What is religion?

Discussion in 'Belief and Spirituality' started by juice, Jan 22, 2017.

  1. juice

    juice Curious Seeker

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2014
    Messages:
    24
    Likes Received:
    5
    A disclaimer: Do not feel that I am attacking religion by my questions and opinions.
    These are experiences I have faced and my views about it.
    If you are Christian do not read this thread because it will offend you the most.



    I thought religion is more about salvation than prosperity,and how you dress?
    I thought we had free will to worship whoever we deem as God?
    I thought God was central to worship than these other people, doctrines, and dogma?
    What has happened to the "CHURCH" not these mega-churches,etc...?
    I thought churches were the cornerstone institution of the community now it's a joke or less respected.
    I understand that Jesus was among the poor and desolate of the community, now he just a character of a best-selling book.


    What ever happen to the church being the leaders and lead the masses instead of preying on the woman,homeless,and worst off in the community?
    What about the hypocrisies,and double standards?
    Everyone who question it or does not go along with it is condemned to a place that has no existence or evident to ever existed.

    Have you so-called christian died went to heaven and hell and came back to tell us that it exist or has anyone ever died and truly came back years later just to tell you that God is real Jesus,etc...and you go here after they put you under the earth?
     
  2. A Cup Of Tea

    A Cup Of Tea Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2011
    Messages:
    3,310
    Likes Received:
    566
    As non-religious I don't think questions about religion is offensive, framing them in a neutral way goes a long way though.
    I wonder about the purpose of sharing your, very negative, opinions of other faiths on an interfaith forum. Especially grouped together like a big accusation?
     
    EdgyDolmen likes this.
  3. BigJoeNobody

    BigJoeNobody Professional Argument Attractor

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2014
    Messages:
    1,179
    Likes Received:
    122
    Wow, I gotta say, Even not as a Christian, I think you could have went about these things without so much challenge. Your Agenda seems to be to prove Christianity wrong or to chastise the Christians' beliefs and practice, not seeking information.

    I will agree that many of these questions (in not so hostile format) was part of the reason I started looking outside the Christian faiths.

    I'll answer your Questions IMO and as close to exact phrasing as you stated...

    Religion is about all things, to limit it to "salvation" is merely looking at a small aspect or reward and concluding that that is it. Religions can be as focused as merely covering how you view your deity/deities to every aspect of your life including dress, politics, health, eating habits, etc. I Adhere to Islam. In Islam salvation is the reward, yes (in a way, as the ultimate reward is Paradise), but how you achieve that reward and how those actions are supported by other actions is also a focus.

    not according to most religions. Abrahamics all state very clearly which deity is to be worshiped, and no others. Hinduism (some forms) may be open to more of the "choose your god" choices, but I am far from an expert in Hinduism.

    seems to contradict your previous question in the first half, then the next bit gets confusing. Are you asking why "Christians" worship people, Doctrines, and Dogma more than the God? If so I don't feel that is true in the exact sense. Yes society seems to be focussed more on people than God nowadays, but that is more of a failing of the people than religion.

    They are everywhere... where do you live. I have 12 to choose from in a 3 mile radius.

    Used to be, but early in the Religious history of Christianity it seems a certain "Business Aspect" has been involved as well. The donations are largely to the preacher or overseeing authority.

    Not sure where you got this idea. Quite the opposite is very obvious for most people. Christians still cling to the idea that he is God incarnate, asking him for all favors (yes I disagree, but it is a solid and unquestionable fact that most Christians see Jesus (PBUH) as much more than a character. This sentiment seems to only come from militant anti-Christians)

    Leadership fell when Churches became private owned, tax free entities here in the US. however Preying on the groups you mentioned? really? are you that far from reality? No church I've ever been to has "preyed" on women or homeless or worst offs.

    more specifics would be easier to answer.

    This question is more proof of your questions being pointed at a challenge rather than information. The "everyone who questions it" argument will only really work out in a atheists forum. Humans will always question. It's what we do with the answers that gives us our destinations.

    as for second part, How would you be able to know if hell is/was/or will be a actual place? Are you the Creator? if not I assume you cannot see all of his creations. Hell/Heaven/etc is generally believed to be somewhere outside of what we could physically get to. A different Dimension perhaps, or a entirely unconnected place that God has created that isn't in what we could classify as existence. your question hinges on the idea that all things must be physically in the same existence as us to be possible. To my knowledge, most religions don't believe in a Earthy Heaven or hell.

    seems a pointless question from a religious perspective. Why must we all experience it before we can say it is real or unreal. even if one person did, you wouldn't believe him, and call him a liar. (proof - Mouhammed (PBUH) was said to have been to both, but that probably won't change your mind about it.) so now you rest your lack of faith on a weak argument that basically is saying "I haven't seen it so it can't exist". in that case I'm sure you can't believe in electricity, ions, electrons, air, etc.

    All in all, Interfaith is about learning about other religions, not knocking some you have a weird beef with down.

    Also Because of your choice of arguments I have to say this is one of the worst anti Christian conversion attempts I have ever seen. The questions are so basic that even I as a non-Christian can answer in a way I'm sure most Christians can agree with. I would not be surprised if these questions weren't copied from some Atheist website or forum that berates religious peoples intelligence daily, and yet they have yet to convince anyone with any conviction to question their beliefs.
     
    RJM and Namaste Jesus like this.
  4. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    7,902
    Likes Received:
    1,832
    Also, Juice, have you read much of the New Testament? Perhaps reading, or re-reading the Gospel of John, or Luke, would help clarify some of those questions? And if you went to a church service you might be able to get a closer look at what's really goinh on in there? :)
     
  5. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2005
    Messages:
    22,540
    Likes Received:
    2,400
    Nope religion is not about worshipping whatever god you choose or following whatever dogma...

