Religions vs. religions

Vajradhara

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Namaste all,

/Moderator Hat ON/

Please be mindful of the other sentient beings when making your points on this thread. There are some posts which seem to be very close to breaching the CoC.. so, let's all just breath a bit and relax.. we can discuss things in a constructive manner, it just requires patience.

/Moderator Hat OFF/

metta,

~v
 

Vajradhara

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Namaste and Salaam Akbar,

thank you for the post.

akbar said:
Does each religion have a separate God?

well, simply no. Buddha Dharma, for instance, does not have a concept of a Creator Deity as part of the practice.

Why they insist on special name or names for their God? Does God approve any language necessary to be prayed? Does not He know other languages? Does he approve only special manners to be prayed as different armies observe different orders for show off? Does religion not believe that the God is one, the God of universe and mankind?

based on the most oft used defintions of God, it seems strange to consider that said being could only use one language to communicate... yet, clearly, we are all aware of some beings which hold that very view.

it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me but, then again, neither does the whole idea of a Creator Deity to begin with!!! so, perhaps, it is only logical that it wouldn't make sense to me ;)

All religions join such competition so separate additions, conditions, and other manners are included for keeping separate entities. Claims of superiorities are necessary to satisfy respective followers, so each religion claims having best additions, conditions.

to some extent, i think that this is a concession to human nature. humans seem to have a desire to feel confident in their veiws and beliefs... as such, many humans wouldn't be inclined towards religious practice if it was not couched in such a manner as to instill a single pointed sort of confidence in the accuracy and truthfulness of the teachings.

I do believe in life after death and that human soul will never perish. I also believe in the God’s rewards and punishments but I do not claim to have achieved perfection in faith.

this seems to be a fairly common feature of theistic traditions, at least those that have deities which sit in judgement upon human actions.

metta,

~v
 

taijasi

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seattlegal said:
Now, if the religion {singular}, or white light as it has been called, wishes to nullify one or more of the wavelengths that are part of it, how long can it remain white? How long before it becomes black, or the absence of any wavelength, due to the destruction and cancellation of the many different wavelengths that make up that white light? ... By destroying those wavelengths, the white light destroys itself, and by invalidating the essential nature of of the various wavelengths, the white light invalidates itself. Isn't this the core message of the Golden Rule?
All of this is a point well made, and quite diplomatically so, I think. I do not disagree in the slightest. And especially after Vaj's post as mod - with hatchet, axe, and saw (pruning is necessary, sometimes) - I would rather not stir up trouble that ... does not exist (or has ceased to).

That said, my offer remains. Show me where I am seeking to nullify specific wavelengths of said white light, show me precisely how so, and if that can be shown to be the case - I will gladly admit it, and more importantly, apologize & seek to make amends. But what you have shared regarding the Golden Rule seems to drive the point home that much further ... that the commonalities are worth focusing on, not the differences. Certainly, I wouldn't want someone insisting to me, that my religion (worldview, philosophy, beliefs, etc.) were or are incompatible with the "White Light" notion - which is both the Source of all particular wavelengths of colored light ... as well as their resolution, or Synthesis.

Seattlegal said:
Unity does not mean uniformity, and it is not what goes into your mouth that defiles you, but it is what comes out of your mouth that defiles you. Food for thought.
An excellent point! The first five words echo my sentiments exactly!!! AMEN! :D

cheers,

andrew
 

lunamoth

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<moderator post>

I second Vaj's advice.

OK, you'll notice that some posts have been removed now to redirect this thread back on track.

Thread re-opened.


lunamoth
 
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Pathless

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Backing up a bit...

ili said:
And doesn't it say in the Bible that each of us carry the seed of God in us, if that is true doesn't it follow that easch of us has the ability to be God-like?
juantoo3 said:
Having read the KJV through, and several other versions as reference, I do not recall this anywhere. Would you mind quoting chapter and verse?

For me, Luke 17:21 comes to mind, where Jesus states that "the Kingdom of God is within you." That, along with his teachings of unconditional Love, is the essence of Jesus' message, to my mind.

