Women and Islam P:I

[Friend]

EVE'S FAULT ?

The three religions agree on one basic fact: Both women and men are created by God, The Creator of the whole universe. However, disagreement starts soon after the creation of the first man, Adam, and the first woman, Eve. The Judaeo-Christian conception of the creation of Adam and Eve is narrated in detail in Genesis 2:4-3:24. God prohibited both of them from eating the fruits of the forbidden tree. The serpent seduced Eve to eat from it and Eve, in turn, seduced Adam to eat with her. When God rebuked Adam for what he did, he put all the blame on Eve, "The woman you put here with me --she gave me some fruit from the tree and I ate it." Consequently, God said to Eve:

"I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband and he will rule over you."
To Adam He said:
"Because you listened to your wife and ate from the tree .... Cursed is the ground because of you; through painful toil you will eat of it all the days of your life..."
The Islamic conception of the first creation is found in several places in the Quran, for example:
"O Adam dwell with your wife in the Garden and enjoy as you wish but approach not this tree or you run into harm and transgression. Then Satan whispered to them in order to reveal to them their shame that was hidden from them and he said: 'Your Lord only forbade you this tree lest you become angels or such beings as live forever.' And he swore to them both that he was their sincere adviser. So by deceit he brought them to their fall: when they tasted the tree their shame became manifest to them and they began to sew together the leaves of the Garden over their bodies. And their Lord called unto them: 'Did I not forbid you that tree and tell you that Satan was your avowed enemy?' They said: 'Our Lord we have wronged our own souls and if You forgive us not and bestow not upon us Your Mercy, we shall certainly be lost' " (7:19:23).
A careful look into the two accounts of the story of the Creation reveals some essential differences. The Quran, contrary to the Bible, places equal blame on both Adam and Eve for their mistake. Nowhere in the Quran can one find even the slightest hint that Eve tempted Adam to eat from the tree or even that she had eaten before him. Eve in the Quran is no temptress, no seducer, and no deceiver. Moreover, Eve is not to be blamed for the pains of childbearing. God, according to the Quran, punishes no one for another's faults. Both Adam and Eve committed a sin and then asked God for forgiveness and He forgave them both.

[Friend]

EVE'S LEGACY

The image of Eve as temptress in the Bible has resulted in an extremely negative impact on women throughout the Judaeo-Christian tradition. All women were believed to have inherited from their mother, the Biblical Eve, both her guilt and her guile. Consequently, they were all untrustworthy, morally inferior, and wicked. Menstruation, pregnancy, and childbearing were considered the just punishment for the eternal guilt of the cursed female sex. In order to appreciate how negative the impact of the Biblical Eve was on all her female descendants we have to look at the writings of some of the most important Jews and Christians of all time. Let us start with the Old Testament and look at excerpts from what is called the Wisdom Literature in which we find:
"I find more bitter than death the woman who is a snare, whose heart is a trap and whose hands are chains. The man who pleases God will escape her, but the sinner she will ensnare....while I was still searching but not finding, I found one upright man among a thousand but not one upright woman among them all" (Ecclesiastes 7:26-28).
In another part of the Hebrew literature which is found in the Catholic Bible we read:
"No wickedness comes anywhere near the wickedness of a woman.....Sin began with a woman and thanks to her we all must die" (Ecclesiasticus 25:19,24).

The Biblical Eve has played a far bigger role in Christianity than in Judaism. Her sin has been pivotal to the whole Christian faith because the Christian conception of the reason for the mission of Jesus Christ on Earth stems from Eve's disobedience to God. She had sinned and then seduced Adam to follow her suit. Consequently, God expelled both of them from Heaven to Earth, which had been cursed because of them. They bequeathed their sin, which had not been forgiven by God, to all their descendants and, thus, all humans are born in sin. In order to purify human beings from their 'original sin', God had to sacrifice Jesus, who is considered to be the Son of God, on the cross. Therefore, Eve is responsible for her own mistake, her husband's sin, the original sin of all humanity, and the death of the Son of God. In other words, one woman acting on her own caused the fall of humanity. What about her daughters? They are sinners like her and have to be treated as such. Listen to the severe tone of St. Paul in the New Testament:
"A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I don't permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent. For Adam was formed first, then Eve. And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner" (I Timothy 2:11-14).
St. Tertullian was even more blunt than St. Paul, while he was talking to his 'best beloved sisters' in the faith, he said: 6
"Do you not know that you are each an Eve? The sentence of God on this sex of yours lives in this age: the guilt must of necessity live too. You are the Devil's gateway: You are the unsealer of the forbidden tree: You are the first deserter of the divine law: You are she who persuaded him whom the devil was not valiant enough to attack. You destroyed so easily God's image, man. On account of your desert even the Son of God had to die."
St. Augustine was faithful to the legacy of his predecessors, he wrote to a friend:
"What is the difference whether it is in a wife or a mother, it is still Eve the temptress that we must beware of in any woman......I fail to see what use woman can be to man, if one excludes the function of bearing children."

