"Objectivism" - A response to the Pornography Argument

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c0de

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Wisdom always was and inner morality is an expression of wisdom. Wisdom is speaking:

If this concept "always existed" then by definition
it is external and independent of us.

What is rememberd is soul knowledge which isn't reason or dictates but that which is a rememberd unconditioned expression of our being.
Actually, what you just said, makes morality irrational.
Therefore, you can not define your morality through
your own reason but actually require dictates.

Your entire argument is self-defeating.


To the contrary, inner morality has the firmest foundation possible since it is objective inner knowledge and an expression of the depths of our being. Simone gives an interesting test for inner morality for those that have experienced it yet few would be brave enough to take it during a moral crisis:
See above.


So since God creates the body of a fourteen year old girl that is pornographic by having a picture fall into the hands of a forty year old guy, it means God is a pornographer since he created this potential.
Wrong! It is not the body which is evil,
it is the manner in which it is used against
the dictates of God which makes the act "evil".
 

Bandit

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Wrong! It is not the body which is evil,
it is the manner in which it is used against
the dictates of God which makes the act "evil".

Wrong is correct.

that part ,as you know, has been explained at least 49 times in the last two months. It is like hearing a two year old who keeps asking, WHY. all the people i know throw their broken records out after awhile, but not this one. Imagine that going on 24/7 inside your house or in your head.
This is why we have to make jail cells and padded walls.

Good night and again I enjoyed your opener.
 

c0de

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Wrong is correct.

that part ,as you know, has been explained at least 49 times in the last two months. It is like hearing a two year old who keeps asking, WHY. all the people i know throw their broken records out after awhile, but not this one. Imagine that going on 24/7 inside your house or in your head.
This is why we have to make jail cells and padded walls.

Good night and again I enjoyed your opener.


I know eh... I couldn't believe when I woke up and saw
the same thread all over again on the front page...

good night man (and thanks 4 contributing your thoughts :) )
 

Nick_A

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If this concept "always existed" then by definition
it is external and independent of us.

Actually, what you just said, makes morality irrational.
Therefore, you can not define your morality through
your own reason but actually require dictates.

Your entire argument is self-defeating.


See above.


Wrong! It is not the body which is evil,
it is the manner in which it is used against
the dictates of God which makes the act "evil".

If this concept "always existed" then by definition
it is external and independent of us.

Yes wisdom always was. However inner morality as an expression of the being of Man is naturally limited to Man's potential

Actually, what you just said, makes morality irrational.
Therefore, you can not define your morality through
your own reason but actually require dictates.

Inner morality is beyond dualistic rationality. It is experiential.

For example unconditional love is not something fallen man is capable of. As we are we are limited to animal love which is selective. We love this but not that which for life on earth this animal love is necessarily selective.

However, The love of life itself is a higher form of inner morality we cannot experience but is a "being" potential.

Inner morality when awakened in a person allows them to be human. As we are with selective morality, we are the "wretched man" that is always changing and capable of the hypocrisy normal for the world.

Wrong! It is not the body which is evil,
it is the manner in which it is used against
the dictates of God which makes the act "evil".

So objective evil doesn't exist but only something that we do. The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil doesn't exist without Man.
 
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I read Atlas Shrugged and The Fountainhead when I was in my early twenties. They had a profound effect on me even though I never embraced Objectivism.

Children's sexuality is an almost impossible subject to talk about. I don't think I want to try.

Chris
 

juantoo3

....whys guy.... ʎʇıɹoɥʇnɐ uoıʇsǝnb
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So since God creates the body of a fourteen year old girl that is pornographic by having a picture fall into the hands of a forty year old guy, it means God is a pornographer since he created this potential.

You know Nick, I've been trying to understand where you are coming from, and to a degree I think I do...but here you just stepped over the edge.

The logic you are using is convoluted at best. Even if one wishes to disregard the passage in Isaiah that says G-d created evil *too,* it still remains that what you and others call evil exists in the world. G-d created the world, and part of the world is evil, so G-d created evil, so evil must be good. *NOT!* It totally misses the point that evil is the trial and separation, to be avoided at cost.

Taking a different tack, evil is something people do to each other. Evil in this sense exists, evidenced by all the jails and prisons and halfway houses and programs designed to try to rehabilitate offenders. Putting that on G-d is a cop-out and a lame excuse...one that can easily be misinterpreted to condone evil and violence...like your "nature" analogy, suggesting somehow that people should return to the mental state of "red of tooth and claw." I look around me and I think humanity has come a very long way from there...why on G-d's earth would someone want to return?

Now, if one wished to shed their clothing other than a couple animal skin loin clothes, grab a flint and steel and a bowie knife and light a shuck into the woods and *NOT COME BACK,* then there may be something to what you are saying. In a civilized society, you are wrong.

I'm not usually this blunt, but this subject bristles more than a few feathers. In the interest of keeping the peace, I am locking this thread.
 
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