Luke 17

20: And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:

21: Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
 

Jim M2

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Kathe,

Sorry for the delayed response. I'm not a good person to discuss the concept of one God. Somewhere in my journey I became comfortable with first cause, necessary being, monotheism...etc. I can't remember specifics, but at this point I say simply that I accept there is one God.

As far as a corresponding evil god (referring to post #13) I tend to think free will opens the door to evil.

All the best,
Jim
 

Gulliver

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Käthe said:
Just out of curiosity, why?

I'm being serious, why can there be only one "God"?

To break God up into parts just puts off the ultimate question, "Who made the parts?"

Whatever you define as God must, by definition, be the "beginning of the fractal" (the true First Cause) or you haven't gone far enough down the philosophical rabbit hole yet.

My own inner beliefs tell me that we are all One with the Creator of this universe, all separation is an illusion, and that illusion encompasses the possibility of endless "levels of being" between us and the Heart of Creator. Any of those other levels of being could be interpreted as "gods" (little g) by some.

At least that's how it looks from where I'm sitting.

SIDE NOTE: As a new member, let me say that these are wonderful forums. This is without a doubt one of the most mature spiritual discussion sites I've ever encountered. A thousand thanx to the administrators who have created such a wonderful place to discuss and compare thoughts. It is an honor to be able to join this roundtable.
 

Jean-h

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Spirituality is a hard and lonesome way one has to follow to grow.
Religion is tailor-made thoughts !
 

akbar

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Jean, You are abosolutely right to say,

"Spirituality is a hard and lonesome way one has to follow to grow.
Religion is tailor-made thoughts !"
 

akbar

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Jim M2

I accept there is one God.

Yes, I agree and believe so.
 

mee

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psalm 83;18
That people may know that you, whose name is Jehovah,​

You alone are the Most High over all the earth
 

Jean-h

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Obvious Child said:
Only if you believe in a truly existent evil. Which I do, but there you go.

In practise, many monotheism worship god indirectly and are in a sense polymorphous too. Cults of saints etc. spring to mind.

He is not a true opposite God though as he has no independent power.
Mainstream Christians do not consider the spirit neuter, when they consider it at all. It is feminine in the OT and neuter in the NT, but is often considered male, like the rest of God, or neuter.

The early Zorastrianism was dualist: in fact that was its fundamental characteristic from the Christian POV. They did add the over-god who transcended light and dark, good and evil, later.

I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things. Isaiah 45:7
 

Jean-h

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I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things. (KJV)

Isaiah 45:7
 

Jean-h

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Hymn to Zeus



Whoever you are, wherever you are, Zeus, God, I praise you for being
merciless, for not sparing anyone, for not making exceptions for anyone, for
not being concerned of the salvation of anyone in particular, for not sending
any Saviour to anyone.

You are not good. You are even less merciful. But you give each being according to what he can take. You are not just in a human way, giving each the same portion. You are just in the same manner as the scales, where the least weight has its importance. Going forward along the way of your Law, thin as the wire of a tightrope walker, each being tries to keep one’s balance, or to loose it just a brief moment, in a movement that will save him. If the tight walker has overestimated his own strength, and he falls, you don’t work any miracle to save him and you let him crash without pardon.

You are non egalitarian. But much less than one would suspect, because you give invisible compensations. You make the slaves love their chains, the disabled love their disabilities, the afflicted their tears, the humbles their humility. You remove in the equality of death the failures and the faults, because you also remove the triumphs and the virtues. You remove the sorrows and the mourning, because you remove the joys and the ecstasies in the same way. You send back to nothingness the executioners and the victims, the mighty and the weak. Those that die before their time lose less that would appear, because you extend the time of youth that seems to last an eternity, and you shorten the time of old age, that goes by as a shadow.

You are not the reason. You are not the Logos. Because you are the base of reason and reasoning. You are not a mathematician, a geometrician, but you give the mathematicians, the lovers of sciences and games, the ground where they can play.

You are not the Word, not even the Language, or the Signification,
because you are beyond not only the words, but the meanings. You express
yourself in your creatures, but your creation does not mean anything, not
even your glory. You are not intelligible, and you do not seem to appreciate
pure intelligence. But you give to understand according to the needs of
each being. You show yourself in all clarity to those that have eyes to see,
because you are an unintelligible god, but not a hidden god.

