Would it be wrong?

17th Angel · 08-06-2008, 12:30 AM

Would it be wrong, to become a priest even though I don't really believe in the christian concept of god? lol... There is a poll so you don't have to give your identity to answer you can if you wish just vote and leave it there... Or tell me how you feel lol...

Say if someone wanted to get into a line of work where they can help, grow faith and wisdom... in others. Is that really so bad?

Dream · 08-06-2008, 12:43 AM

Looking for an anology: a doctor who treats drug addictions by prescribing drugs is basically redundant, since he only exists to take his cut.

17th Angel · 08-06-2008, 12:44 AM

I'm not looking for a cut :/ Just a living lol....

Nick_A · 08-06-2008, 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex P

Would it be wrong, to become a priest even though I don't really believe in the christian concept of god? lol... There is a poll so you don't have to give your identity to answer you can if you wish just vote and leave it there... Or tell me how you feel lol...

Say if someone wanted to get into a line of work where they can help, grow faith and wisdom... in others. Is that really so bad?

Is it bad for a person to claim knowledge of medicine and advertise themselves as a doctor? Some say yes and others say no. those who have a greater understanding of medicine and the good and harm it can cause are more apt to think it would be bad to do so.

It is the same with Christianity. How can anyone teach it if they don't understand it? We have many priests of various facets of Christendom but how many understand Christianity enough to be a priest?

Where medicine deals with healing the external man, Christianity deals with the inner man. Where quacks can kill the eternaol man, fake priests can kill the inner man. I don't know if you believe in karma but these fools that pretend to be priests are acquiring nasty karma:

Matthew 18

5"And whoever welcomes a little child like this in my name welcomes me. 6But if anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a large millstone hung around his neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea.

Jesus is referring to those that have begun to awaken and fall pray to people we call "experts" that turn it to fantasy. Such egotism is far from the best for ones "inner man."

path_of_one · 08-06-2008, 03:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex P

Would it be wrong, to become a priest even though I don't really believe in the christian concept of god?

I'm not sure which Christian concept(s) of god you don't believe in, so it's tough to answer. Christian concepts of God range from firmly trinitarian to incomprehensible being-ness. There is a ton of variety in the denominations, and some have only lay preachers as a tradition while others have paid and trained clergy. Some require years of study, others feel all minister from temporary touch of the Spirit's insight.

So far as I can tell, there is no one Christian concept of God.

That said, it's pretty tough to be hired as a priest unless you believe in the denomination's mainstream view of God, whatever that is for that denomination.

If you lie to get there, you're kind of screwing up the possible ends (good work) through sinful means (lying).

So those are the issues I foresee.

I didn't vote because there wasn't really an option for "Need more info."

Quote:

Say if someone wanted to get into a line of work where they can help, grow faith and wisdom... in others. Is that really so bad?

No. But why Christianity if you aren't Christian? Why any religion at all? Why not a non-profit, or activist position? Or become a counselor? A nurse or doctor? A job coach for homeless people? A teacher?

There are loads of jobs that will pay a living wage and allow someone to grow wisdom and love among others.

As I see it, preachers of a particular faith are dedicated to growing a particular kind of faith...

This is why I'm not one. While I have religions, I feel more broadly dedicated to simply growing love. And personally, that is not tied to a particular religion for me. So my goal is to do practical things as much as I can in my career- teach, work for human rights, sustainability, health, etc.- that spreads the conditions that allow people the time, energy, and freedom to find their own way to Love.

Anyhoo, my 2 cents worth.

Dondi · 08-06-2008, 12:52 PM

Are you talking about become a Catholic priest? If such the case 1) you would first have to become Catholic 2) If you become Catholic, then you are submitting to the teachings and doctrines of the Catholic Church, which includes the belief in the Christian God 3) For you to become a priest, you would have to go to seminary where you would be taught those doctrine 4) You would have to perform the ritual of the Mass and the Eucharest should you be assigned a parish 5) Why did you want to become a priest again?

Now, if you wanted to become a priest in some other denomination, sect, or religion, whatever you choose you likewise are submitting to the doctrines of that particular denomination, sect, or religion. I would question you sincerity and motivation in becoming a priest if you didn't conform to those doctrines or beliefs. A preist represents an authority of that religion.

Now, of course, you could become a priest in the Seventeenth Church of the Order of St. Alex, which would be legit because you have your own doctrine and you are your own congregation.

Maybe you wish to be a priest or minister just so you have access to people in need, such as hospitals or prison where you can visit freely as a minister of faith. Have you spotted this ad in the Google advertisments?

Interfaith Seminary

Seems like something that doesn't require adherence to one particular belief, but you would have some training in all the worlds religious disciplines, which would equip you to deal and minister to people of all faiths.

dauer · 08-06-2008, 04:26 PM

I second Dondi's suggestion, if you're really contemplating the clergy.

taijasi · 08-06-2008, 06:55 PM

Where best to work towards Reform, than from within?

From what centre of Love and Light (I affirm one within each of us, and this is just the beginning) ... do we suppose Christ Jesus works?

A priest who held a conviction that no spiritual power exists whatsoever, and who sought only to alleviate human suffering, might be too much of a true Humanist to be able to fulfil the Church's charge ... even if that Church be the Unitarian Univeralist! (and they're pretty darn laid-back and inclusive, yes?)

But suppose a person is drawn to Buddhism, and finds the greatest personal empowerment and inspiration in the Bodhisattva Vow and all that this stands for? Who's to say that such inspiration does not emanate directly from the heart of God, even in a way which that priest knows, understands and chooses to share with others -- through Christianity?

Dream · 08-06-2008, 07:25 PM

What do you think of this?

