real Islam

NiceCupOfTea

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All scriptures are written in a divine language and punishment isnt what people think it is. Say your being mean to someone and you hurt their feelings. GOD would have you look at them and feel compassion for them and sorrow for treating them badly which would cause you to apolojize and be kind. Thats how god punishes. He doesnt harm anyone he imparts the things of himself into you to destroy things not of him. For meanness he imparts kindness, for hate love, for lack of compassion , compassion . GOD isnt some misguided bad father who spanks his children and imparts harm on them for doing wrong. GOD is GOOD.


have you read the quran.

yes or no ?
 

kenshin

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thanks nice
so what is real islam ?

I have encountered salafi and hanafi sunni islam a rather unpleasant conversion experience. there seemed to be a lot of rules and regulations and punishments from allah if you dont obey them ?

is that real islam ?
there are different theological schools among muslims. I don't know exactly (for I know general rules of them) how others believe but this is our school's belief :
the after life is the reality of this world. The Hell or Heaven is nothing but the reality of our life. all our acts have a real effect on us that we can't see right now. in the other world we just see what we have done! we see exactly what we have done and nothing more.

"Shall you be requited except with what you used to do?" 27 : 90
"To Allah will be the return of you all, whereat He will inform you what you used to do." 5 : 105
"And the call would be made to them:" This is paradise, which you have been given to inherit because of what you used to do!" 43:7
....

the other world is the real vision of what we are. we are not what we look like to be. even now, if one gets to a level the one can see the real character of us.
"No indeed! Were you to know with certain knowledge, you would surely see hell. Again, you will surely see it with the eye of certainty." 102 : 5,6,7

many say that the material life itself is the hell. those who can't transcend to the heavens ( spiritual ) are the dwellers of the hell.
"Indeed, those who deny Our signs and are disdainful of them the gates of the heaven will not be opened for them, nor shall they enter paradise" 7 : 40
 

NiceCupOfTea

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"Indeed, those who deny Our signs and are disdainful of them the gates of the heaven will not be opened for them, nor shall they enter paradise" 7 : 40

when it says "Our signs" who is this referring to ?
 

Lunitik

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islam means 'surrender'

real islam is to surrender to god, to give your "I" up and reside in Him alone

say: God surficeth

surrender means to understand nothing else is worthwhile
 

NiceCupOfTea

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islam means 'surrender'

real islam is to surrender to god, to give your "I" up and reside in Him alone

say: God surficeth

surrender means to understand nothing else is worthwhile

are you a muslim ?

and if so which school of thought do you follow ?
 

Lunitik

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What does Muslim mean?

It means one who has surrendered.

"Never die except as a muslim" means to die to the "I", to realize your immortality in Him which is beyond the "I".

This is usually said as "be humble", that is not the point. Humility is the opposite of arrogance, but it calls to realize the unity of God. Duality cannot be unity, unify it and oneness is realized.

You have wasted your life if you have not found this truth, and it is truly the universal religion - it is the supreme merging.
 

Lunitik

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However, as I have described it, yes, I am a Muslim... Sufi Order International is my primary exposure, and the line has the initiation of at least the four major Indian orders.
 

Lunitik

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Muhammad has encountered islam, the book is just words.

I do not mean to offend any Quranists, but its reading and acceptance does not make you a Muslim as a by-product. Only tassawuf is islam, jihad is the struggle to let go of your conceptions, fallacies, and the victory is in tawhid.

You must not become identified with Muhammad, he is just a man. Do not rest until Tawhid is your reality, all else is a waste of life. You are nothing as you are, all you have is given by Allah, will you give back what has not been earned in the first place? Where is the difficulty? Now your every breath is your prayer, until it is realized your every breath is a lie.
 

NiceCupOfTea

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I have experienced islam, what good is its study?

Study is about, how can it compare with the actual encounter?

i'd like to hear about real islam from muslims, they are the only ones qualified to talk about it.

people are easily deceived and encounters can be deceptive, this is taught in islam.
 