Centuries later, St. Thomas Aquinas still considered women as defective:
"As regards the individual nature, woman is defective and misbegotten, for the active force in the male seed tends to the production of a perfect likeness in the masculine sex; while the production of woman comes from a defect in the active force or from some material indisposition, or even from some external influence."
Finally, the renowned reformer Martin Luther could not see any benefit from a woman but bringing into the world as many children as possible regardless of any side effects: "If they become tired or even die, that does not matter. Let them die in childbirth, that's why they are there"
Again and again all women are denigrated because of the image of Eve the temptress, thanks to the Genesis account. To sum up, the Judaeo-Christian conception of women has been poisoned by the belief in the sinful nature of Eve and her female offspring.
If we now turn our attention to what the Qurran has to say about women, we will soon realize that the Islamic conception of women is radically different from the Judaeo-Christian one. Let the Quran speak for itself (As I mention in other post ):

"For Muslim men and women, for believing men and women, for devout men and women, for true men and women, for men and women who are patient, for men and women who humble themselves, for men and women who give in charity, for men and women who fast, for men and women who guard their chastity, and for men and women who engage much in Allah's praise-- For them all has Allah prepared forgiveness and great reward" (33:35).

"The believers, men and women, are protectors, one of another: they enjoin what is just, and forbid what is evil, they observe regular prayers, practise regular charity, and obey Allah and His Messenger. On them will Allah pour His Mercy: for Allah is Exalted in power, Wise" (9:71).
"And their Lord answered them: Truly I will never cause to be lost the work of any of you, Be you a male or female, you are members one of another" (3:195).

"Whoever works evil will not be requited but by the like thereof, and whoever works a righteous deed -whether man or woman- and is a believer- such will enter the Garden of bliss" (40:40).
"Whoever works righteousness, man or woman, and has faith, verily to him/her we will give a new life that is good and pure, and we will bestow on such their reward according to the best of their actions" (16:97).

It is clear that the Quranic view of women is no different than that of men. They, both, are God's creatures whose sublime goal on earth is to worship their Lord, do righteous deeds, and avoid evil and they, both, will be assessed accordingly. The Quran never mentions that the woman is the devil's gateway or that she is a deceiver by nature. The Quran, also, never mentions that man is God's image; all men and all women are his creatures, that is all. According to the Quran, a woman's role on earth is not limited only to childbirth. She is required to do as many good deeds as any other man is required to do. The Quran never says that no upright women have ever existed. To the contrary, the Quran has instructed all the believers, women as well as men, to follow the example of those ideal women such as the Virgin Mary and the Pharoah's wife:
"And Allah sets forth, As an example to those who believe, the wife of Pharaoh: Behold she said: 'O my lord build for me, in nearness to you, a mansion in the Garden, and save me from Pharaoh and his doings and save me from those who do wrong.' And Mary the daughter of Imran who guarded her chastity and We breathed into her body of Our spirit; and she testified to the truth of the words of her Lord and of His revelations and was one of the devout" (66:11-13).

[Friend]

BEARING WITNESS
It is true that the Quran has instructed the believers dealing in financial transactions to get two male witnesses or one male and two females (2:282). However, it is also true that the Quran in other situations accepts the testimony of a woman as equal to that of a man. In fact the woman's testimony can even invalidate the man's. If a man accuses his wife of unchastity, he is required by the Quran to solemnly swear five times as evidence of the wife's guilt. If the wife denies and swears similarly five times, she is not considered guilty and in either case the marriage is dissolved (24:6-11).

Also It's clearly mentioned in Al Quraan that sometimes women have many family's tasks that make her forget what she saw or heard , so if they are two women they will remind of each other .

[mirrorinthefog]

Originally Posted by Friend

Salaam
behind every command in Islam their are wisdom and reason , not just to prevent people from doing what they want .Islam want men to be interested in more important things ,If they compete to wear gold and silk they will work to buy the gold and silk and leave other important things , I know that not all men may do this , but many of them .
Now the wonderful thing that experts of the science of Healing energy discovered that gold have negative impact upon men.

You're missing my point, I think.

You are not talking about a restriction that is accepted by all Muslims. There are Muslims who do not believe that gold or silk are forbidden.

I'm not asking you to justify it. I'm offering an alternative viewpoint.

[Faithfulservant]

One question.. if Christianity portrays women as temptresses why do Muslim women have to wear hijab in order to not tempt men with their beautiful hair? I dont understand. If a muslim woman doesnt wear hijab.. and I know some that dont.. are they then considered temptresses and unvirtuous?

[Faithfulservant]

Well noone answered the question in the previous post so let me ask about some other things that I found.




Women are deficient in mind and religion.

