Alchemy: The Lost Science

Discussion in 'Pagan' started by Rouge47, Jul 19, 2005.

  1. Rouge47

    Rouge47 Follower of Christ

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    This Thread is an introduction to the unkown, magical science called alchemy.
    Please enjoy reading and will I enjoy your replies.

    Many of us have heard of the Philosophers Stone and its many secrets and mysteries, not to mention its connection with alchemy. From what I have gathered together I believe that alchemy is a type of magical science. It is said that alchemy came along with the creation of the earth...though Im not one of those believers I find it very interesting. I was wondering if anyone would like to share with me some of the history of alchemy, the Philosophers Stone, and alchemists (the users of alchemy). If we could just examine the seemingly microscopic ways of how the alchemists used the scientific method of magic we would better understand it more.

    I look forward to your intellectual replies and theories.
    God Bless
    Paul James
     
  2. earl

    earl ?

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    Depending upon direction it takes, might chime in. Jung and his followers have tended to be quite interested in alchemy as a metaphor of psychospiritual transformation and, certainly, from that perspective I would be interested. Take care, Earl
     
  3. Chela

    Chela Psychological Janitor

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    For male and female have from of old been regarded as one body, not from any external or visible consideration, but on account of the ardor of that mutual love which naturally draws them together into one; and as the male and female seed jointly represent the principle of propagation, so also the sperm of the matter out of which our Stone is made can be sown and increased. There are in our substance two supplementary kinds of seed, from which our Stone may be prepared and multiplied.

    If you are a true lover of our Art, you will carefully weigh and ponder these words, lest, with other sophisticators, you fall into the dangerous pit prepared by the common enemy of man. But whence are you to obtain this seed? This question you may most easily answer by asking yourself another question. What do you want to develop from this seed, and what use do you wish to make of it? There can be no doubt, then that it must be the root, or first substance, of metals, from which all metals derive their origin. It is, therefore, necessary that we should now proceed to speak of the generation of the metals.

    – Basil Valentine

    Alchemy is Al-Chemy. Al is Allah, or El, the God of Light. Therefore, Alchemy is the Chemistry of God. True Alchemy does not have to do with what the scholar at your local academic institution may tell you it is. Intellectuals who have no practical alchemical experience state that Alchemy is the chemical proto-science that existed before the development of the scientific method. The esoteric philosophy rejects that definition because Alchemy is not concerned with turning physical lead into gold. The esoteric philosopher has been caught saying, “Chemistry is the bastard child of Alchemy” because in many ways chemistry was born from those who did not understand what Alchemy actually was. Chemistry and Alchemy serve different purposes.

    Alchemy is a divine science, chemistry is a natural science. Chemistry studies matter while alchemy works to transform it. Chemistry cannot make new life – even an in vitro fertilization needs an egg and sperm from parents. Alchemy, however, works with the egg and sperm directly in the Interior Lab (physical body). Therefore only alchemy can create life and it can transform creation itself; it is an exact science to transmute the psychological lead into the finest quality gold. The wise man throughout history has known Alchemy is a spiritual allegory for a revolutionary psychology that first burns the ego into ashes and later raises the Phoenix, the Christified Soul. There are many historical alchemists, but not all of them were true alchemists. Some of them knew the key, and some of them did not know the key. The key of alchemy is sex and the work of the Inner Lab takes place within the sexual act itself.

    To read the works of Paracelsus, Nicolas Flamel, Basil Valentine, and many others requires the Alchemical Key to extract any true knowledge out of them. These venerable men wrote in deep symbolic terms. Thus, its meaning has always been hidden.
    To each creature God gave its own seed, wherewith to propagate its kind, that in this way there might always be an increase of men and animals, plants and metals. Man was not to be able to produce new seed: he was only permitted to educe new forms of life out of that which already existed. The creating of seed God reserved to Himself For if man could create seed he would be equal to the Creator.

    Know that our seed is produced in the following way. A celestial influence descends from above, by the decree and ordinance of God, and mingles with the astral proper ties. When this union has taken place, the two bring forth a third namely, an earth-like substance, which is the principle of our seed, of its first source, so that it can shew an ancestry, and from which three the elements, such as water, air, and earth, take their origin. These elements work underground in the form of fire, and there produce what Hermes, and all who have preceded me, call the three first principles, viz., the internal soul, the impalpable spirit, and visible bodies, beyond which we can find no earlier beginning of our Magistery.

