Response to Sandy Hook

Discussion in 'Politics and Society' started by radarmark, Dec 23, 2012.

  1. radarmark

    radarmark Quaker-in-the-Making

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    I know this is an international forum and this is distinctly an issue only within the USA. But it is worth discussing. Shucks, as big a smart ass as I am, I might learn something.

    I have used both automatic and semi-automatic weapons. I have a large bolt-action Laputa chambered Weatherby, a 22 Enflied, a Thompson contender with multi barrels, and a Provo Grizzley as well as shotguns. I used to do a lot of iron sight silhouette shooting, both long and short gun version. I quit the NRA (after Bush 41) due to the "jackbooted government thugs"of Wayne LaPierre in 1994 (?). The Gun Owners of America's [sic] Larry Platt has an even more extreme reactionary, anti-government, neo-anarchist position and I could never stoop that low.

    What do I need a 30 or 100 round clip for? Shooting "jackbooted government thugs". What do I need a semi-automatic rifle for? To target Pratt's "communist dictator" whom I call my President.

    Sorry, I believe in the Bill of Rights but believe it applied to militias and individuals in the Eighteenth Century. It was not created to create a right to arm with military equipment with which to oppose the government. You have the right to firearms. I think semi-automatic pistols and single-shot rifles meet the bill (if you need more shots than 5 or 10 using a bolt or pump or bolt, go to your range and refine your skills).

    Neither the Constitution nor the Bill of Rights are suicide pacts. Nor are they an excuse to treat the mentally ill as threats, nor are they a blanket with which to condone massacres with firearms.
     
  2. A Cup Of Tea

    A Cup Of Tea Well-Known Member

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    School shooting - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Not always black or white, the US is an extreme here but it can probably happen everywhere. As long as there are guns around a child will sooner or later get their hands on one and use it on the people their hate. Zero tolerance is probably as effective in this case as with drug control, robbery or car crashes.

    Coming from outside the US I do have a hard time understanding your gun politics at all, but I think it's a cultural thing.

    EDIT: I sense a stronger reaction to this shooting then the earlier shootings, is that so and if so, how come?
     
  3. radarmark

    radarmark Quaker-in-the-Making

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    ACOT. Because of the victims... young white children in a classroom. Those (like I) who am pretty tolerant of gun ownership empathize more with 20 of these killed at once then with the thousands of young Hispanics and Blacks we have watched slaughtered by gun violence. my turning point came many years ago. I went to a little known elementary school back in the 50s that became the scene of violence against the very same Southeast Asian kids I helped bring back to the USA (see Laos Memorial).

    I do not know if zero tolerance could possibly work. Like my personal drug solution, decriminalize (in the case of drug use) or take automatic long guns and overkill clips off the market and make it a crime to sell or provide (even by theft or family members) and then really turn up the heat (use a gun or drug in the performance of a crime, go immediately to jail and do not pass go). Anyway, that is all I can come up with.

    I heard another pretty good idea -- a billion dollar buy back, no questions asked, tied to say pre-paid cash cards that are good for only 3 or 6 months or so.
     
  4. A Cup Of Tea

    A Cup Of Tea Well-Known Member

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    What's that, turn in your gun for money? The same principle as peace keeping forces follow with 'Food for guns'?

    I can understand why it would work in poor countries where people do what they do because of desperation. It's sounds a bit like a wild card implementing it in the US, but sometimes you got to play those as well.
     
  5. radarmark

    radarmark Quaker-in-the-Making

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    Yep, turn in your guns for money. It would get (probably, based on similar programs) a lot of weapons out of the urban and poorer suburban areas.

    I think anything is worth a try. Shucks, arming teachers isn't bad. Given the tendencies of AFT and NEA (the two primary unions)... we would at least have an armed progressive group (the NRA and GOA are both reactionary).

    For God's sake that is a joke (I wish I could send it to Jon Stewart... good rebuttal to LaPierre),
     
  6. IowaGuy

    IowaGuy Hunter-Gatherer

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    Have you guys seen "Bowling for Columbine"?
     
  7. radarmark

    radarmark Quaker-in-the-Making

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    One of my favs. Michael Moore has a demented sense of humor (but so did Lenny Bruce).

    The whole gun issue (JMHO) grew out of the JBS takeover of many conservative movements. In this case, the increasing reactionary leadership led the gun culture to move off a "for hunting and sport" basis to what is now (obviously, IMHO) "for overthrowing the government" basis.

    The cultural roots were well discussed by Moore, I think. Now the next film should be "Locking up the Mentals and Arming the Teachers".
     
  8. A Cup Of Tea

    A Cup Of Tea Well-Known Member

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    Indeed, they should have the assault rifles, all we need to do is keep ahead in the following arms race and it'll be some kind of victory!

    Not mine, I feel he's picking his facts to make us understand what he thinks, instead of painting a picture with all the colors and a rainbow of facts.
     
  9. radarmark

    radarmark Quaker-in-the-Making

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    Yep, cannot accept it as truth (but then neither is Argo or Zero Dark Thirty).
     
  10. A Cup Of Tea

    A Cup Of Tea Well-Known Member

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    I agree that his documentaries can be a good starting point for discussion!
     
  11. radarmark

    radarmark Quaker-in-the-Making

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    That is all anything really is. Charles Hartshorne (an obscure American theologian-philosopher) considers all knowledge to be dialogue. Whether the starting point is us being in the building during a tragedy or an overblown mockumentary, to come to know the subject depends on interactions.
     
  12. bananabrain

    bananabrain awkward squadnik

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    to anyone outside the US, your gun laws make very little sense. i can understand why they are the way they are and why you've reached such an impasse, but i find it hard to disagree with obama's "is this really the best we can do?" speech.

    michael moore, however, is a tendentious, self-aggrandising weasel and doesn't understand anything outside american domestic affairs.

    b'shalom

    bananabrain
     

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