Satan accuses us before God

Dream

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I apologize, Soleil10. It is hard for me to get to the point, especially coming from a different perspective. Rev. 12:8, the verse you mentioned that talks about the accuser of the brethren, starts out with "Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ..." and I think this verse is about neither past, nor present, nor a future time but about what Jesus means. I think it is really another way of saying what Hebrews 2:14 says "that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;" Each Christian has to 'take up' their own cross. Each Christian is crucified with Christ, and I think Revelation, including the part about the accuser, is talking about that. The rest of what I said was an attempt to be open about how I see things in general, so you can see where I'm coming from -- instead of me pretending to share the same perspective -- which is what a troublemaker would do.
 

soleil10

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Dream, you do not have to apolog, I was just trying to understand your answer to what I was saying. Now I wll read it again knowing what you were trying to accomplish.

I will not accuse you before God. (Just jocking)
 

winner08

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Even if I show scriptures, all you wil do is to say that it was part of Gods plan any way to change.

Why are you putting God in a frosen throne up there so distant. Look at the creation that is full of surprises and excitment. You mis-understand the word unchanging. It applies to God's principles and laws and uncinditional love.

The God you describe is cold as marble and rigide as the guard in a concentration camp. That is such a shame, really.

I am not a puppet on a string

Soiel10 My God is the God of the Bible. Old and New testament. how do expalin God given instructions to the isrealiets everytime they went in a city or county and make war with them and kill everbody including wemon men childern and infants. This is God. Do you say He is responsible for these things or not. God in the old test. is war. can you not see this? what do you see?

Darren
 

winner08

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Your wrong Soiel10 The God I describe is a God of ALL THINGS. God is responsible for His creation. The bible is full of these scripture. God is the Potter and we are the clay. You and people like you do God an injustice by not allowing God to be all. God is God because He can bring war for divine purpose. Just as when the Isrealites were given the promise land. They had to make war with many trible and God instructed them Not to leave any alive. To KILL everyone. Read the O.T. there's no denieing it. Does this make God cold. NO. God is not human. God can do thing we can not even comperhend. How do you explain God given the Isrealites the promise land and these land were already occupied. God told them how to fight and when to fight. Jerrico is just one city that was destroyed by the Isrealites. So when you say God is not responsible for these thing you are so wrong and must not have read the O.T.

Darren
 

soleil10

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Soiel10 My God is the God of the Bible. Old and New testament. how do expalin God given instructions to the isrealiets everytime they went in a city or county and make war with them and kill everbody including wemon men childern and infants. This is God. Do you say He is responsible for these things or not. God in the old test. is war. can you not see this? what do you see?Darren
Once again, you need to go back to what happened during the fall of man ?
Man became divided following two masters. From that moment starting from man as an indidual there is a war inside of us. This war is not God's fault and it is for man to restore it. God is a God of peace.

Please understand where the origin of war is. A&E put Lucifer in a position of authority over them and in a competition with God. From that moment war has never stopped.

God tried to stop this war from expanding by asking Cain the elder son to submit to his brother Abel. What was the purpose ?
Since Lucifer did not submit himself to Adam, Cain would have reversed satan's fallen nature that he had inherited. Instead Cain killed his brother and that war expanded within that first family and on and on....
If you look at the bible this Cain and Abel scenario is repeated over and over.
God's favors the younger son, ask him to love the older son and ask the older son to serve his younger brother. This is in order to reverse what happened during the human fall.
Jacob was incredibely victorious with his brother Esau and received the name Israel.
From there God was able to work with nations and go beyond the level of families
In addition of making a foundation to reverse the order of authority, God also ask the central figures that He chooses to establish a foundation of faith. Example Noah and the Ark, Abraham and the offering.

To crete a foundation to receive the Messiah, God needed one family or one nation as the word became bigger to establish a foundation of faith and a foundation the reverse the lost order of authority.

The Israelist following Moses lost faith so many times that it took 40 years what would have taken 40 days.

