An interesting take on Luciferianism.

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medividedbyyou

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This link is an interesting take on Luciferianism.

The author omits the definite and indefinite articles and doesn't use the verb to be without giving too much away until the narrative changes.
 
medividedbyyou said:
This link is an interesting take on Luciferianism.

The author omits the definite and indefinite articles and doesn't use the verb to be without giving too much away until the narrative changes.
Click to expand...
What on earth does that have anything to do with Luciferianism or Lucifer? Neither word is even mentioned
 
medividedbyyou said:
I just thought the bit about God & the Devil was an Albert Pike-esque hint (if you can read between the lines).
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"God and the Devil are not opposing forces; they are two sides of My One Nature." <-- This?
Lucifer has nothing to do with the Abrahamic god or their devil
 
'Amir Alzzalam said:
"God and the Devil are not opposing forces; they are two sides of My One Nature." <-- This?
Lucifer has nothing to do with the Abrahamic god or their devil
Click to expand...
I think it's more about perception than categorizations like that. Just that you had to invoke the Abrahamic name shows how ingrained it is that Lucifer has come to be seen as in opposition to it.
 
medividedbyyou said:
I think it's more about perception than categorizations like that. Just that you had to invoke the Abrahamic name shows how ingrained it is that Lucifer has come to be seen as in opposition to it.
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And my perception is that Duality is an illusion of objective reality, that polar opposites such as God and the Devil are Abrahamic fabrications. that Albert Pike and the Freemasons had and have nothing to do with Luciferianism.
 
'Amir Alzzalam said:
And my perception is that Duality is an illusion of objective reality, that polar opposites such as God and the Devil are Abrahamic fabrications. that Albert Pike and the Freemasons had and have nothing to do with Luciferianism.
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Interesting. Could you please explain further about how Duality is an illusion of objective reality? idk that much in this area.
 
I am intrigued to know if the LHP rejects the RHP forms:
1) Why does it badge itself with a dualistic name (ie Left immediately invokes Right)
2) Why does it use titles drawn from and firmly embedded in the Abrahamic Tradition?

I am only wondering why its terms of reference are those of that it seeks to disassociate itself from?

Is it an historical thing?
 
Thomas said:
I am intrigued to know if the LHP rejects the RHP forms:
1) Why does it badge itself with a dualistic name (ie Left immediately invokes Right)
2) Why does it use titles drawn from and firmly embedded in the Abrahamic Tradition?

I am only wondering why its terms of reference are those of that it seeks to disassociate itself from?

Is it an historical thing?
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1) At first glance it does appear that we use a Right/Left stance . . . however, aside from the words being dual, the philosophies are not. I didn't name things Right & Left, and I always use the term 'Western' Left Hand Path to disassociate it from the Eastern LHP (Vamachara).

2) True WLHP's do not use Abrahamic terminology for the most part. I don't know why Satanists use the symbol of Satan, or moreso why Luciferians use Lucifer (not Abrahamic by the way). I've often argued with them about this.
 
'Amir Alzzalam said:
1) At first glance it does appear that we use a Right/Left stance . . . however, aside from the words being dual, the philosophies are not. I didn't name things Right & Left, and I always use the term 'Western' Left Hand Path to disassociate it from the Eastern LHP (Vamachara).
Click to expand...
Ah ... didn't know that, thanks.

'Amir Alzzalam said:
2) True WLHP's do not use Abrahamic terminology for the most part. I don't know why Satanists use the symbol of Satan, or moreso why Luciferians use Lucifer (not Abrahamic by the way). I've often argued with them about this.
Click to expand...
Well, this was enlightening (if that's a pun, forgive me). I, like I'm sure many you might meet, are sadly ill-informed with regards to the actuality of the WLHP and jump to old, well-worn and erroneous conclusions, so thanks for a pointer in the right direction.

Almost the first thing I found was this – and I'd be interested to know whether you think I'm facing the right way, or got it all wrong.