Let's say you plan make it to the top of a religious organization to initiate change.
What must you become to reach the top? You are a living creature, shaped by your surroundings. You're a creature of habit, and you're in deep. The harder you push for change, the more you must conform. Won't your point of view adjust towards the norm? An atheist pretending to be a minister (like the Bishop of Canterbury) forgets and becomes a minister. Doesn't a minister pretending atheism become an atheist? Don't push for change, and you'll keep yourself but for what purpose?
You stay either mid-level or membership level and work for change:
Will you see any change at the higher level? Won't all of your personal accomplishments be attributed to your organization? What change, then, have you made to your organization of choice? You've changed only yourself and your surroundings. Great -- but why did you join in the first place?

Dondi · 08-06-2008, 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by taijasi

Where best to work towards Reform, than from within?

From what centre of Love and Light (I affirm one within each of us, and this is just the beginning) ... do we suppose Christ Jesus works?

A priest who held a conviction that no spiritual power exists whatsoever, and who sought only to alleviate human suffering, might be too much of a true Humanist to be able to fulfil the Church's charge ... even if that Church be the Unitarian Univeralist! (and they're pretty darn laid-back and inclusive, yes?)

But suppose a person is drawn to Buddhism, and finds the greatest personal empowerment and inspiration in the Bodhisattva Vow and all that this stands for? Who's to say that such inspiration does not emanate directly from the heart of God, even in a way which that priest knows, understands and chooses to share with others -- through Christianity?

Holy Sh--! Andrew!! Where did you come from? How ya doin' buddy?

path_of_one · 08-06-2008, 11:02 PM

Andrew! Where'd you go? Anywhere exciting?

17th Angel · 08-06-2008, 11:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by taijasi

But suppose a person is drawn to Buddhism, and finds the greatest personal empowerment and inspiration in the Bodhisattva Vow and all that this stands for? Who's to say that such inspiration does not emanate directly from the heart of God, even in a way which that priest knows, understands and chooses to share with others -- through Christianity?

Didn't expect so many replies... Will get around to them all lol..... What if it is a simple English man? Who finds he isn't drawn to such things as buddhism.... As he cannot pronounce nor focus or keep an interest in the words offered? But he finds a plain and simple religion such as christianity... Which even if there are parts he doesn't accept... At least he is honest unlike many priests... lol.... And he want's to just help.... And connecting this to Path of ones post... Because he has to work, he has to make money/a living... So such things as voulnteering isn't going to happen either..

17th Angel · 08-06-2008, 11:53 PM

Dondi yah for sure... I'll follow the scriptures lol... I would see them as simply guidelines as you have in any job... There are set out "steps" and I would of course follow them as that is what my role would require...

And I KNOW this is going to sound messed up but If I can aid those of a faith(-even- If I do not hold it) feel something more for their faith and help bond them to it sweet... lol... Yeah Crazy.... I am just really at the end of the cliff now looking for a job, and I think I could do this. I think it would be awesome to help inspire and watch faith grow in people, and also the major part, people come to a priest in times of need, something like that I'd love... Of course I have my wage... But I am helping and not trying to rip the people off... You can come without having to pay ludacis "Therapy" and "shrink" prices... And for free have someone to talk to That's cool...

Quahom1 · 08-07-2008, 12:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex P

Would it be wrong, to become a priest even though I don't really believe in the christian concept of god? lol... There is a poll so you don't have to give your identity to answer you can if you wish just vote and leave it there... Or tell me how you feel lol...

Say if someone wanted to get into a line of work where they can help, grow faith and wisdom... in others. Is that really so bad?

Well there is a place for one, who does not believe in a particular way or faith of God, yet can be a minister (legally and without hypocracy), to those that do believe in a particular faith or way of God.

That would be a "military chaplain". Since their job is to minister (not preach), one would be right in line with supporting those in need of support (spiritually), wearing the uniform.

For example: I (catholic) was married to a Southern Baptist, in an Episcopal chapel, by a Presbyterian Minister (chaplain). A year or so later our son was baptized a catholic in that same chapel, by a Baptist minister (chaplain).

The military (chaplain), must be versed in a variety of faiths and religous proceedings, in order to meet the needs of the service men and women within their area of responsibility. And they are highly respected by all of us.

US military chaplains are from all walks of life and faith. Perhaps the British armed services are the same in this light.

v/r

Q

17th Angel · 08-07-2008, 12:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dream

What do you think of this?

Let's say you plan make it to the top of a religious organization to initiate change.
What must you become to reach the top? You are a living creature, shaped by your surroundings. You're a creature of habit, and you're in deep. The harder you push for change, the more you must conform. Won't your point of view adjust towards the norm? An atheist pretending to be a minister (like the Bishop of Canterbury) forgets and becomes a minister. Doesn't a minister pretending atheism become an atheist? Don't push for change, and you'll keep yourself but for what purpose?
You stay either mid-level or membership level and work for change:
Will you see any change at the higher level? Won't all of your personal accomplishments be attributed to your organization? What change, then, have you made to your organization of choice? You've changed only yourself and your surroundings. Great -- but why did you join in the first place?

Nope not looking for high "ranking" job... So getting to the top doesn't bother me... All I want is to be able to support myself.... While doing a meaningful job.

Stay at mid level or entry level? That is fine, I'd be comfortable there. I wouldn't be looking to change the "organisation" I would be looking to help others outside of it that put stock into it... You see what I mean? I don't care if I don't change that parish/church/whatnot to agree that priests can wear shorts.... Or every wednesday we have a wet t shirt festival or whatever lol... That doesn't bother me... Mr Joe Smith, who comes in because he needs a shoulder to lean on and has alot on his mind and wishes to speak to another for advice or maybe just to have someone to listen... That is what would matter to me.... And there are not that many paid lines of work in this world like this.... OR not that I have come across... :/