Before I disgress I want to emphasize that War is not God's fault.

This Cain and Abel process of restoration went from the individual level all the way to the world level. There are always 2 sides. One represents Cain and one represents Abel. For examples World war II, or communism and democracy. The Cain side which represent Satan always attacks first.

We saw during Jesus Crucifiction, there were on thief on his right side and one thief on his left side. The thief on the right supported Jesus and the thief on the left side accused Jesus.

Our original parents failed and us as their descendants we are fighting. If Jesus could have start a family, we would have had new original sinless ancestors/parents.

Only such parents can bring peace with the children. God is our parent in Heaven but he wanted to have Heavenly parents representing Him here on earth.

I am sorry to mention but this but only satan would say that God is a God of war.
It is such a terrible thing to say. It hurts God so much to hear this.
Satan is the ultimate deceiver. He hides so well
 

Azure24

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Once again, you need to go back to what happened during the fall of man ?
Man became divided following two masters. From that moment starting from man as an indidual there is a war inside of us. This war is not God's fault and it is for man to restore it. God is a God of peace.

Scripture?? Witnesses??

Please understand where the origin of war is. A&E put Lucifer in a position of authority over them and in a competition with God. From that moment war has never stopped.

Scripture?? Witnesses??

God tried to stop this war from expanding by asking Cain the elder son to submit to his brother Abel. What was the purpose ?

Scripture?? Witnesses??


Since Lucifer did not submit himself to Adam, Cain would have reversed satan's fallen nature that he had inherited. Instead Cain killed his brother and that war expanded within that first family and on and on....
If you look at the bible this Cain and Abel scenario is repeated over and over.

Scripture?? Where??

God's favors the younger son, ask him to love the older son and ask the older son to serve his younger brother. This is in order to reverse what happened during the human fall.

Scripture?? Witnesses??

In addition of making a foundation to reverse the order of authority, God also ask the central figures that He chooses to establish a foundation of faith. Example Noah and the Ark, Abraham and the offering.

Scripture?? Witnesses??

To crete a foundation to receive the Messiah, God needed one family or one nation as the word became bigger to establish a foundation of faith and a foundation the reverse the lost order of authority.

Scripture?? Witnesses??

The Israelist following Moses lost faith so many times that it took 40 years what would have taken 40 days.

Scripture?? Witnesses??

Before I disgress I want to emphasize that War is not God's fault.

Scripture?? Witnesses??

Are you trying to say man is responsible??

I have Scripture, you don't...

Witness No. 1

"If anyone does not listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name, I myself will call him to ACCOUNT."


Witness No. 2

"Now I am saying to you that, for every idle declaration which men shall be speaking they shall be rendering an ACCOUNT concerning it in the day of judging"
(Matt. 12:36).


Witness No. 3

"For all of us shall be presented at the dais of God ... Consequently then, each of us shall be giving ACCOUNT concerning himself to God"(Rom. 14:11-12)

ACCOUNT not RESPONSIBILITY!!!

This Cain and Abel process of restoration went from the individual level all the way to the world level. There are always 2 sides. One represents Cain and one represents Abel. For examples World war II, or communism and democracy. The Cain side which represent Satan always attacks first.

Scripture?? Witnesses??

We saw during Jesus Crucifiction, there were on thief on his right side and one thief on his left side. The thief on the right supported Jesus and the thief on the left side accused Jesus.

And...

Our original parents failed and us as their descendants we are fighting. If Jesus could have start a family, we would have had new original sinless ancestors/parents.

Scripture?? Witnesses??

Only such parents can bring peace with the children. God is our parent in Heaven but he wanted to have Heavenly parents representing Him here on earth.

Scripture?? Witnesses??

I am sorry to mention but this but only satan would say that God is a God of war.
It is such a terrible thing to say. It hurts God so much to hear this.
Satan is the ultimate deceiver. He hides so well

Where did you get this from soleil?? If it was from Scripture, where are the witnesses??? Exactly!!