    In the course of time these three unite, and are changed through the action of fire into a palpable substance, viz., quicksilver, sulphur, and salt. If these three substances be mixed, they are hardened and coagulated into a perfect body, which represents the seed chosen and appointed by the Creator. This is a most important and certain truth. If the metallic soul, the metallic spirit, and the metallic form of body be present, there will also be metallic quicksilver, metallic sulphur, and metallic salt, which together make up the perfect metallic body.

    If you cannot perceive what you ought to understand herein, you should not devote yourself to the study of philosophy.

    – Basil Valentine
    We see here that we are speaking about the seed; sex.

    The three principle Alchemical elements are Mercury (Quicksilver), Sulfur, and Salt. These three elements constitute the Water, the Fire, and the Earth. The Water is the Ens Seminis (the sexual energy), the Fire is the Fohat, the Spirit (INRI: Fire Renews Nature Incessaintly). These elements must be worked in cooperation with each other in order to perform the Great Work. We must remember that Mercury (Hermes) is the messenger of Christ; thus astrologically he is the closest one to the Sun. The Mercury (sexual energy) must be transformed into the Sulfur (the spirit) through the medium of the Earth (salt; the physical body). The Sulfur must fecundate the Mercury to regenerate the Earth. We heat the mercury in order to purify it. The erotic coals of sexual alchemy burn away the psychological impurities of the aspirant.

    The Alchemist knows that the Mercury, the Sulfur and the Salt are always interacting, it is therefore necessary to work these elements. If the Alchemist does not properly work the Mercury, it becomes Dry Mercury. The Dry Mercury is the ego. The Dry Mercury creates Arsenic Sulfur, or passionate fire, egoic-fire: desire, lust, etc. Let us remember that the sexual energy (fire) is always in movement, either regeneratively or degeneratively, thus, the Mercury will fecundate the Sulfur positively (Metallic Spirit) or negatively (Arsenic Sulfur).

    The strength of all powers is sex.
    Separate that spirituous earth (the Essence or Buddhata) from the dense or crude (ego) by means of a gentle heat (of sexual alchemy), with much attention.

    In great measure it ascends from the earth up to heaven, and descends again, newborn, on the earth, and the superior and the inferior are increased in power.

    By this wilt thou partake of the honours of the whole world. And (psychological) Darkness will fly from thee.

    This is the strength of all powers. With this thou wilt be able to overcome all things and transmute all what is fine and what is coarse

    – Hermes Trismegistus

    Hermes is the founder of Alchemy in this civilization.

    The Bible is an Alchemical discourse. The Bible begins with the Water (Genesis; Hydro-gen and Oxy-gen). Water is the source of all creations, which is why in order create, Jehovah Elohim moved over the Genesiac waters. It is stated in the Bible that Peter walked on the waters. What does it mean to walk on the waters? Practical analysis exuberantly qualifies that to walk on the waters of life is to transform the impressions of life.

    When someone gives us an ugly, or hateful impression, the sleeping consciousness, the Dry Mercury, responds with more hate. However, if one sacrifices their own desire to act negatively, to instead act with compassion, that liberates energy that allows for a psychological transformation. The transformation of impressions is Alchemy.

    The impressions, the sensations, must be worked with. Do not throw out or reject the sensations of life. Sensation itself is neither good nor evil. Only the mind is good or evil. We must comprehend our sensations. We have to work with the water (Genesis, creative energy, sexual energy) to walk on the water.

    Without comprehension, we fall into the waters. The mind has been stuffed to the brim with false concepts (Dry Mercury) throughout the many lives it has lived. Meditate on the complexity of the mind. One will realize that it is impossible that such an intricate, dense, and complicated labyrinth of an “I” could not be developed in the short number of years accumulated in a single life. The ultra complexity of our own psychology is due to the complication of many lives, not just a single life. Because of our endless convolutions of ego, we contain many concepts in the mind that do not have any reality. The mind we have is full of doubt, uncertainty, criticism, arrogance, fear, pride, etc., etc., but, nowhere in the mind will knowledge be found. Knowledge belongs to the consciousness.

