The Laws of Moses......... perfect for their time.

Discussion in 'History and Mythology' started by badger, May 10, 2022.

  1. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    @muhammad_isa ...... here are some of the poor laws. I think that it is these that Jesus was pushing for a full return of, all those hundreds of years later on. Your usury bans are in there, so, all good. This list is produced with Jesus in mind, of course, so slightly off thread. :)

    THE POOR LAWS OF THE OLD TESTAMENT
    Exodus {23:3} Neither shalt thou countenance a poor man in his cause
    Apart from the sacrificial and ceremonial laws of the OT, clearly redacted by Jesus (Matthew 9:13) he was insistent that all other laws should be upheld (Matthew 5:17). All the OT laws were written because they all helped to build a strong, successful, invincible, healthy people, and whereas previous nations had fallen because they didn't bother (Lev 20:22-24) the Israelites were clearly shown the way to success. (Exodus 18:20). These laws all produced a people that would survive and flourish.
    The only reason that the Baptist and Jesus held against the Temple ceremonies and sacrificial laws is because they had descended in to total corruption, greed and hypocrisy and so sadly were of no value any more.
    16:11
    16:14
    24:17Exodus {22:25} If thou lend money to [any of] my people [that is] poor by thee, thou shalt not be to him as an usurer, neither shalt thou lay upon him usury.
    Leviticus {15:11} For the poor shall never cease out of the land: therefore I command thee, saying, Thou shalt open thine hand wide unto thy brother, to thy poor, and to thy needy, in thy land.
    Leviticus {19:9} And when ye reap the harvest of your land, thou shalt not wholly reap the corners of thy field, neither shalt thou gather the gleanings of thy harvest.
    Leviticus {19:10} And thou shalt not glean thy vineyard, neither shalt thou gather [every] grape of thy vineyard; thou shalt leave them for the poor and stranger: I [am] the LORD your God.
    Deuteronomy {15:1} At the end of [every] seven years thou shalt make a release. {15:2} And this [is] the manner of the release: Every creditor that lendeth [ought] unto his neighbour shall release [it;] he shall not exact [it] of his neighbour, or of his brother; because it is called the LORD’S release.
    Deut {15:7} If there be among you a poor man of one of thy brethren within any of thy gates in thy land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not harden thine heart, nor shut thine hand from thy poor brother: {15:8} But thou shalt open thine hand wide unto him, and shalt surely lend him sufficient for his need, [in that] which he wanteth.
    Deuteronomy {24:6} No man shall take the nether or the upper millstone to pledge: for he taketh [a man’s] life to pledge.
    Widows, Orphans and Strangers !
    While they kept to the laws layed down for them by their God, the Israelites were bound to grow in size, strength, power, security and success. As long as they kept to them..... all.
    Success and survival was not only dependent upon favouring the strongest, but by favouring all. These Laws were not suggestions, nor intended to be charities. They were Commands.
    Where I live we still have provision for widows, orphans and strangers, but maybe not enough.
    I only 'printed' a couple of examples from Deuteronomy, but have offered links from all the verses from that one book only, thus saving from replication.
    Deuteronomy:-
    10:18
    14:29
    24:19
    24:20
    24:21
    26:12
    26:13
    27:19
    Deut:{10:18} He doth execute the judgment of the fatherless and widow, and loveth the stranger, in giving him food and raiment. {10:19} Love ye therefore the stranger: for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt.
    Deut {24:17} Thou shalt not pervert the judgment of the stranger, [nor] of the fatherless; nor take a widow’s raiment to pledge: {24:18} But thou shalt remember that thou wast a bondman in Egypt, and the LORD thy God redeemed thee thence: therefore I command thee to do this thing.
    Deut {24:19} When thou cuttest down thine harvest in thy field, and hast forgot a sheaf in the field, thou shalt not go again to fetch it: it shall be for the stranger, for the fatherless, and for the widow: that the LORD thy God may bless thee in all the work of thine hands.
     
  2. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Very interesting observation! :)
    You mention that my avatar has some warmth, but my more usual avatar previously used before I came here is very hot by comparison with my present one....let me see.....
    This is the old Monastery (St Augustine's I think) built from the stones of REculver Roman Fort.
    Copy of dddd.jpg
     
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  3. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Abominations!