If you did not get this from Scripture, you could not have gotten this from nowhere...Well?? You got this from man...

...and what does Scripture tell us about man??

Witness No. 1

"Put NOT your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help"
(Psalm 146:3).

Witness No. 2

"We must OBEY God rather than men!"(Acts 5:29)
 

winner08

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Once again, you need to go back to what happened during the fall of man ?
Man became divided following two masters. From that moment starting from man as an indidual there is a war inside of us. This war is not God's fault and it is for man to restore it. God is a God of peace.

Please understand where the origin of war is. A&E put Lucifer in a position of authority over them and in a competition with God. From that moment war has never stopped.

God tried to stop this war from expanding by asking Cain the elder son to submit to his brother Abel. What was the purpose ?
Since Lucifer did not submit himself to Adam, Cain would have reversed satan's fallen nature that he had inherited. Instead Cain killed his brother and that war expanded within that first family and on and on....
If you look at the bible this Cain and Abel scenario is repeated over and over.
God's favors the younger son, ask him to love the older son and ask the older son to serve his younger brother. This is in order to reverse what happened during the human fall.
Jacob was incredibely victorious with his brother Esau and received the name Israel.
From there God was able to work with nations and go beyond the level of families
In addition of making a foundation to reverse the order of authority, God also ask the central figures that He chooses to establish a foundation of faith. Example Noah and the Ark, Abraham and the offering.

To crete a foundation to receive the Messiah, God needed one family or one nation as the word became bigger to establish a foundation of faith and a foundation the reverse the lost order of authority.

The Israelist following Moses lost faith so many times that it took 40 years what would have taken 40 days.

Before I disgress I want to emphasize that War is not God's fault.

This Cain and Abel process of restoration went from the individual level all the way to the world level. There are always 2 sides. One represents Cain and one represents Abel. For examples World war II, or communism and democracy. The Cain side which represent Satan always attacks first.

We saw during Jesus Crucifiction, there were on thief on his right side and one thief on his left side. The thief on the right supported Jesus and the thief on the left side accused Jesus.

Our original parents failed and us as their descendants we are fighting. If Jesus could have start a family, we would have had new original sinless ancestors/parents.

Only such parents can bring peace with the children. God is our parent in Heaven but he wanted to have Heavenly parents representing Him here on earth.

I am sorry to mention but this but only satan would say that God is a God of war.
It is such a terrible thing to say. It hurts God so much to hear this.
Satan is the ultimate deceiver. He hides so well

first of all My God is a God of everything. As it states in the scriptures God is all IN all. Meaninning that My God is in war Just as in love just as in mercy as in justice. My God is big enough to be in all things. My God is sovergien. He is all powerful. Your then one blinded by the beliefs in man traditions and teachings that you can not even see God for what He truly is. (ALL IN ALL). You sound like every other born again christian in the mainstream christiandom pulpits of mans teachings. its ashame that millions of people like you are decieved. And like you they do not believe in the scriptures.

You said God TRYED to stop the war from expanding. WHAT !! here you go putting God down to a human level of power. Tryed to stop the war, man you are unbelievable. How is it that you can't even give God enough credit and power to stop a war if He chose to. Just as you say God needs man's cooperation. WHAT!! man, do you hear yourself. God would not be God if He needed man's cooperation for anything. You are just always bringing God down to a human level and thinking. Maby you are satan??

Just as you strongly believe that man failed. You give God no credit for His thinking and power. For His plan. How can you possible think that God would create something that would fail. Again I ask you what kind of God is He?? To create something that would fail. Is not God perfect. Is not God perfect in ALL He does including His plan for mankind? If His plan failed then He is not perfect. Can anybody here see this. Does anybody here see that if man has fallen then God can not be perfect. perfection has no part in faliures. the two contradicts one and other. One can not be perfect and fail.