    It is worshipping our god, and using our dogma, and using our song and dance and paying our piper.

    This why you don't hear folks saying... Yeah, my religion is for me, you should talk really he a blank... Nope we tell you to read OUR books. Tell you what you should think and believe. If you don't get it, you just aren't logical, or don't have enough faith, or aren't trying hard enough....you can't see it to believe it, you have to believe it, to see it.

    But hell, try belief.net and find out what you resonate with now... I say now because you claim to be a seeker.

    Answers like these are found by study and personal introspection...

    I like Brussels sprout and peanut butter omelettes... You will like them.
     
    EdgyDolmen and RJM like this.
  6. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    7,902
    Likes Received:
    1,832
    Actually anything I say about God or religion is really just pointing towards the source of peace, and even wisdom, that I have mercifully been granted. I have absolutely no interest in making converts or trying to convince a single soul.

    But if someone directly asks, I'm saying before you talk about Christ, perhaps you could read his words? Like, if you're going to talk about Plato, have you read it first?
     
  7. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    7,902
    Likes Received:
    1,832
    I think I can quite contentedly complete my total existence without one, and not feel I've missed out, lol
     
  8. Devils' Advocate

    Devils' Advocate Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2014
    Messages:
    2,086
    Likes Received:
    381
    I think everyone missed the part of the OPs post where he said

    "Do not feel that I am attacking religion by my questions and opinions. These are experiences I have faced and my views about it."

    I can sympathize. Many of the questions he is asking he is asking because those are the typical experiences he has had. When I joined this site these were my complaints as these were my experiences as well. Many of them are experiences I continue to have regularly. Religion in America (and I'm gonna bet Juice is American) has mostly lost its way.

    If these are the kinds of experiences he has had, seems his questions are completely reasonable ones.
     
  9. A Cup Of Tea

    A Cup Of Tea Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2011
    Messages:
    3,310
    Likes Received:
    566
    I don't feel I missed that at all, I feel I acknowledged that and countered it. Having an honest feeling doesn't mean it should be expressed carelessly.
     
  10. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    7,902
    Likes Received:
    1,832
    Of course I didn't mean anyone was accusing me of it :)
     
  11. Thomas

    Thomas Administrator Admin

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2003
    Messages:
    12,137
    Likes Received:
    2,487
    OK.

    Yes

    In the context of any given religion, no. Religion does not mean we're free to determine God is anything we fancy.

    Well it depends whom you mean by 'people'. As you've addressed the Christian community, I have no idea who you're talking about.

    'Doctrines' means 'that which is taught' and 'dogma' means 'that which one thinks is true' — so the doctrines and dogmas are the means of preserving and transmitting the truth.

    Still there ... doubt you see it.

    In the eyes of many, true.


    In your opinion.

    Still does, to those who listen ...

    Inevitable, humans being what they are. What about yours?

    In your opinion. Then again, everyone who believes is ridiculed by the secular and the armchair critic, so there is ignorance in both camps — it cuts both ways.


    LOL. You mean you want a guarantee? God doesn't work like that.

    Can I stick in my disclaimer now?
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2017
    Namaste Jesus likes this.
  12. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2005
    Messages:
    22,540
    Likes Received:
    2,400
    Asking for consent.... Good on ya old man!
     
  13. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2015
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    11
    Things inevitably change. So does religion. It seems to fall into a cyclic pattern when it comes to conflicts over tradition and personal belief and insight, as well as one's expectations by which it's originally defined.
     
  14. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2015
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    11
    That's a good approach.
     
  15. roywilljenks

    roywilljenks New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2017
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    Exactly what I was thinking!
     
  16. jacquisoder1

    jacquisoder1 Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2017
    Messages:
    20
    Likes Received:
    1
    Indeed. Nice explanation.
     
  17. Yessy

    Yessy Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2017
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    Juice, a curious seeker you present yourself to be.

    Nothing wrong with your questions or your seeking for answers if they come from the heart of a true seeker.
    Those with the life, light and the love of God in them are not threatened / offended by such questions or concerns from a true seeker.

    The spiritual forces operating is still the same as in the early church. We still have the Pharisees. We still have the life bringers that are filled with the life and love of Christ that terribly offends with Truth those that are of the spirit of the anti-christ. And we still have the Gnostics, those that Paul had a great problem with, that you will find many of on this forum.

    If you desire Truth keep on seeking and you will find, but beware where you go look for it....

    PS: and yes there are still people today that died and came back from the other side. My very husband was an alcoholic, died physically, went to the gates of hell, and was given another opportunity by Jesus to make right and live for Him. Miraculously he got healed when he came back, not only from alcoholism, but also from the physical devastating effects that extensive alcohol use brought to his body. Today He is a shining light, bringing many to personally encounter the love of Jesus, breaking the chains of the devil over people's lives. And since I am living with him I can testify, he is the real deal, and the fruit of the Spirit is abundant in his life.

    Seek and keep on seeking, with a sincere heart, and you will find.
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2017
  18. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2005
    Messages:
    22,540
    Likes Received:
    2,400
    Always interested in Jesus raising the dead.

    How surprised was the coroner, or doctor, or hospital? Is there a writeup from the local paper?
     
  19. wil

    wil UNeyeR1 Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2005
    Messages:
    22,540
    Likes Received:
    2,400
    Exactly...and many folks say the same about religion...

    Me proselytizing.... Come on, you don't know what you are missing...try it...it could change your life ...
     
    RJM likes this.
  20. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2016
    Messages:
    7,902
    Likes Received:
    1,832
    Oh, it doesn't mean I wouldn't eat a peanut butter and Brussels sprouts sandwich -- as long as no mayonnaise, because I loathe mayonnaise. But i don't feel I've lived less because I haven't ever eaten one?
     

Share This Page