    Whenever I hear that word I think back to my childhood, of our neighbour who was a trawler skipper and a Baptist minister (my Dad called him a 'Chapel priest' whatever that is). He was a real 'hell and damnation' speaker who refused to take up arms in the war but who was a gallant lifeboat skipper. He could roll the word 'abomination' out as if it was the very devil on the move. I was scared of him. Oh well, kids could be scared of anything.... :)

    Over the years I discussed this word with many people and their translations of it differ hugely, but I think it means dangerous, mostly in connection with sickness, illness, and you may have heard the words 'Sin leads to sickness' before. That's just about what I think.

    Here are some abominations, the only one that doesn't quite fit my ideas is how gold or silver could be a sickness, illness risk, maybe of the mind?:-

    Firstly, some acedemia:- abomination or toevah (Hebrew)
    Sometimes, the term "toevah" can be used in the Bible to refer simply to sinful behaviour in general, but in the case of the text in question, scholars agree that ritual uncleanness is implied. Thus, according to the same book of the Bible, eating pork is also said to be "toevah" (unclean).

    Exodus {8:24} And the LORD did so;and there came a grievous swarm [of flies] into the house ofPharaoh, ...............................................{8:26} And Moses said, It is not meet so to do; for we shall sacrifice the abomination of the Egyptians to the LORD our God

    Leviticus {7:18} And if [any] of the flesh of the sacrifice of his peace offerings be eaten at all on the third day................it shall be an abomination,
    Leviticus {11:10} And all that have not fins and scales in the seas, ...........................they [shall be] an abomination unto you:

    Lev {11:13} And these [are they which ye] shall have in abomination among the fowls; they shall not be eaten, they [are] an abomination: the eagle, and the ossifrage, and etc etc

    Lev {11:20} All fowls that creep, going upon [all] four, [shall be] an abomination unto you.

    .Leviticus {11:23} But all [other] flying creeping things, which have four feet, [shall be] an abomination unto you. {11:24} And for these ye shall be
    unclean

    Leviticus{11:41} And every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth [shall be] an abomination; .Leviticus {18:22} Thou shalt not lie with
    mankind, as with womankind: it [is] abomination

    Deuteronomy {7:25} The graven images of their gods ......... the silver or gold [that is] on them, ..............................it [is] an abomination to the LORD thy God

    Deuteronomy{17:1} Thou shalt not sacrifice unto the LORD thy God [any] bullock, or sheep, wherein is blemish, [or] any evilfavouredness: for that [is] an abomination unto the LORD thy God.

    Deuteronomy{22:5} The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman’s garment: for all that do so [are] abomination unto the LORD thy God.

    .Deuteronomy {23:18} Thou shalt not bring the hire of a whore, or the price of a dog, into the house of the LORD thy God for any vow: for even both
    these [are] abomination ...............

    ;Deuteronomy {24:4} Her former husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after that she is defiled; for that [is] abomination

    .Deuteronomy {25:14} Thou shalt not have in thine house divers measures, a great and a small....................... an abomination unto the LORD thy God.

    Deuteronomy{27:15} Cursed [be] the man that maketh [any] graven or molten image, an abomination unto the LORD,
     
  4. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    What is there for today?
    Good neighbours...... If all neighbourhoods were like this the world would be a more pleasant place, I think.

    A straight list from Leviticus, directly from the pen of brilliant mind.....

    {19:14} Thou shalt not curse the deaf, nor put a stumblingblock before the blind, but shalt fear thy God: I [am] the LORD.
    Everybody must not only be cared for, but given consideration. No place for bad minds.

    {19:15} Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honour the person of the mighty: [but] in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour.
    Ha ha...... so that's where the poem came from, eh? 'To walk with kings nor yet lose the common touch..... '
    Fair treatment of all, regardless of status.

    {19:16} Thou shalt not go up and down [as] a talebearer among thy people: neither shalt thou stand against the blood of thy neighbour: I [am] the LORD.
    This is interpreted as 'Don't stand by while others are in danger, nor spread slander about anyone.

    {19:17} Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him.
    Bad blood should be confronted by all, and nobody should provoke any other to do wrong.

    {19:18} Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I [am] the LORD.
    Wow! Where have I read that before? !! 'Love thy neighbour as thyself'..... Nothing new there, Jesus was repeating the Law which is what I think he stood for a return of....absolutely.
     