    Nevertheless, we must use the mind as the practical instrument that it is. The mind was not constructed to serve doubt, or hate, or pride or lust into the world. The mind is just a tool, a binary operator that divides the Is from the Is Not. The mind labels everything as what it is, and by the absence of a label, what it is not. In the end, we have nothing more than concepts and labels. Consciousness, on the other hand, acquires knowledge through experience. The mind works through the consciousness. The fuel of the mind is the consciousness. When the consciousness gets trapped in the concepts of the mind, the ego is the result.

    The waters of life are triumphantly walked upon when the consciousness is in complete equilibrium. To identify with the impressions of life is failure. When we fall into the waters of life, then we become a servant of nature. The true King of Creation is that person who nature serves. In order to conquer nature, we must conquer our own interior nature. If we are slaves to our own nature, if we contain the ego, then we remain servants of nature, within and without. Moses was a true magician, a King of Nature. This is how he parted the waters.

    An esoteric application of the waters of life brings us to sex. The water is in synthesis the Sexual Waters. When Jesus walked on the waters, he told us that we must have willpower over the sexual waters: the ability to command our animal intellect, our animal emotion and our animal sexuality, instead of being commanded by them. It was Peter who followed because it is he who represents the Philosophical Stone (Peter = Cephas = Stone) spoken of by the Alchemists. When one purifies themselves through alchemy, they form a solid foundation (Yesod) for the awakening of consciousness. The Great Arcanum is the dual nature of the Key of Peter that Dante speaks of.
    Up the steps my master guided me
    Benevolently, saying: “Ask him now,
    In all humility, to turn the key.”
    Falling devoutly at his holy feet,
    In mercy’s name I begged to be let in;
    but, first of all, three times I smote my breast.
    Then with the sword he traced upon my brow
    the scares of seven P’s. “Once entered here,
    be sure you cleanse away these wounds,” he said.
    Ashes, or earth when it is dug up dry-
    this was the color of the robe he wore;
    he reached beneath them and drew out two keys.
    One key was silver and the other gold;
    first he applied the white one, then the yellow-
    with that the gate responded to my wish.
    Whenever either one of these two keys
    fails to turn properly inside the lock,
    and angel said, “the road ahead stays closed.
    One is more precious, but the other needs
    wisdom and skill before it will unlock,
    for it is that one which unties the knot.
    I hold these from Peter, who advised:
    ‘Admit too many, rather than too few,
    If they but cast themselves before your feet.’”
    – Purgatory Canto IX

    The seven P’s remind us of the Seven Sins, the mark of the beast. They are upon our head, in other words, our mind, our ego. The ego is the seven headed dragon that must be beheaded. The wound that must be washed is our own ego.

    The key is twofold, meaning Man and Woman. Man is solar, Gold. Woman is Lunar, silver. Peter was crucified, inverted, reminding us that we must descend to the Ninth Sphere. The Ninth Sphere of the Tree of Life is literally sex (birth, Yesod), and the Ninth Sphere of Hell is the sphere of final destruction (of ego). The Key of Peter is the synthesis of death and birth, the movement of opposite extremes. The Key of Peter is sex.

    The Cross of the Christ is sex: it is the cross of the Lingam-Yoni. The occultist knows that to reference the cross means we must work with the Sexual Creative Force.

    We have to descend before we ascend. In other words, Jesus had to die before going to Heaven. Likewise Osiris, Orpheus and Hercules had to descend before ascending because the Drama of the Christ resounds itself in every culture. The descent is into Hell with Lucifer. Lucifer is the temptation of Christ, but, without Lucifer-Prometheus, there is no Light. Without the fire of temptation there is no triumph of light. Satan himself is within our infraconsciousness, our own personal inferno. Prometheus is bound the hard rock of sex. When we “whitewash” the dark brass into immaculate whiteness, then Satan-Lucifer (sexual desire) transforms into Venus-Lucifer (Love). Then, Prometheus’ torment ends because Hercules (Christ) saves him!

    The Key is therefore sexual, and in order to transform the sexual energy we must not waste it. The Key of Alchemy, the Supreme Secret of all traditions, of the Masons, the Rosicrucians, all authentic Initiatic orders, the Gnostics, the Egyptians, the Tibetans, the White Lodges of all times is the following: Inmisium membrum virilin vaginae femina, sine ejaculatium seminus. “The connection of the phallus and uterus without the ejaculation of semen.” This is how we transform Water into Wine!

    Jung used this method in secret during the latter years of his life.