AND you still never explained to me why did God instructed Isreal (hebrews) to go into a country and totally kill ever living person. I told you the Old Testament is full of scripture proving that God Told the hebrews when they go to war to kill every living. Man even you can not say that God is not responsible for the 10 plagues of Egypt that killed thousands of people man women and children. Please tell me who is responsible for that. What can you possible come up with this time soliel?
Here is prof that God iss responsible for these actions. This does not make God out to be evil. God uses these things for His DIVINE purpose. can you see this? can anyone of you see this?

Darren
 

Marsh

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Marsh how did God change His plan for man. When the scripture says God does not change.... If so show me scrpture where God changed His plan for man. If it was a change God would have took that into consideration and put that in His plan which would not make it a change it would be part of His plan.


Darren, were you asking me this question rhetorically? Because I'm not sure that I see the connection between my post and your comments.
 

Marsh

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Not specifically. I would not dare.

I see a lot of people who keep repeating things that they do not understand themselves and do not make any sense. They do not feel free to even question it


Funny; I was just thinking the exact same thing! ;)



soleil10 said:
Let's be honest Marsh, asking for forgiveness and doing it again is what fallen nature is. Satan has many hooks on us.

ST Paul recognized that "

For I delight in the law of God in my inmost self, but I see in my members another law…making me captive to the law of sin… So then, with my mind I am a slave to the law of God, but with my flesh I am a slave to the law of sin

.

Which is it, Soleil? Is sin our problem, or is it Satan's? Because if Satan is our master, then we sin because we're trying to please him. But if God is our master, we sin when we forget about him. When Paul says that he's a slave to sin, he is not saying that he is a slave to Satan; rather, he begins each letter by stating that he is God's bondservant, yeah?

Read: "with my flesh I am a slave to the law of sin."

Sin is not fallen man's nature; it is man's nature, because Adam and Eve both sinned before God's curse, not after it. And what was Satan's big hook that he used to deceive them? He told them that God was lying, and they bought it. Wow, Satan really is a master of deceit! I mean, how does he come up with this stuff? And Eve resisted so much, and tried to overcome so much, and Adam too....

Come on! Satan doesn't compel us to sin; as James wrote, we sin when we allow our own selfish desires to carry us away, and these desires originate within us, not because of Satan. You don't think that given enough time Eve wouldn't have chosen to sin on her own? Give me a break; Satan just expedited the process. People are wicked, plain and simple, and given enough time away from a shepherd we are capable of absolutely anything. The idea that our sins are due to "fallen nature" or to Satan's influence is nothing more than a cop-out.
 

soleil10

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Funny; I was just thinking the exact same thing! ;)[/quote]
We agree about something.[/quote]
I will take that as an hopeful sign

Which is it, Soleil? Is sin our problem, or is it Satan's?
Both

Because if Satan is our master, then we sin because we're trying to please him.
We are trying to please our fallen nature that we inherited from him.

But if God is our master, we sin when we forget about him. When Paul says that he's a slave to sin, he is not saying that he is a slave to Satan; rather, he begins each letter by stating that he is God's bondservant, yeah?
Read: "with my flesh I am a slave to the law of sin."

Goodness also has its laws. For example Goodness teach us to live for the sake of others. The law of sin teach us to be selfish and sacrifice others for ourselves. Both laws are usually opposite of each other. Satan and God are going in opposite directions

Sin is not fallen man's nature; it is man's nature
Sin are the consequence of our fallen actions (including thoughts)

because Adam and Eve both sinned before God's curse, not after it.
Of course otherwise, they would not have been chased out ot the garden

And what was Satan's big hook that he used to deceive them? He told them that God was lying, and they bought it.
The process of the fall is more complex than that. In ant case, God gave A&E a specific commandement about a specific issue. By rejecting God's commandement and believing Lucifer, they put Lucifer in a position of authority over them. Another question is what motivated Lucifer, a good Archangel to loose faith in God, twist God's commandement, mislead Eve and of course why did Eve fell for it.

Everyhing has a cause and a reason

Wow, Satan really is a master of deceit! I mean, how does he come up with this stuff? And Eve resisted so much, and tried to overcome so much, and Adam too....
It does not say in the bible how much Eve resisted as well as Adam.