Mohammed asked some women, "Isn't the witness of a woman equal to half that of a man?" The women said, "yes," He said, "This is because of the deficiency of the woman's mind. " Vol. 3:826



Mohammed to women: "I have not seen any one more deficient in intelligence and religion than you." Vol. 2:541



The majority of people in hell are women.

Mohammed said, "I was shown the Hell-fire and that the majority of its dwellers are women. " Vol. 1:28, 301; Vol. 2:161; Vol. 7:124



Women are a bad omen.

Mohammed said, " Bad omen is in the woman, the house and the horse." Vol. 7:30



Women are harmful to men.

Mohammed said, "After me I have not left any affliction more harmful to men than women." Vol. 7:33



Women may not wear wigs.

Mohammed said, " Don't wear false hair for Allah sends His curse upon such ladies who lengthen their hair artificially." Vol. 7:133

[Friend]

Salaam

You must write the complete text of Hadith and the occasion of it to understand the importance and the reasons behind them , each Hadith was a reaction of events or discussion between Muslims and prophet ,so to understand any Hadith you must return to the occasion of it .

Women are harmful to men.

Mohammed said, "After me I have not left any affliction more harmful to men than women." Vol. 7:33

I return to the Arabic text , and I read that prophet Mohammed (puh) speak to Muslims women in certain occasion as an advice for them to beware of some behaviors that does not accepted in Islam and he nention about the impact of the women on men ,women can influence the behaviors of men to do good or bad things , so the prophet asked women to remember Allah and his punishment and courage men to do the right behaviors .

Do you see that women can’t influence the behaviors of men ??

Women are deficient in mind and religion.

Mohammed asked some women, "Isn't the witness of a woman equal to half that of a man?" The women said, "yes," He said, "This is because of the deficiency of the woman's mind. " Vol. 3:826

Mohammed to women: "I have not seen any one more deficient in intelligence and religion than you." Vol. 2:541

we should mention here that the prophet spoke about the average not all , we see that most (not all )of women do anything coming in their minds without thinking about the result , there is conflict inside all people (men and women ) between the judgment of heart and the judgment of mind , you can observe that most women tend to follow the Judgment of heart ( this is physically in the women to deal with her children and her family ).and about the religious deficient women doesn't pray or fast in certain time during each month and this is because Allah give them the permission to take rest for healthy purposes , this is what the Muslims scholars said about the religious deficient of women .

we must do not forget that in other situations Islam accepts the testimony of a woman as equal to that of a man. In fact the woman's testimony can even invalidate the man's. If a man accuses his wife of unchastely, he is required by the Quran to solemnly swear five times as evidence of the wife's guilt. If the wife denies and swears similarly five times, she is not considered guilty and in either case the marriage is dissolved (24:6-11).

Also It's clearly mentioned in Al Quraan that sometimes women have many family's tasks that make her forget what she saw or heard

, so if they are two women they will remind of each other .

Women may not wear wigs.

Mohammed said, " Don't wear false hair for Allah sends His curse upon such ladies who lengthen their hair artificially." Vol. 7:133

This indicate that Islam against cheating behaviors , you must does not refuse what Allah give you by changing your outside shape , natural beauty is more beautiful from artificial beauty , and I think the inner beauty is the worthiest beauty .

[hunain]

Originally Posted by Rauzael

The Islamic hadiths are even more ruthless to women.

can you tell me a single hadith which is ruthless to women?

[mansio]

I remember a hadith that was discussed on another forum, in which the Prophet forbade women to walk in the middle of the street, the men's domain, and that they must keep on the sides, kind of hugging the walls.

[hunain]

context plzzzzzzzz

[mansio]

If you insist I can search the discussion on that forum (a couple of months ago), but as far as I remember some people came up to the Prophet complaining that women were freely walking around on market-places and streets.

[hunain]

Originally Posted by mansio

If you insist I can search the discussion on that forum (a couple of months ago), but as far as I remember some people came up to the Prophet complaining that women were freely walking around on market-places and streets.

yes give me the context

[mansio]

I gave it : "Some people complained ...etc".

[redindica]

The ironic thing in all of this, in terms of empasis between the Christian Eve and the Islamic Eve is that there have been quite a few strong female leaders from Christian societies and I see no sign of such a woman emerging from an Islamic state. If Eve was the temptress then Christians seemed to have forgivern her, and allowed members of her sex to lead men once more.

[AhmedKassem]

Originally Posted by redindica

The ironic thing in all of this, in terms of empasis between the Christian Eve and the Islamic Eve is that there have been quite a few strong female leaders from Christian societies and I see no sign of such a woman emerging from an Islamic state. If Eve was the temptress then Christians seemed to have forgivern her, and allowed members of her sex to lead men once more.

The restriction of women in the arabic countries isn't due to islam,but due to pre-islamic arab tradtion.