    When the virile member is placed within the yoni a certain type of energy is manifested. This is the Holy Spirit, the Creator-Destroyer. When this manifestation is not wasted in a moment of passion, when it is not lost in animal sexuality and fornication, this energy can be used in the self realization of the being. It is White Sexual Magic, Urdhvarata, Maithuna. This act is terribly divine and the one who intelligently makes use of it can create themselves anew.
     
  4. earl

    earl ?

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    Indeed, there is much symbolism in alchemy, which was why Jung was attracted to it-though must say the little alchemy I've read, which was only within the confines of jungian psychology, didn't appear to be as "sex obsessed" as in the above:D There may be a disucssion thread at this forum on the topic of sex and spirituality- a large complex topic in itself. the writings you provided above are suggestive of certain Tantric practices whithin both Hindu and Tibetan Buddhist practice-the "left-hand path." Certainly, Vajradhara would be better informed than me to elucidate that history, but my limited understanding re these traditions' actual use of sexualized practice, was that it was seldom suggested to practitioners and when used used only by those who had already progressed quite far spiritually due to the difficulty in using the strong desires of sexuality in a transmuted way to further enlightenment-i.e., it may only reinforce lust not enlarge awareness without a very developed awareness to begin with. I'm not aware that Jung ever attempted to use such practices though like many luminaries in authority, including Christian clergy and Buddhist monks, had lapses of ethics when it came to sex, sleeping with a number of his "discliples." However, unlike Freud who spek of "libido" or a sexualized energy being the primary emotional force propelling personality development, Jung did not give primacy to sexual energy. It seems though that no matter how "evolved" the individual, sexual energy often is a problematic one to manage approriately throughout life.

    Beyond the obvious of biological procreation, the "ultimate" purpose(s) of sexual energy seem as mysterious of a "force" as any other aspect of Life. To Jungians, Eros is the force which propels one to connect with life. From perspective of jungian psychology, they would probably say that the timing of the onset of the sex drive, coming as it does around adolescence, functions as the propulsive energy to assist the individual in reading to "jump from the family nest." That is jungians see that personality unfoldment earlier in life is about formulation of an ego/self, based on a stable, positive attachment with parent(s). Eros then functions with the sexualization of the life force to popel the individual to seek out new forms of connections that further the process of individuation. One could go off on further symbolic/mythological tangents related to sex such as discussing "Virgin births" & traditions of celibacy in various religious tradtions, (which I'll leave for either another time or another person:) ), but while sexual energy is an obvious important force of Life, can't say I'd agree it's what it's all about. Take care, Earl
     
  5. _Z_

    _Z_ from far far away

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  6. Chela

    Chela Psychological Janitor

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    You must look again, because my friend, the very basis of Alchemical work is sex. Anyone who does not know this is not an alchemist.

    Sex is the cause of life and vitality.

    People see this as 'sex obsessed' because their idea of sex is confused with lust, desire, sensuality, bruitsh things, etc., because this is the way they use sex. Nevertheless, sexual energy is related with thought, feeling and the impulse to move.

    Sexual energy, it and of itself, is pure beauty. In religion we call this Shiva-Shakti, Lucifer, Prometheus, Xolotl Nahuatl, etc. It, in and of itself, has nothing to do with desire, with physical sensorial things...

    Tantra and Alchemy are the same. They are both the transformation of energy, or the continual movement of energy. One can work with Alchemy and Tantra without the sexual act itself, no doubt. Nevertheless, they are still working with the sexual energy, the energy of creation and destruction, the energy of transformation -- although it will be called something else, but it is same.

    Obviously, the most powerful movement of energy takes place within the sexual act, but only if that energy is not lost within the sexual act. This is why the alchemist never reaches orgasm or ejaculation.

    [​IMG]

    There is the Vessile (the Uterus out of which the Golden Child is gestated), they couple is within the divine act. And the seven flowers atop? They are the Seven Churches in Asia (Assiah -> physical realm), they are the seven chakars that must be opened.

    [​IMG]
    Sun, is man. Woman, moon. And why are there seven underground? Because, like all Heros (Christs), they must work with the seven aspects, the seven sins..

    [​IMG]

    Again, man and woman!

    [​IMG]

    100% Tantric.