Come on! Satan doesn't compel us to sin; as James wrote, we sin when we allow our own selfish desires to carry us away, and these desires originate within us, not because of Satan.
We inherited our fallen nature from Satan. Jesus even said that he was our father. It is in the bible. As his children, we are doing the desire of our father.

You don't think that given enough time Eve wouldn't have chosen to sin on her own?
The fall of man was a very specific sin with eternal consequences. Also I hope you do not confuse mistakes and sins.

Give me a break; Satan just expedited the process. People are wicked, plain and simple, and given enough time away from a shepherd we are capable of absolutely anything. The idea that our sins are due to "fallen nature" or to Satan's influence is nothing more than a cop-out.
Yes fallen people can be wicked, some more than others. Satan hopes that every one believes what you just wrote. In this way men keep fighting with each other blaming "human nature" while he can hide.

God said in Genesis that what he created was very good. He did not his creation including man was wicked.

If we look at the bible with a fallen man point of view, then we miss God's original plan.
 

Marsh

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soleil10 said:
The process of the fall is more complex than that. In ant case, God gave A&E a specific commandement about a specific issue. By rejecting God's commandement and believing Lucifer, they put Lucifer in a position of authority over them. Another question is what motivated Lucifer, a good Archangel to loose faith in God, twist God's commandement, mislead Eve and of course why did Eve fell for it.

It does not say in the bible how much Eve resisted as well as Adam.


No, actually it is as simple as that, and you're blowing it out of proportion in order to create theology. Adam did not inherit a sinful nature from Satan; he had it in the beginning. The Bible says that God's creation was "very good," but there's a big difference between good and perfect. We are created very good, but not perfect, and that is why we sin.

And it does say exactly how much Eve resisted the serpant: It says that she didn't.

By saying that it's Satan's fault that we are sinners, you are copping out and not accepting responsibility for your own actions. Jesus did not say that Satan is your father, Soleil; he said that to Pharisees. Are you a Pharisee? No? Then Satan is not your father. Jesus said that your father is God-- assuming that you've made Jesus your brother, that is. If you have no faith in Jesus then, yes, by all means make Satan your father. But again, don't paint the rest of us with your brush, because we believe in the LORD and in his Christ.
 
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first of all My God is a God of everything. As it states in the scriptures God is all IN all. Meaninning that My God is in war Just as in love just as in mercy as in justice. My God is big enough to be in all things. My God is sovergien. He is all powerful.

God would not be God if He needed man's cooperation for anything.

If His plan failed then He is not perfect. Can anybody here see this. perfection has no part in faliures. the two contradicts one and other. One can not be perfect and fail.

..even you can not say that God is not responsible for the 10 plagues of Egypt that killed thousands of people man women and children. Please tell me who is responsible for that.
Here is prof that God is responsible for these actions. This does not make God out to be evil. God uses these things for His DIVINE purpose. can you see this? can anyone of you see this?

Darren

I see, Darren. I totally agree with you, brother. God's will is always done and can never be undone. Sometimes, God's will works in a way that we cannot comprehend because our knowledge is very short, and our reactions normally follows our knowledge.

A true believer always thanks God, and is patient in the time of distress for a true believer is sure of God's mercy, and wisdom. A true follower submits to God's will. A true believer once said: "If I knew the unseen, I wouldnt be more sure of God's wisdom and mercy as I am now". A true believer has total confidence in God's mercy and power...
 

soleil10

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No, actually it is as simple as that, and you're blowing it out of proportion in order to create theology. Adam did not inherit a sinful nature from Satan; he had it in the beginning.

So a perfect God who is 100% good and Holy created "sinful nature" with sin built in !!! WOW !!!

Lucifer, Eve then Adam fell in that order. The fallen started from Lucifer who became satan

Once again the original sin was not just a learning and growing mistake.
It was the one sin God clearly warned them about because God knows that sin would have huge consequences on the future which it did

What sin can create so much damage ? It was not the eating of an apple.