You are not Love, but you are even less Hate. You make hatred difficult to those that feel it and love delicious to those that can keep just for one moment a haven of security and intimacy. You force each one to defend himself, to kill to live, to have fangs and claws, to cling to his own domain. But you do not favour violence no more than weakness, and you destroy the violent as well as the one that accept to be aggressed. You only favour the eagerness to live, to hold, to repair, to continue, to resist.




You allow the lie when it is a weapon to survive. You allow the disguise, the mimicry of the predator or the pray, the publicity to attract or to frighten or to confuse. You allow beautiful speeches intended to dazzle. But you do not accept the least trick in constructions and you do not save the ones that sink in boat made of cardboard , or the ones that are crushed by poorly balanced buildings.

I praise you for being indifferent to my praise, just like you would be
to my imprécations.

I praise you for having given me life, and to let me live a moment longer, before you let me die – without last judgement, without reward nor punishment – just like you will let the whole of mankind die and all the living one. At least on this earth that is not promised to eternal life, but that will have been a window on eternity.

Cléanthe (+/- 300 b.c.)
 

Quahom1

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Jean-h said:
Hymn to Zeus



Whoever you are, wherever you are, Zeus, God, I praise you for being
merciless, for not sparing anyone, for not making exceptions for anyone, for
not being concerned of the salvation of anyone in particular, for not sending
any Saviour to anyone.

You are not good. You are even less merciful. But you give each being according to what he can take. You are not just in a human way, giving each the same portion. You are just in the same manner as the scales, where the least weight has its importance. Going forward along the way of your Law, thin as the wire of a tightrope walker, each being tries to keep one’s balance, or to loose it just a brief moment, in a movement that will save him. If the tight walker has overestimated his own strength, and he falls, you don’t work any miracle to save him and you let him crash without pardon.

You are non egalitarian. But much less than one would suspect, because you give invisible compensations. You make the slaves love their chains, the disabled love their disabilities, the afflicted their tears, the humbles their humility. You remove in the equality of death the failures and the faults, because you also remove the triumphs and the virtues. You remove the sorrows and the mourning, because you remove the joys and the ecstasies in the same way. You send back to nothingness the executioners and the victims, the mighty and the weak. Those that die before their time lose less that would appear, because you extend the time of youth that seems to last an eternity, and you shorten the time of old age, that goes by as a shadow.

You are not the reason. You are not the Logos. Because you are the base of reason and reasoning. You are not a mathematician, a geometrician, but you give the mathematicians, the lovers of sciences and games, the ground where they can play.

You are not the Word, not even the Language, or the Signification,
because you are beyond not only the words, but the meanings. You express
yourself in your creatures, but your creation does not mean anything, not
even your glory. You are not intelligible, and you do not seem to appreciate
pure intelligence. But you give to understand according to the needs of
each being. You show yourself in all clarity to those that have eyes to see,
because you are an unintelligible god, but not a hidden god.

You are not Love, but you are even less Hate. You make hatred difficult to those that feel it and love delicious to those that can keep just for one moment a haven of security and intimacy. You force each one to defend himself, to kill to live, to have fangs and claws, to cling to his own domain. But you do not favour violence no more than weakness, and you destroy the violent as well as the one that accept to be aggressed. You only favour the eagerness to live, to hold, to repair, to continue, to resist.




You allow the lie when it is a weapon to survive. You allow the disguise, the mimicry of the predator or the pray, the publicity to attract or to frighten or to confuse. You allow beautiful speeches intended to dazzle. But you do not accept the least trick in constructions and you do not save the ones that sink in boat made of cardboard , or the ones that are crushed by poorly balanced buildings.

I praise you for being indifferent to my praise, just like you would be
to my imprécations.

I praise you for having given me life, and to let me live a moment longer, before you let me die – without last judgement, without reward nor punishment – just like you will let the whole of mankind die and all the living one. At least on this earth that is not promised to eternal life, but that will have been a window on eternity.

Cléanthe (+/- 300 b.c.)

Are you expressing an opinion? Or are you presenting old adages from times gone by? I'm serious, Is this your opinion, or understanding, or way of life?

I'd like to know...
 
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