    Look again: http://www.gnosis.art.pl/iluminatornia/alkimija/alkimija.htm
     
  7. pohaikawahine

    pohaikawahine Elder Member

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    this whole thread was really fun to read .... thank you all for your lessons and thoughts .... and references .....


    the reference on hermaphrodite child of the sun and moon translated by mike brenner is excellent, it has references to many things posted in other treads like the seven-headed serpent and of course the whole concept of passion, desire, and the path of spirituality which is inherent in all traditions when one reads the symbols ....

    interesting the name of this thread however, 'alchemy: the lost science' .... because it is not lost, simply lying in wait for us to revive its essence .... alchemy is in its simplist terms the transformation of consciousness and the process for doing this takes place within the body itself .... all the symbols tells us how to do it .... there is really nothing magical, but there is a deep spiritual message which can only be seen within the realm of great desire or passion to see .... just my thought to share ....

    i noticed on your posting chela the two triangles that make up the star of david .... they also form the vortex before they merge .... there are several other treads in this forum that speak to the vortex (see native american piece) and the star of david is in many .... the star of david, the merging of the two parts of the vortex is the perfect balance of male and female energies within the human body itself and begins the process of the merkaba .... in sacred geometry the star tetrhedron - which is the star of david - is a counter rotating field linked to the spirals of movement of counsciousness from one level of reality to another .... it is our consciousness shifting into - or returning to - a higher harmonic .... in our dreams and meditations we see this symbolically or metaphorically as the creation of a new scroll or book of life .... all of this is related to the spiralling energy within the body that runs up and down the spinal column and into the brain .... all the symbols in alchemy teach us about this process of 'transformation' ....

    and the energy in the body can be used in the plane of matter as sex and the act of sex itself, or can be used on the plane of spirit and it become the energy for transformation of the counscousness and the awakening of the dormant seeds within us .... we make choices everyday in how we use energy .... to build walls of seperation or to bring them down ....

    "moment by moment, hour by hour, day by day .... this is how we live our lives, and this is how we change the world .... with each breath, each thought, each action" (author unknown) .... live a life of balance (in hawaii we would call this 'pono') and give breath to a new world .... one in which our children will survive another seven generations, and another, and another .... etc .....make alchemy a living science .... he hawai'i au, pohaikawahine
     
  8. earl

    earl ?

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    This got me interested in alchemy, in general, beyond the Jungian use of its symbols, which as I indicated is not used by them related to sexually nuanced notions per se, but used to describe the process of psychospiritual transformation in general. In fact, found a general alchemy web via a jungian site & briefly perused it. Certainly discovered some of the notions discussed above, but also learned there were many interpretations ancient and modern as to what alchemy really was including the historical medieval materialist notion of turning lead into gold, not just the metaphoric/symbolic-so "alchemy" as a term & concept seems to be almost a Rorshach of whatever you make it. As to tantra and kundalini-there are those "left-hand" paths in India and Tibet that for very advanced practitioners as I mentioned used actual "sexual" consorts, but also many other ways of viewing kundalini and the movement/transformation of subtle energies through the chakras than only reducing it to sexual energies. Vajrayana makes heavy use of comlementary "energies" speaking of them as "masculine" & "feminine" and make use of iconography suggestive of sexual poses but again not sure as P points out to say that that limits the concept only to its sexual representation though as P says that life force will certainly manifest via that chakra. Certainly, harnessing/transforming the energy (ies) of our desires in all their permutations is in part what the spiritual path is about. Interesting, though, as until this thread wasn't aware of any connection between the Western term alchemy and Tantrism in anyone's theories. thanks, Earl
     
  9. Thomas

    Thomas Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Whilst sex plays its part, the place of sex in the metaphysical schemata has to be understood.

    A point in question - and this would affirm Earl's comment - is that the sexual interpretation of Scriptural symbolism is subsidiary to the main and principial interpretations. The two waters and the firmament of Genensis, for example, refer to the Unmanifest and Manifest; Formless and Formal Manifestation; Subtle and Gross States, all of which take priority over gender distinction, which is itself a contingent and accidental determination of the Gross states of Formal Manifestation.

    Alchemy seeks a fusion, a unity, of these higher states.