Lunitik

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The encounter is only true if it is lasting, if it is unshakable, if tassawuf - purification, divine love - absorbs you. Where there is no more a trace of what you were, then it is absolute, now what has happened to al-Hillaj is fine with you. You are free of death, they are only hurrying the return home.

You will be thankful to them, your only desire is Allah and they are making it so...

As they kill you, you will simply say salam alaikom - thank you for your graciousness.

Life has become your agony, the only division remaining, it will not matter their anger for it is for you an act of love. This is paradise, the absorbing into Allah, the ceasing of separation from the only one who matters at all.
 

Lunitik

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I just wish all could see that Elohim, Yehweh, Eli, Dharmakaya, Allah, Brahman, Omkaya, all these names are irrelevant. Allah is all names, everything is of Him.

What other way can etihad be true? Only language and ego separates, it is foolish.

Offer yourself to whatsoever you call the absolute, every differentiation is your imagination.
 

donnann

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I just wish all could see that Elohim, Yehweh, Eli, Dharmakaya, Allah, Brahman, Omkaya, all these names are irrelevant. Allah is all names, everything is of Him.

What other way can etihad be true? Only language and ego separates, it is foolish.

Offer yourself to whatsoever you call the absolute, every differentiation is your imagination.

Allah in english simply means GOD.
 

NiceCupOfTea

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I just wish all could see that Elohim, Yehweh, Eli, Dharmakaya, Allah, Brahman, Omkaya, all these names are irrelevant. Allah is all names, everything is of Him.

What other way can etihad be true? Only language and ego separates, it is foolish.

Offer yourself to whatsoever you call the absolute, every differentiation is your imagination.

maybe you need to expand your mind and realize that not all spiritualities are the same and that not everything conforms to your limited instruction set.

imo all religions have their truth and power and they are all different.
 

Lunitik

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maybe you need to expand your mind and realize that not all spiritualities are the same and that not everything conforms to your limited instruction set.

imo all religions have their truth and power and they are all different.

It is the infinite mind which has shown me they are not different at all.

It is the closed mind which does not permit they be the same, the only difference is how truth is expressed, and yet always they are speaking of truth as I do. The messenger is always unique to himself, yet the message is always the same, what is conveyed never differs.

Mind itself is the only differentiator, see without mind and you can see the beauty of it, otherwise you will analyze and destroy the beauty.
 

Lunitik

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Allah in english simply means GOD.

Not strictly correct, Ilah means God in Arabic, Allah means 'the god'... thus conveying the absolute oneness of it. It is also important that this is neither male nor female, again pointing at the transcendence of opposites, and the finding of oneness. Tawhid also points towards this oneness in no uncertain terms, and because of this Muslims are very adamant about monotheism - moreso than anyone else I think.

It is because the attainment is the realization of oneness, all else is imagined. The multiplicity of the world has arisen from that oneness and even science says this with its theory of the Big Bang - all energy arising from a single particles expanse.

Debate with any Muslim though and they will say it is God's name, humans go on insisting the nameless be named and this naming has caused much strife. I include all names I can recall on the spot, for all are false, to name the absolute limits God, to give God a personality or even a gender makes God less than the absolute. Yet, all names are Gods, all forms are Gods, for God is the only true being. God is all there is, he is the set, the wardrobe, the director and cameraman, the actor and actress... all is Gods play. Yet, God is the totality, if you point at any one thing and say it is God you will be false, yet to say it is not is just as much false.

This is the miracle of this place, such diversity, and yet all is the same.
 

Lunitik

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I have heard the comparison made of looking at your body under a microscope. The cells will look distinct, separate if you zoom in far enough. You will not see how they can be working together in a single body, they look autonomous this close up. Yet, such is the case, we are all part of one body.

1 Corinthians 12:12-27 says this as well, but they have not seen atoms yet, else I think they'd agree moreso with the example of the atoms. It infers here that we are each an organ of God, but this gives the beings too much credit. In fact a country can be likened to an organ, or even a planet or even a solar system, but here it says a person. We are not so important as that, for in our lifetime every cell in our bodies are replaced every 7 years, this is more the importance of the human - just a part for a while.

Yet the body lives on, will you identify with the atom and its duty, or with the body itself?
 
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