The Bible says that God's creation was "very good," but there's a big difference between good and perfect. We are created very good, but not perfect, and that is why we sin.
When God says that what He created is very good, that is impressive. Yes everything go through a growth period. That is quite different than saying that A&E were created with a sinfull nature. They had their original nature that became fallen nature after the human fall.

By saying that it's Satan's fault that we are sinners, you are copping out and not accepting responsibility for your own actions.
I have never said that. I have always said that man has his portion of responsibility for the good or the bad. Man has to regain his position over Satan because we (A&E) put him in that position of authority. God will not do it for us.

Jesus did not say that Satan is your father, Soleil; he said that to Pharisees. Are you a Pharisee? No? Then Satan is not your father. Jesus said that your father is God-- assuming that you've made Jesus your brother, that is. If you have no faith in Jesus then, yes, by all means make Satan your father. But again, don't paint the rest of us with your brush, because we believe in the LORD and in his Christ.
Jesus said we are both. Believing in Christ does not mean that we do not commit any more sins. This means that satan still has some power on us individually like with the Pharisees.

Saint Paul made it clear that in his own life he was struglling with this same dillema despite his incredible faith in Jesus.
 

Marsh

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So a perfect God who is 100% good and Holy created "sinful nature" with sin built in !!! WOW !!!

...

Jesus said we are both. Believing in Christ does not mean that we do not commit any more sins. This means that satan still has some power on us individually like with the Pharisees.


And once again an appeal to emotions instead of reason. "!!! WOW !!!" ? Gimme a break. :rolleyes:

You might be a robot, but I'm not. I get to make choices for myself, and when I choose to sin, then it is my fault. You want to blame it on Satan? Go right ahead, dear. But keep in mind that Jesus is going to separate us into two groups at the end: sheep and goats. The sheep are the ones whose father is God. The goats are the ones who did not accept God as their father. There is no middle ground; there is no category for people who are sometimes God's children, and sometimes Satan's children. And as Jesus said, those who accept that their sins are their own fault and repent from them and ask for forgiveness, will be forgiven. And those who prefer to put the responsibility on their so-called fallen nature (which amounts to saying it's not their fault, but rather Satan's fault, or Adam & Eve's fault, or God's fault for putting the tree of knowledge there in the first place) will probably not be forgiven, because they won't really think they themselves have sinned.


!!! WOW !!!

...said the five virgins as the doors shut on them.
 

soleil10

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And once again an appeal to emotions instead of reason. "!!! WOW !!!" ? Gimme a break. :rolleyes:
I do not know why you would say that

You might be a robot, but I'm not.
I do not know whay you would say that too

I get to make choices for myself, and when I choose to sin, then it is my fault.
You are stonger than all the saints that ever walked on the face of the earth.

You want to blame it on Satan? Go right ahead, dear.
I am not just blaming it on Satan. We have our portion of responsibility and are responsible for our sins.

But keep in mind that Jesus is going to separate us into two groups at the end: sheep and goats. The sheep are the ones whose father is God. The goats are the ones who did not accept God as their father. There is no middle ground; there is no category for people who are sometimes God's children, and sometimes Satan's children.
I understand, there is a difference between someone that categorically reject God but even those that believe in God, we all acts sometimes as God's children or sometimes asSatan's children. We are quite unreliable

And as Jesus said, those who accept that their sins are their own fault and repent from them and ask for forgiveness, will be forgiven.
Yes, it is good to sincerelly repent and repair the wrong we have done.

And those who prefer to put the responsibility on their so-called fallen nature (which amounts to saying it's not their fault, but rather Satan's fault, or Adam & Eve's fault, or God's fault for putting the tree of knowledge there in the first place) will probably not be forgiven, because they won't really think they themselves have sinned.
That is not what I wrote, ever. We need to overcome our fallen nature and follow Jesus' example.
What I said is that only the Messiah can uproot the original sin and start a Godly family completel separated from Satan to whom all fallen men can connect.