    With regard to sex, the following might be noted:
    "Restrictive sexual morality, chastity and celibacy cannot be understood on a meremy cultural basis because there are no adequate humanistic reasons for them. Instead, these things arise from possibilities which belong to the esoteric, in the light of which alone they can be understood."
    Robert Bolton "Keys of Gnosis" Chapter 13 'The Redirection of the Vital Force'

    And further
    "It is a sign of the corruption of today's world that, even where the esoteric is written about, nothing is said about the meaning of a morality which has nothing to do with social unity. Without knowledge of such things, attempts to transform the inner nature of life will end in self-delusion. To try to realise all possibilities on all levels is merely a form of self-destruction, besides being an evasion of hard decisions."

    Thomas

    Thomas
     
  10. pohaikawahine

    pohaikawahine Elder Member

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    here is something that i just received this morning from "the master course of himalayan academy by satguru sivaya subramuniyaswami" ....

    "who was kadaitswami? kadaitswami was a dynamic satguru who revived saivism in catholic-dominated jaffna, sri lanka, in the 1800's. he was a powerful siddha, standing two meters tall, whose fiery marketplace talks converted thousands back to saivism. it is said he was a high court judge who refused to confer the death penalty and renounced his career at middle age to become a sannyasin. directed by his satguru to be a worker of miracles, he performed siddhis that are talked about to this day -- turning iron to gold, drinking molten wax, disappearing and appearing elsewhere."

    so it would certainly appear that kadaitswami was an alchemist .... some of our threads are certainly applicable to cross-religious discussions and this is a comparative religious site .... yet we tend to isolate ourselves even in many of the threads .... with a few cross-overs, primarily to point out differences .... hmmmmmmm .... how can we transform some of the threads to open them up to more dialogue about what we all have in common .... just some thought to toss in .... he hawai'i au, poh
     
  11. Thomas

    Thomas Super Moderator Staff Member

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    I agree, and delight in comparison, but we have to determine at what level we are talking.

    The nature and language of alchemy changes in relation to received Revelation, and the advances of physical science - as can be seen in the language of alchemical processes of the European Middle Ages.

    So the alchemical process is in a given sense a 'generic' commentary on the process of spiritual refinement - this has always been the traditional understanding of turning base metal into gold - but nowadays we have people who insist that there is actually a material process of turning lead into gold which achieves no other end but material wealth - the pursuit of which is itself a statement of spiritual immaturity if not baseness of the pseudo-alchemist.

    So we can discuss alchemy from the standpoint of Islamic Alchemy, Christian Alchemy, Hebraic Alchemy, et al. The point being that alchemy is a symbolic language encompassing a spiritual science determined by the doctrinal nature of the given tradition or culture in which it arises, the science 'altering' according to its doctrine.

    How the spirit is perceived, its nature, its illness and its perfection are given, according to the tradition. Alchemy is subsequent to that, the danger in this instance being in assuming that alchemical interpretation has priority over doctrine. We can discuss the differences between Islamic and, say, Vedic alchemy (if such a thing exists) but we shall invite confusion when we apply Christian Alchemical process to the Vedic without a proper understanding of the doctrinal differences between the two traditions.

    This is why I raised the issue of symbolic interpretation, the cross, for example, can be to do with gender difference, but to say the Christian symbol of the Cross is likewise to do with sex misses the mark entirely.

    Thomas
     
  12. _Z_

    _Z_ from far far away

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    There is a parallel in druidry if I may: one of the goals of alchemy is to attain the philosophers stone, from what I gather this is similar to the druidic ‘source’ from whence anything can be made manifest or transmutated. This is also a place [that I call the void] where the soul may traverse to anywhere within the minds eye – like an infinite door.

    Make any sense?



    Z
     
  13. pohaikawahine

    pohaikawahine Elder Member

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    makes perfect sense .... and to some of what Thomas posted, yes it would be difficult to make comparisons but seems like it would be a process worth trying at some point .... whether in alchemy or some other area .... even the philosopher's stone or the 'void' .... most of our stories of creation start with the 'void' in one form or another .... me ke aloha pumehana, poh
     
  14. Chela

    Chela Psychological Janitor

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    The Christian cross is, in fact, sexual. So is the Ankh cross, the Celtic cross, and all the forms of the swastika (a cross in movement). It is the intersection of opposites; from the most archetypical sense to the most dense and physical sense.

    All Alchemical tradition dates back to Hermes, they are all the same.

    The Mystery of the Rosy Cross is the same as the Mystery of the Golden Lotus.