––– from wiki 'Left Hand Path and Right Hand Path –––

History of the terms
Tantra and Madame Blavatsky
The Western use of the terms left-hand path and right-hand path originated with Madame Blavatsky, a 19th-century occultist who founded the Theosophical Society... She developed the term left-hand path as a translation of the term vamachara, an Indian Tantric practice that emphasised the breaking of Hindu societal taboos ... The term vamachara literally meant "the left-hand way" in Sanskrit, and it was from this that Blavatsky first coined the term.
Then I'd say HPB appropriated the term. Being a follower of the René Guénon, I have no great faith in her understanding of either Hinduism or Buddhism, nor of her grasp of Sanskrit.

Returning to Europe, Blavatsky began using the term. It was relatively easy for her to associate left with evil in many European countries, where it already has had an association with evil and bad luck since the Classical Latin era.
But this is not authentic vamachara, is it? The Tantric LHP is not evil per se, as I see it.

I came across a practice in Buddhism where the Buddhist would sit in contemplation of a decomposing human body. It all sounds rather ghoulish, but the point was a profound contemplation on the fact that life, beauty, etc., were transient and ephemeral. (This in the context of Civil-War Era Japan). My point is this ghastly Buddhist practice is not evil; it could be framed as an equivalent vamachara practice?

HPB's conflation of the Tantric term with Western pre-conceptions is an abuse to Tantrism, and just one example of why the Traditionalists (followers of the Sophia Perennis, were so critical of her Theosophical movement.

In New York, Madame Blavatsky founded the Theosophical Society ... She set about writing ... in which she introduced the terms left-hand path and right-hand path, firmly stating that she herself followed the RHP, and that followers of the LHP were practitioners of black magic who were a threat to society.
HPB's conflation of the Tantric term with Western pre-conceptions is an abuse to Tantrism, and just one example of why the Traditionalists (followers of the Sophia Perennis, were so critical of her Theosophical movement.

The occult community soon picked up on her newly introduced duality, which, according to historian Dave Evans, "had not been known before" in the Western Esoteric Tradition. For instance, Dion Fortune, founder of the magical group the Society of the Inner Light, also took the side of the RHP, making the claim that followers of the LHP were homosexuals and that Indian servants might use malicious magical rites devoted to the goddess Kali against their European masters.

Aleister Crowley ... referring to a "brother of the left-hand path", or a "black brother", as one who failed to attain the grade of Magister Templi in Crowley's system of ceremonial magic.

Crowley also referred to the left-hand path ...
From this wiki snapshot, again I'd say AC has a powerful imagination, but it's mostly half-grasped nonsense ... but not really informed enough to pass judgement.

Arthur Edward Waite, who did not recognise these terms, and acknowledged that they were newly introduced and that in any case he believed the terms LHP and RHP to be distinct from black and white magic. However, despite Waite's attempts to distinguish the two, the equation of the LHP with black magic was propagated more widely in the fiction of Dennis Wheatley; Wheatley also conflated the two with Satanism and also the political ideology of communism, which he viewed as a threat to traditional British society.
Ah, yes ... and I did read DW as a teenager ...
 
... So the WLHP is not as I had assumed it to be, and as your practice is neither the 'common' (Blavatsky) understanding nor the Tantric – can you point me towards a history of the Path?

I do think by using the term, whoever coined it made a rod for their own backs, as it were – in building a dualist term into the name of a non-dualist movement?

Are there other names by which the Path is known?

+++

Jiriki (自力, 'self power'), as opposed to tariki (他力 'other power'), comes to mind, the two terms in Japanese Buddhist schools – commonly practiced as Zen (self power) and Pure Land (other power)?
 
Thomas said:
Ah ... didn't know that, thanks.


Well, this was enlightening (if that's a pun, forgive me). I, like I'm sure many you might meet, are sadly ill-informed with regards to the actuality of the WLHP and jump to old, well-worn and erroneous conclusions, so thanks for a pointer in the right direction.

Almost the first thing I found was this – and I'd be interested to know whether you think I'm facing the right way, or got it all wrong.

––– from wiki 'Left Hand Path and Right Hand Path –––

History of the terms
Tantra and Madame Blavatsky
The Western use of the terms left-hand path and right-hand path originated with Madame Blavatsky, a 19th-century occultist who founded the Theosophical Society... She developed the term left-hand path as a translation of the term vamachara, an Indian Tantric practice that emphasised the breaking of Hindu societal taboos ... The term vamachara literally meant "the left-hand way" in Sanskrit, and it was from this that Blavatsky first coined the term.
Then I'd say HPB appropriated the term. Being a follower of the René Guénon, I have no great faith in her understanding of either Hinduism or Buddhism, nor of her grasp of Sanskrit.