  5. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Moving on.............

    Where I live we have legislation concerning animal care and treatment.
    Yep...... and so did the children of Israel!

    Snuggled between laws about a Court-punishment and widow-care there is a single verse, standing all alone............

    Deuteronomy {25:4} Thou shalt not muzzle the ox when he treadeth out [the corn.

    And how beautiful is that! This a law of Moses, which requires that beasts must be allowed to nourish and enjoy themselves as they trudge their work.
    All through my life I have have heard OT Laws repeated, often with serious countenance, and never ever have I ever heard that one called out loud.

    It's the sort of law that I might carved in to the lintel of an RSPCA office. :)
    There are other animal-care laws there, but this is the one that I chose to show.

     
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  6. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Next.......!
    Deuteronomy {23:15} Thou shalt not deliver unto his master the servant which is escaped from his master unto thee: {23:16} He shall dwell with thee, [even] among you, in that place which he shall choose in one of thy gates, where it liketh him best: thou shalt not oppress him.

    How about that?
    Provision for Asylum Protection........ right there!
     
  7. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Leviticus {5:14} And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, {5:15} If a soul commit a trespass, and sin through ignorance, in the holy things of the LORD; then he shall bring for his trespass unto the LORD a ram without blemish out of the flocks, with thy estimation by shekels of silver, after the shekel of the sanctuary, for a trespass offering: {5:16} And he shall make amends for the harm that he hath done in the holy thing, and shall add the fifth part thereto, and give it unto the priest: and the priest shall make an atonement for him with the ram of the trespass offering, and it shall be forgiven him.

    Where I live, to break a law or bye-law through ignorance of the law is no defence. This paragraph doesn't legislate concerning torts imo, because it's referring to 'the holy things of the Lord', what we would call crimes, maybe misdemeanours. In any case it was best not to bust laws through ignorance of them because it's going to cost a perfect ram and as far as I can figure, also a fifth of the ram's value to be paid over in Temple shekels to the local priest.

    That's got to be a whole lot worse than a speeding ticket, fine and points, I reckon. :)
     
  8. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Leviticus {13:1} And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron, saying, {13:2} When a man shall have in the skin of his flesh a rising, a scab, or a bright spot, and it be in the skin of his flesh [like] the plague of leprosy; then he shall be brought unto Aaron the priest, or unto one of his sons the priests: {13:3} And the priest shall look on the plague in the skin of the flesh: and [when] the hair in the plague is turned white, and the plague in sight [be] deeper than the skin of his flesh, it [is] a plague of leprosy: and the priest shall look on him, and pronounce him unclean. {13:4} If the bright spot [be] white in the skin of his flesh, and in sight [be] not deeper than the skin, and the hair thereof be not turned white; then the priest shall shut up [him that hath] the plague seven days: {13:5} And the priest shall look on him the seventh day................................... this is just one paragraph out of scores which deal with medical isolations and quarantines .

    Ah.......... Well, after the Isolations, Lockdowns and Quarantines of the last two years the Laws of Moses written all those millennia back make perfect sense, and the priests had so many responsibilities.

    All the laws of Moses were written to produce a healthy, safe, secure, successful and cohesive people.....all together.
     
  9. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Like spinning a turntable, (rapid scrolling) this is what I landed on for this morning:-

    Leviticus {11:6} And the hare, because he cheweth the cud, but divideth not the hoof; he [is] unclean unto you.

    Now what could be wrong about eating a hare, eh? Well, either the God of the Israelites, the scribes or both were very very wise, is all I can say. My Dad was always a shooting person, took a whole gun at a few shoots, was a rough shooter, a wildfowler and a part-time gamekeeper. As an amateur he knew about shooting in the English countryside and foreshore. So he knew a bit about it all, and he knew a bit about hares.

    I've searched around with IT and found nought, but I can tell you that my Dad took extra special care when breaking down a hare to 'jug in wine' which is how he cooked them. If he was cautious then so would I be. He told me to 'Never ever nick yourself when cutting up a hare!' Why? It's a long time ago now but he used to warn of deadly diseases amongst which he named lock-jaw and blood sickness.