    The Philosopher’s Stone is the same as the Stone of Stumbling and Rock of Offense (sexuality), the same stone that the builders rejected, the stone that is made the head of the corner. And it is true, many people stumble over their sexuality, fornicating and manifesting all their desire, adulturating, masturbating, pornography, etc., which is 100% an abuse of the gift of the energy of creation, and others find it offensive, dirty, so they become celebate and totaly reject sexuality, which is also an abuse. Both are these are a mistake, because one expresses sexuality negatively, and the other represses sexuality negatively; neither of them transform sexuality, comprehend sexuality, etc.

    Moses was an Alchemist, he placed the Bronze Serpent on the Cross. Bronze is Tin and Copper, a mixture, man and wife – and upon this cross they raise the Serpent (kundalini).

    So, we find this Alchemical image:
    [​IMG]

    A perfect stone in the waters (of creation-sexuality), the symbols of man and woman, the serpent on the cross. And atop are the fruits of the tree of life!

    Now, a lot can be said about sexuality, but unless that one is actualy working to transmute, unless that one is an actual Alchemist, his words are just a bunch theories. Therefore, it is good to note that I am not talking about theories, and I am telling you about a living knowledge that anyone can experience, if they so choose. To merely believe it or not, that is not important - and of course you are fee to disagree. But, if you want to know the truth, if you want to actually have an opinion with any meaning at all, then become serious and begin to transmute the sexual energy. :)
     
  15. Thomas

    Thomas Super Moderator Staff Member

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    "Therefore thus says the Lord God, Behold I am laying in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tested stone, a precious cornerstone, of a sure foundation: He who believes will not be in haste."
    Isaiah 28:16

    The orthodox interpretation of the above text in Christian tradition is always that the stone represents Christ, the promised Messiah, as is also the case in comparable texts, such as 'the stone which the builders rejected,' in the Psalms.

    This symbolism of the stone was adopted from more ancient uses, however, and the latter may be the means of connecting it with the so-called Philosophers' Stone, especially as historical revelation will normally correspond to a universal and atemporal order.

    It is worth noting that sex - as a gender determination, belongs to the cosmological (not universal) and temporal (not atemporal) order.

    Thus, as I said, a full and orthodox interpretation of Christian symbolism references metaphysical First Principle, not subsequent determinations.

    According to Greek myth Zeus let fly two eagles from opposite ends of the earth, and they flew towards each other and met over the town of Delphi, and this point at which they met was thus determined as the centre of the earth. The point was marked by the Omphalos stone in the temple of Apollo.

    When Harmonia wove the veil representing the whole universe, she started with the Omphalos stone at the centre and from there worked outward.

    The Omphalos was not only sacred to Apollo at Delphi but also marked the tomb of the slain and resurrected Dionysus. The Omphalos is also held to be the tomb of Python, the dragon that Apollo slew, and in the stone is often portrayed with a serpent coiled around it.

    For the Pythagoreans, the Omphalso symbolised the Monad, the seed of the universe.

    In Egypt their omphalos was the Ben-ben at Heliopolis, the theological centre of their culture, and prototype for the pyramids and the obelisk. Dedicated to the sun, the soul of the sun-god Ra, in the form of the Phoenix, would often alight upon it.

    There is an Omphalos in Ireland, at Tara, the seat of the High Kings of the Gaels, and the Stone of Scone sat beneath the seat of the kings of Scotland.

    Of course, there is the Dome of the Rock in Islam.

    The idea of the Stone, as both centre and foundation, finds its expression in all traditional cultures.

    Thus for the traditions the Stone was the expression of a substantial reality, which was called the Philosophers' Stone or the lapis, and a good many other things besides, such as the Unique (or One) Thing, the Divine Water, the Lion, and the Sodic Hydrolith. Under this diversity of names it was not distinguished from the prima materia, of the scholastics.

    ***

    The symbolism of the Cross, in Christianity, far exceeds its derivations and subsequent determinations in other traditions. It is the meeting of the finite and the Infinite, the temporal and the Eternal, the relative and the Absolute. Thus the symbolism of the Cross expresses not only a physical or substantial reality (as does the Stone) but the atemporal order directly.

    Again, to say that the meaning of the cross is sexual, is to miss the point entirely. It has a sexual interpretation, as it has its reference to all and every mode of being, but it supercedes them all.

    I would say that equating alchemy with sex is on a parallel to saying that the 'real' object of alchemical practice is turning base metals into gold.

