from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. So Adam inherits the same newfound evil that Lucifer already has.

From then until now he has continued this foolish and stupid behaviour and has come to be known as the Devil.

Satan is really serving God's purposes. We can learn from evil. If we have never seen hatred, selfishness, arrogance, greed, etc., how can we know how horrible it is?

We've seen what it does to the world. Evil may be a sign of intelligence and but it is also the stupidest kind of intelligence we will ever know. And yet we fall for it because we think we're so smart. Good and evil are the difference between true and false wisdom.

Evil must come first before we can be accepted into God's kingdom.

[ert]

Why, still would God create a world where we experience so much pain frustration and misery. I am in one of the fortunate parts of the world where one can expect to be able to live quite a long time in good health. Of course, there are problems here but they are trivial compared to places where disease, starvation, cruelty, war, massacre, etc are commonplace. We may say that humans have had a hand in most misery but still, often the people who suffer most are not the ones who cause the suffering.

We can also look to angelic conflicts and fights that need to be faught, but that still leaves the question of a God who makes the rules in the first place,making them such that suffering (especially profound suffering that does not serve any usefull purpose) should be part of the plan.

I am of the mind that the word "perfection" is not even applicable when referring to God. Perfection implies a preconcieved idea or standard. Was there someone around to make such a standard before God came along?

So, if God is neither perfect nor imperfect by any standard worthy of him, then there is still the question of why all this misery, sin and so forth but; it is not a logical paradox anymore.

So, to address the "Why" of our even being capable of percieving the world as imperfect: It is one way and we can try to make it, or at least parts of it, more like something else hopefully better. Of course, wise people will us that the place to start world improvement is with our own hearts and minds.

[heaven_id]

Yes, the answer is simple.

Depend who is assuming that. If men do: that's true, it is perfect. But to God Himself?

Relativity.
(did you imagine that word:simple means relatively too?)

[Tao_Equus]

Nice to see there are so many Candides' out there in 'this best of all possible worlds'.

[PrimaVera]

Originally Posted by Tao_Equus

Nice to see there are so many Candides' out there in 'this best of all possible worlds'.

Seriously, one resolution of the problem of evil I've seen is to understand "good and evil" not as properties of things but as relationships between things: i.e. that the only way we can ultimately say that something is "good" or "evil" is by comparing it to something else. Wikipedia has a brief synopsis here

[mansio]

The world is imperfect at the moment because God's creation isn't finished yet.
Wait a million years and you will see the difference.
I'm not joking. One million year is little compared to the age of the universe, and no time at all for God.
We're worrying about bad things because we see things with our limited understanding.

[hunain]

the world is not imperfect this world is the test for hereafter

[Light]

Hi all,

the world is not imperfect this world is the test for hereafter

precisely Hunain...

We moved on from one world to another... starting from in the womb (to be simplistic) ... to this earth... into the grave and resurrected in the hereafter to enjoy or suffer the fruit of our labour on earth.

In fact GOD purposely make this world in this state for us to think made amendments, improvements, establishing friendship and make the world a better place (or worse). Through that and questioning ourself will we realise the existence of GOD/Allah. This also creates opportunity for us to help one another regardless of race or geographical boundaries. Isn't that in itself a miracle?

Another analogy, if you wanted to be a bodybuilder, you have to work hard working on the irons to yield the result. Similarly, the world is a test ground where everyone is continually tested and depending on the path they take will give them the equivalent reward in the afterlife. Everyone have to work our way to Heaven.

However, to do that we must be well equiped with the knowledge and this is where GOD/Allah 'prophets' comes in. They are sent to bring people back to the straight path.

Thus, I believe the above are some of the reason why God/Allah create an imperfect world.

[tommy]

Why did God create Moss (that green stuff that grows north of the rolling stone) and then tell the Isrealites through Moses in the 610 laws to wash Moss off from their homes if it grows there? Things in this world do take a natural course and don't always do what God intended them to do. Peace and Love, tommy