In some Buddhist schools, there is a debate about sudden vs gradual enlightenment, for example. Is the Baha'i rebirth in the spirit understood as a sudden transition, a switching on of the light, or a gradual dawning?
So your response is a perfect example of why I said (I am probably going to come across as a shit), because a word such as Satan carries so many connotations, let alone the denotation. As does the word sin. And it is not as though what I posted about Satan isn’t in the Bible because it is. And how many times are people called children of the devil or darkness or the evil one in the Bible. My understanding of Satan is this. It is the personification of a consciousness. We are consciousness. It is a consciousness of darkness or ignorance. It is a consciousness that every person experiences. The Bible says we are born dead, born in sin, fallen - it’s talking about consciousness. Anyone, scripturally speaking, who believes that they are separate from God, that their nature is unclean or animalistic, that they are a separate being from their brothers and sisters, that life is a struggle, that identifies themselves according to their race, political or religious stances, education, economic class, citizenship, gender etc and lives and makes decisions about oneself and the possibility for one’s life according to these outer things (not to mention what family friends, teachers, government say) is to a varying degree ruled by Satan. these outer appearances however, are the outer man. According to scripture we are One Being and inseparable from God. According to scripture our nature is divine. According to scripture we are born of God. According to scripture we are Christ- we are Jesus Christ. According to scripture everything is already ours for life and godliness. According to scripture, our problem, for those who have found Christ- or whatever name you know and live God by - is that we have forgotten that all these divine perfect traits and the righteousness that is of God, is already ours. We aren’t born of man. We are born of God and our home is the household of God. So Satan is that Consciousness of the father of lies - any and all lies or beliefs that keeps one in darkness. So I said that everyone is of God. No, not the false perception of self. It has nothing to do with God. As we’re told, the carnal mind is enmity to God. I wasn’t insulting anyone. I was sharing what I understand and not just because it’s in scripture but because I have lived it.
I see that is what being born again means. Receiving the Holy Spirit in Faith and it will be exactly the same when we accept the return of Christ. The Key here is, it is only through Christ we get that Holy Spirit. The difference we have is that Christian now sees Jesus Christ as God and as such they will see it is a direct revelation from God. Personally to me, that would be blasphemy, it goes beyond the knowledge of my own self. Please do not take that the wrong way, I am not saying that for another they have to see it that way. Baha'u'llah has said we can only know God through the Messenger. Christ is like a mirror, without Christ we can not know God, with Christ we can see and receive the reflection of God, all the while knowing the reflections are the attributes of God and not the Essence of God. In the end we have to ask, If God can come directly to us all, then why do we need Christ? Regards Tony
Interesting. My spiritual path started when as an atheist (at least I thought I was an atheist) in a fraction of a second, I went from not knowing or believing in God, to knowing everything in the universe was God, was light. Literally I went from darkness to light. The awareness left as quickly as it came, but it forever changed me. And the long journey began.
I am not offended in the slightest. I don’t believe Jesus Christ is a man who walked the earth- I believe that his story is allegory. I believe he is the personification of YHVH (That Which Was, That Which Is, That Which Shall Be). I believe he is the One and only Being in the world who comes forth as all humanity- as well as all that Is.
It is like being born into this world from the Matrix of the womb. You go from one reality to another and then one has to learn and develop further, it is gradual. Very few people have the ability od sudden transformation, though it is recorded in history, that their ar many spiritual giants, they mostly become the martyrs of the new faith. We never stop learning and this life is to gain our spiritual limbs to enable us to progress in all the worlds of God. If we choose not to grow those limbs, then we have chosen to be remote from God, and remoteness is what is called hell. A Metephor for that is the compassion between a rock and a person with reason in this world. A rock is bound to its own condition unable to think or know more than it is. A human can think and change the laws of nature. Imagine we can choose now to become spiritual beings and not be bound to our own condition in the next world. This hell is remoteness from God, Heaven is closeness to God. This is a great topic, as it shows us there is more life to come. Regards Tony
This is wonderful. Do you see how big a difference it makes when you own your beliefs, saying "... what I understand ...", as opposed to making absolute statements like the one about Satan or God being in this or that person's heart. Welcome to these forums, where we take responsibility for what we say about our beliefs, thereby expressing respect for those who believe differently. It makes this place the special place it is. Good to have you here!
Baha'u'llah has explained that the Messenger is the 'Self of God' in this material world. They are all we can know of God and yes in reality, this life is the illusion. A gift for our spiritual progress. In the end there is only one place our prayers and where we go back to and that is God. God gives us all we can be. All the best. Regards Tony
I agree. I define hell as the farthest outer reaches of conscious separation from God (varying degrees) and heaven as conscious union with God (again varying degrees). We can never be separate from God. His presence is everywhere and everything, His Center is everywhere.
Can't squeeze toothpaste back into the tube, can't un-cook an egg. A good, spiritual friend of mine, a medical doctor, compared this type of event to catching a disease, the only cure being more of the same. He was being tongue-in-cheek about the disease part, of course (he's a spiritual master if I ever saw one), but I think there is truth to it: the only way out is through.
Within all that knowledge is born our greatest test of self. The Mesengers give us a glimpse of what that test is. Like in Luke 18:19 "And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God." Regards Tony Regards Tony
That would be a great pity. We need you here. Don't let one person drive you away. It's just his own opinion.
That’s so funny- I was going to respond with: I am going to just ignore you for awhile (evidently I didn’t erase the entire sentence). It’s okay, all good. I realize that I am somewhat zealous. And discussing religious stuff can be tricky. Kind of you.
This is where I respond with "RJM: Why don't Cino, Priceless Pearl, and myself just put you on ignore instead?"
It could be that the Bible and many religions have defined what evil is, all what we can k ow comes from God's Word. Just as 1 Corinthians 15:42 offers, "So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:" Death is remaining ignorant of and not implementing our spiritual capacities. Regards Tony
Would you tell that to a dying person? "You are only dying because you're not trying hard enough to implement your spiritual capacities"?