    The 'chemical wedding' can be equated to the bride and groom in Christian symbolism, the marriage of soul and spirit - male and female are understood in their traditional and primordial aspects; physical gender and the sexual act is the most gross and material interpretation of the symbols.

    Thomas
     
  16. pohaikawahine

    pohaikawahine Elder Member

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    I think the concept is not equating alchemy or the cross with sex, but with energy .... when we run the inner energy within our bodies we can move it as either sexual energy or spiritual energy (in a broad sense) .... and therein lies a meaning within a meaning .... the level of actual sexual energy is not the deepest level of this knowledge, but it is a level .... the deepest level is related to spiritual energy .... within the body it must move up the spinal column into the center of the brain to open the mind to visions and revelations .... this is spiritual energy ....


    the cross is a symbol of many things .... one is the meeting of heaven and earth which is the symbol of the human body itself .... when we stand with our arms outstreatched to each side .... when we are successful in connecting the whole inner system, metaphorically we have reconnected our heads to our body and we are whole again or we have the symbol of the meeting of heaven and earth (we have created this) .... this movement of energy within the body into the brain is part of the process of transformation which is inherent in alchemy ....and also symbolized in the marriage of the sky father and earth mother ... or wakea and papa (in the hawaiian tradition) ....

    the serpent is the symbol of the energy and two serpents intertwined is the symbol of the internal male and female energies (or our own DNA is another way to look at it) .... one way of reaching this place in the center of the brain (to open the door or gateway to the world of visions and revelations) is through great passion, desire and love (this in itself will produce chemical changes in the brain that move this process) .... so in a sense, all of the above by Thomas and Cela are both correct .... I believe that if we look at the inner meaning of the symbols we will all come out at the same place ....

    gotta go .... love these postings they are filled with such insights .... aloha nui, poh
     
  17. Chela

    Chela Psychological Janitor

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    Yes, and Christ is on the Cross of Reconciling Opposites.

    I disagree. Creation is sex. A baby is created through sex, a universe is created through sex. Sex, properly understood, is the action of creation. Sex is universal.

    Excellent!

    I agree.

    God created the universe with the cross, the manifestation of the sexual-creative energy. To say that the cross is not sexual, quite frankly is ignorance.

    Perhaps that is because you are not an Alchemist?

    How can one talk with authority about sexual transmutation if one has not experience with it?

    I am interested with experiential knowledge, not theoretical knowledge.

    Sex, in and of itself, is neither material nor gross.
     
  18. seattlegal

    seattlegal Why do cows say mu?

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    Oh my, so much I can write, where to start? If this post is too freaky for you, please ask the Mods to delete it. :)
    Very much agreed, especially when there are "two keys" mentioned. Confusing one key for the other in respect to the different traditions can lead to much folly. I have many different theories regarding the different traditions, and their meanings in regards to creation. I also agree with your point regarding the Christian Cross and sex. {Perhaps that is a good place to start.}

    Perhaps this might be of interest to you: exploring the connections between the ankh cross with t-RNA. If you look at the functions of t-RNA, and compare them to depiction of the ankh in Egyptian art, you will notice many interesting parallels...too many to list here.
     

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  19. wil

    wil UNeyeR1

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    has anyone read about connections between the alchemists formulae and the supposed hiding of Jesus's thought/words? That turning iron into gold is man into christ, earth consciousness into heavenly consciousness etc. That as the churches and inquisitions were burning every heretical book in sight...that the info could be hid amongst the alchemists as greed was powerful enough to have an interest in maintaining all those books?
     
  20. eameece

    eameece New Member

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    Anyone still here:)?

    Responding to the ideas about the philosophers stone and the Bible, I want to mention Matthew 16. Here Jesus says to Peter (and later to all his disciples) "on this rock I will build my church... and the keys to the kingdom, which will confer on you the powers of loosing and binding, in earth and heaven"
    This seems to me an alchemical reference. Loosing is like mercury and the dissolving moon principle; binding like sulphur and the coagulating sun principle. The main dictum of alchemy is "solve et coagula." Earth and heaven refer to the spiritual and the manifest realms; thus the 4 directions of the great wheel. The 2 Keys, which became papal symbols, are spoken of by occult authors as the two snakes of the caduceus, the two principles of gold and silver/sun and moon, male and female, etc.
     

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