Returning to Europe, Blavatsky began using the term. It was relatively easy for her to associate left with evil in many European countries, where it already has had an association with evil and bad luck since the Classical Latin era.
But this is not authentic vamachara, is it? The Tantric LHP is not evil per se, as I see it.

I came across a practice in Buddhism where the Buddhist would sit in contemplation of a decomposing human body. It all sounds rather ghoulish, but the point was a profound contemplation on the fact that life, beauty, etc., were transient and ephemeral. (This in the context of Civil-War Era Japan). My point is this ghastly Buddhist practice is not evil; it could be framed as an equivalent vamachara practice?

HPB's conflation of the Tantric term with Western pre-conceptions is an abuse to Tantrism, and just one example of why the Traditionalists (followers of the Sophia Perennis, were so critical of her Theosophical movement.

In New York, Madame Blavatsky founded the Theosophical Society ... She set about writing ... in which she introduced the terms left-hand path and right-hand path, firmly stating that she herself followed the RHP, and that followers of the LHP were practitioners of black magic who were a threat to society.
HPB's conflation of the Tantric term with Western pre-conceptions is an abuse to Tantrism, and just one example of why the Traditionalists (followers of the Sophia Perennis, were so critical of her Theosophical movement.

The occult community soon picked up on her newly introduced duality, which, according to historian Dave Evans, "had not been known before" in the Western Esoteric Tradition. For instance, Dion Fortune, founder of the magical group the Society of the Inner Light, also took the side of the RHP, making the claim that followers of the LHP were homosexuals and that Indian servants might use malicious magical rites devoted to the goddess Kali against their European masters.

Aleister Crowley ... referring to a "brother of the left-hand path", or a "black brother", as one who failed to attain the grade of Magister Templi in Crowley's system of ceremonial magic.

Crowley also referred to the left-hand path ...
From this wiki snapshot, again I'd say AC has a powerful imagination, but it's mostly half-grasped nonsense ... but not really informed enough to pass judgement.

Arthur Edward Waite, who did not recognise these terms, and acknowledged that they were newly introduced and that in any case he believed the terms LHP and RHP to be distinct from black and white magic. However, despite Waite's attempts to distinguish the two, the equation of the LHP with black magic was propagated more widely in the fiction of Dennis Wheatley; Wheatley also conflated the two with Satanism and also the political ideology of communism, which he viewed as a threat to traditional British society.
Ah, yes ... and I did read DW as a teenager ...
Click to expand...
Madman Blavastky completely misunderstood the Eastern Left Hand Path (Vamachara) . . . as she did Lucifer. Even though Vamachara means 'left-handed way' it is ultimately a Right Hand Path as it leads to a spiritual merger with Brahma/The All etc.

Uncle Al's Thelema is also essentially a Right Hand Path as it involves the same merger but with the Abrahamic god. He denounced black magic (at least what he understood it as) and also what he referred to as the Black Brothers. Those who failed to attain the rank of Magister Templi, and one who did not destroy his ego while crossing the Abyss. In his system, called Thelema, when the adept crosses the abyss, he must surrender everything, including his self and his Holy Guardian Angel, and leap into the Abyss, and if his ego or self is completely destroyed, he becomes a “babe of the abyss”. If he does not destroy his ego, then he is referred to as a “Brother of the Left Hand Path”.

*Just a side note: I wrote some of that Wiki article, as I also write many of the occult-related entries for Wiki. I have been with Wiki for years, though it is very difficult to get your stuff approved by the powers-that-be, they edit a lot of my material.
 
'Amir Alzzalam said:
*Just a side note: I wrote some of that Wiki article, as I also write many of the occult-related entries for Wiki. I have been with Wiki for years, though it is very difficult to get your stuff approved by the powers-that-be, they edit a lot of my material.
Click to expand...
Under what 'nick' .. Skyerise?
 
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