Discussion in 'Belief and Spirituality' started by ResistETIntervention, Mar 14, 2012.
What is the essence of all religions?
I would say Belief
There are two schools of philosophy in the Vedas of India, as the the "Goal of Liberation":
Two Schools of thought on the "Goal of Liberation" aka "Salvation" aka "Immortality" aka "Emancipation":
I) Nirvana - merge into the primevial source, thus, desolving all self & ego being.
II) Prema Bhakti - Loving devotional interpersonal audience with God.
NOTE: Aside from these two, the defacto path remaining that is taken by all 'living entities' is:
to perform ones' own alloted dharma (vocational duties) with the explicit purpose of gaining frutive results (karma) for gratification ---of all sorts, on all sorts of stratum of existence(s) throughout time and history ---in the name of self-advancement and self-preservation and self-angrandisement. This is repeated birth after birth. The repetition of seeking pleasure never ceases albeit with the accompanying 'ups & down' cycles of seasonal bounties and famines.
I would say that an attempt to convey the experience of oneness is the essence of all religions...
IS this your Oneness?
In theology, the doctrine of divine simplicity says that God is without parts. The general idea of divine simplicity can be stated in this way: the being of God is identical to the "attributes" of God. In other words, such characteristics as omnipresence, goodness, truth, eternity, etc. are identical to God's being, not qualities that make up that being, nor abstract entities inhering in God as in a substance. Varieties of the doctrine may be found in Jewish, Christian, and Muslim philosophical theologians, especially during the heyday of scholasticism, though the doctrine's origins may be traced back to ancient Greek thought.
Yep. Judaic, Christian or Islam scholasticism (or neo-scholasticism) aways seem to circle back to Aristotle.
What is the essence of all religions?
A] Transcendental Goals: Nirvana Enlightenment; or, Kingdom of God
b] Material Goals: economic coherence and success.
c] Terrestrial & Celestial Goals: achieve a higher status among the re-born soul cycle of samsara.
I would say simply .....love.
A secluded planet in space with a Billion humans living on it, each human living for short span of time.
Also, a census count of all the other living immates of the planet earth other than humans would show that there are trillons to the trillionenth power of numbers of living entities on planet earth ---are these lining beings excercisng Love left & right and every which way? Or is it a big fish eats little fish world?
Where is the boundries & even the outline or even the hint at "Loving Exchanges" in remote barren place on earth that take up 99% of the land and water space on earth?:
Love is the center of what we all are and the navel of the world. When we realize this wars will stop and we will progress.
Mariah Carey & Whitney Houston When You Believe - YouTube
Theology is never related to oneness, it is the minds foolish attempt to understand something beyond itself. The real problem with religion today is that too many idiotic views seem perfectly logical, this has all stemmed from theology.
Oneness is an experience, it is what all scriptures point to, yet it cannot be found in any scripture because every scripture utilizes words, thus involve the mind.
Yet, what is the nature of God in each of these?
1: What you say stems from your own understanding, which is no more true nor less fallible than mine or anyone else's.
2: You don't cite sources, in fact you refute them if they do not coincide with your own understanding.
3: Yet, if one thinks about it, a reasonable person will know that one's own experience is fallible, prone to error and assumption.
So the conclusion of your own argument is there is no reason why anyone should pay attention to your argument, which rests on nothing but your claim to infallibility.
It's the Philosophy of MENTAL SPECULATION & SELF-ANGRANDISEMENT writ large ... a series of diatribes from a real life "Life of Brian" background extra . . . causing everyone to cringe.
Touche, bhaktajan! You caught the error. The cite was not about theology but about the concept of divine simplicity--two very, very different things.
For instance, a perfect at-one-ment with the Divine is an example of the latter.
False, because what I say is merely a translation of my understanding into language others might comprehend. I can see the fallibility of my words quite plainly, and herein lies the difference. You believe your words to be meaningful, I see them as impotent and yet must speak in order to share in such a way as can be understood. Moreover, you view the words of your scriptures as even more meaningful, yet you do not understand that it is the mind which has decided this too.
What purpose will any source serve? I am interested in bringing you to the state, that alone is my source, and that alone is the only confirmation.
Experience cannot be fallible, only the interpretation can be fallible... I do not interpret, yet you are interpreting my words as you please. There is a basic disconnect between what I say and what your ego hears, you cannot see that I say the same as Krishna or Buddha or Jesus - you can probably not even see that these are all discussing the same thing among themselves. As soon as something is said, it ceases to be based in truth, for it has been funneled through the mind. This is the trouble all who have known have come across, yet you are content to read them as if their words infallible. Not only this, but you are willing to question a living experience because it disagrees in your eyes with a dead scripture.
Certainly, you should investigate my words for yourself. Likewise, you should not take the words of any scripture as infallible because they too subject to the same limitations as my words. That is my whole emphasis, that you should experience for yourself FREE FROM INTERPRETATION.
It is not a mental speculation at all, yet it is mental speculation which you engage with in your scriptures. How can reading a text about something you have not experienced result in anything but speculation? You will see it with your own interpretations, your meanings cannot be the same as those who have experienced it because you do not know what is being discussed. You dispute me, yet you accept what is written of Krishna, you should see why this is because we are discussing the same thing.