    I notice that hares are reducing from some haemorrhagic disease in England at this time, probably always suffered from it at less noticeable levels. But old hands like my Dad knew about the dangers of sickness around hares.

    Those ancient Laws........... how interesting, the wisdom of the ancients.
     
  10. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Trading Standards and Weight-and-Measures would approve of this one:-

    {19:35} Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment, in meteyard, in weight, or in measure. {19:36} Just balances, just weights, a just ephah, and a just hin, shall ye have: I [am] the LORD your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt.
     
  11. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Slander, tittle-tattle, back-biting and the rest of these wriggling snakes....sorted:-

    Leviticus {19:16} Thou shalt not go up and down [as] a talebearer among thy people: neither shalt thou stand against the blood of thy neighbour: I [am] the LORD.
     
  12. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Leviticus
    {15:19} And if a woman have an issue, [and] her issue in her flesh be blood, she shall be put apart seven days: ........................

    There are so many verses in several places which require the separation of women during their menstruations.
    When a community of women live close together their menstruations align, and thus they had several days in each month together, separated away from all others, and this must have been a good time of close companionship for them. I expect that many women looked forward to these times when they could be with their closest friends.
     
  13. RJM

    RJM God Feeds the Ravens Admin

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    Say nothing of the guys, lol?
     
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  14. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Ha ha! The guys had to behave, with certain reservations. :)
     
  15. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Leviticus {24:22} Ye shall have one manner of law, as well for the stranger, as for one of your own country: for I [am] the LORD your God.

    No different today, in the UK at least. The law applies to everyone in the country.
     
  16. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Leviticus {23:22} And when ye reap the harvest of your land, thou shalt not make clean riddance of the corners of thy field when thou reapest, neither shalt thou gather any gleaning of thy harvest: thou shalt leave them unto the poor, and to the stranger: I [am] the LORD your God.

    Already mentioned here but not printed...........
    Until recently our local supermarkets would deliberately trash and spoil any foods which were unsold beyond their sell-by dates; they did everything they could in order to dissuade folks from turning through their waste skips or visiting their yards at night-time. I can understand that principle, but today there is a new principle and most foodmarkets are boxing late-to-sell products up and sending them to free-food charities, church halls and homeless accommodations.

    And so Leviticus 23:22 still has value up to this very day and age, and will do for ever, I expect.
     
  17. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Leviticus {19:32} Thou shalt rise up before the hoary head, and honour the face of the old man, and fear thy God: I [am] the LORD.

    Yes! You young-uns! Hoary old so-and-so's (like me :D ) couldn't come to much harm if young uns would just rise up to offer us their bus seats an' stuff like that.......occasionally. The fact that hoary old -----s like me would only grumble about being perfectly fit 'thank you' is beside the point.

    What a nice law! :D
     
  18. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Leviticus ]{25:23} The land shall not be sold for ever: for the land [is] mine; for ye [are] strangers and sojourners with me. {25:24} And in all the land of your possession ye shall grant a redemption for the land. {25:25} If thy brother be waxen poor, and hath sold away [some] of his possession, and if any of his kin come to redeem it, then shall he redeem that which his brother sold. {25:26} And if the man have none to redeem it, and himself be able to redeem it; {25:27} Then let him count the years of the sale thereof, and restore the overplus unto the man to whom he sold it; that he may return unto his possession. {25:28} But if he be not able to restore [it] to him, then that which is sold shall remain in the hand of him that hath bought it until the year of jubile:...............................

    I need help with this one......... it looks as if all land could only be sold or transferred by leasehold and not permanently........ does anybody know more about this?
     
  19. badger

    badger Well-Known Member

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    Leviticus {26:14} But if ye will not hearken unto me, and will not do all these commandments; {26:15} And if ye shall despise my statutes, or if your soul abhor my judgments, so that ye will not do all my commandments, [but] that ye break my covenant: {26:16} I also will do this unto you; I will even appoint over you terror, consumption, and the burning ague, that shall consume the eyes, and cause sorrow of heart: and ye shall sow your seed in vain, for your enemies shall eat it. {26:17} And I will set my face against you...........................

    Keep the laws and prosper, or ignore them and fail.........dreadfully.
    They were told.......
     
  20. Cino

    Cino Big Love! (Atheist mystic) Admin

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    Obligatory Anatole France quote: "The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal their bread." ;)
     
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