God's purpose for his creation is to create ideal families. The 3 blessings He gave to A&E in genesis were not fulfilled. The first family failed but God's purpose has not changed.
For this reason Jesus came as the second Adam.
 

Marsh

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I do not know why you would say that


I do not know whay you would say that too


That is not what I wrote, ever. We need to overcome our fallen nature and follow Jesus' example.


The reason why I have been saying these things, Soleil, is because I disagree with the gospel that you have been, in a sense, preaching. I disagree with it, because it is not the gospel of Jesus Christ; it is something of your own creation. It is a gospel of self-righteousness, where our goal is to live successfully apart from God. It is a gospel where Jesus is an example, and not a saviour. It is a gospel where forgiveness is secondary to a person's righteous works. It is a gospel where God's powers are limited to what human beings can see and understand. It is a gospel in which Satan is equal in power to God, the Holy Spirit is a woman, Jesus' father is Zacharias, and the Messiah has not yet come.

In short, it is a false gospel. Expect criticism.

Yours truly,
Marsh
 

soleil10

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The reason why I have been saying these things, Soleil, is because I disagree with the gospel that you have been, in a sense, preaching. I disagree with it, because it is not the gospel of Jesus Christ; it is something of your own creation. It is a gospel of self-righteousness, where our goal is to live successfully apart from God.
To live successfully apart from God ? I have never ever said that. I believe the opposite.

It is a gospel where Jesus is an example, and not a saviour.
Jesus is a saviour. I have never said otherwise.

It is a gospel where forgiveness is secondary to a person's righteous works.
Here again you are mis-quoting what I wrote.

It is a gospel where God's powers are limited to what human beings can see and understand. It is a gospel in which Satan is equal in power to God
Your are not interested to understand what I shared and you are twisiting it

the Holy Spirit is a woman, Jesus' father is Zacharias, and the Messiah has not yet come.
The Holy spirit is understood by mots people to be a comforting and feminine spirit. The Messiah has come and is returning. Nothing new here.
Concerning Zacharias, if you were open enough to study the issue, you may be surprised.

In short, it is a false gospel. Expect criticism.
It is very much OK to says that you disagree with someone else opinion, understanding or beliefs. It is something else to twist their words and it is not wise to just tell someone that they beliefs are false and that you only know the truth. Humility is always the better way to communicate. It does not mean that you are confident in your own faith
 

Quahom1

What was the question?
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If we commit even one sin, Satan, the devil, will immediately accuse us before God and say, “Because of this sin, this guy must go to hell.”
Though Satan, who accuses human beings for their sin, has surely committed plenty of sins himself. Someone has to come forward to accuse Satan in front of God for his sins.
If a person who can regain the original authority and stand in a position higher than Satan can come forth and say,” O absolute God! Satan has commited such and such unpardonable sins against humankind, and against You. Please punish him”.
If God could not remove Satan even through this method, He would be on the side of Satan, not of humankind.
What you say is absolutely correct. And the reality is that "one" has stepped forward and accused Satan of committing the very unpardonable sins against GOD, let alone mankind, and has decreed that Satan will pay for such attrocities. Only he went one step further. He paid for our sins as well as condemning Satan for his failures.
 

soleil10

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What you say is absolutely correct. And the reality is that "one" has stepped forward and accused Satan of committing the very unpardonable sins against GOD, let alone mankind, and has decreed that Satan will pay for such attrocities.
Yes Jesus was able to step forward because Satan did not have any claim on him

Only he went one step further. He paid for our sins as well as condemning Satan for his failures.
Yes after being rejected by the ones God had prepared to receive him, he had to go the way of the cross. Satan took his physical body but Jesus was totally victorious spiritually and brought spiritual salvation to all mankind. By believing in him and following him we can inherit his victory.

The Messiah has to come a 3rd time to bring physical salvation and remove the original sin that every human is still born with form generation to generation
 
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