All concepts are false, they are founded on logic and there is nothing logical about truth. It is extremely simple, for it is just what is actual when no interpretation is brought in. Yet, from this simplicity, the author has brought in attributes and false notions. Truth brought into the mind becomes false, you must view all words as merely a pointing to something beyond words. Too many believe their own concepts about the words, they do not even see how unlikely it is their idea of what was said is even related to the intent behind the words. It is puzzling to me why so many seem to favor the flawed understanding of their mind over the actuality of the experience which is available. It is humorous to me even that briefly paraphrasing the Christian Bible to a Christian, you will be called insane, yet they will go to Church quite happily that weekend and worship the same experience. I want all to experience it, it is simply foolish to worship your own potential. I merely call on all to actualize that potential instead, yet every ego will dispute. It is ok that someone in the past has risen above them, but to be faced with someone in person is not acceptable. I merely say the seed and the tree are not so different, the entire potential of the tallest tree lies in the depth of the seed. I want all to become beautiful trees, yet it means the walls of the seed - the ego - must be broken. It is only then that the roots can begin to nourish themselves on the soil, and eventually sprout out of the dirt. People are scared of this, they are comfortable remaining as a seed because they know the reality of the seed, the life as a tree is unknown. Certainly, it will look insane to the seed because it doesn't understand, only the tree brings beauty to the world though, the seed is no more than a stone. I cannot fathom why anyone who can look at the seed and the tree will not wish to grow themselves, it can only be fear which keeps them limited.
Well the Baha'i view as I understand it is that God is the Source of all the major religions... Revelation proceeds through the Manifestations of God..
"Religion is the outer expression of the divine reality. Therefore it must be living, vitalized, moving and progressive. If it be without motion and non-progressive it is without the divine life; it is dead. The divine institutes are continuously active and evolutionary; therefore the revelation of them must be progressive and continuous."
~ Abdu'l-Baha, Baha'i World Faith, p. 224
"There is one God; mankind is one; the foundations of religion are one. Let us worship Him, and give praise for all His great Prophets and Messengers who have manifested His brightness and glory."
~ Abdu'l-Baha, Abdu'l-Baha in London, p. 19
Well, fear and a feeling of unworthiness.
I do not think it is coincidence that religions teach the latter, for how could they control a community of Christs? They have not even managed to control one! It is certainly easier to control a herd of sheep, yet what is the eventuality of Christs interactions with the sheep?
He washes their feet, he calls them brothers, he is no longer their shepard. So many miss this, but it says to take on the mind of Christ, to accept the Holy Spirit and do the will of God instead of your own. Now, how will you differ from this man worshiped by so many? The only difference will be bodily, appearance. Inwardly, God has reigned supreme, their realities are now the same.
You have been given life, thus you are worthy of this, it is your birthright.
Stop holding yourself down!
You are the very guard keeping yourself imprisoned, you do not see the doors are open, that the chains are merely laying there, not holding on to you at all. Someone comes along and says "the prison doesn't even exist, you have always been freedom itself", you will look puzzled.
Yet it is the case, if you have eyes to see.
Many, however, live as the man who has been imprisoned for decades, he trembles at the prospect of his freedom. He has longed for it so much when he first became incarcerated but now it has become comfortable for him. He will not know what to do with his freedom, for the world is so different now, in many cases these men will perform deeds in the prison system just to ensure they never get out...
The prison is the mind, it is the source of all limitation you experience.
Desire and hope ensure you never get out, for they are projections into a future where you remain incarcerated, yet you do not see it.
I would say that the essence of all religions, in common and colloquial terms, is that:
we are all children of the Most High God.
This is phrased, as you can see, in quasi-theistic terms, but it can also be understood quite literally, and still accurately. Many conclusions should naturally follow, but these are not always apparent, so I hope to touch on some of the most obvious ...
What follows should be an ethics (and morality) and a shared recognition of Dharma (Purpose, a deep sense of Responsibility) common to ALL people & peoples, while allowing room for EACH person to develop his/her own life's Path ... with the mutual & common understanding that it is one, united Destiny toward which we are Journeying, ONE shared future we are building in which ALL OF US can, do and will participate.
Anything less, and we have sold ourselves short of our Divine Heritage. Anything less noble, and we have sold our souls to the shortcomings and inadequacies of modern religion ... trading our true potential for rites & ritual, lip service and the staved-off pangs of Conscience ... thus missing the mark by a mile.
Anyone who tries to sell us on less, is immediately identifiable as a wolf among sheep, and/or simply misguided when it comes to the true function and purpose of religions (as their FOUNDERS have always known and regarded them). Beware those who would seek to carve their own spiritual or religious identity out of your forehead, or off of your land, or even by demanding tithes, lip service and other RECOGNITION from within your own person. Only God can do any of these, and when another person or group claims to speak for & from God, to you - or vice versa - you can bet your ass, and any other livestock you own ... he sure ain't doin' it for the reasons he claims.
Separate names with a comma.