Vampyrism

Discussion in 'Magick' started by Blackrose, Oct 5, 2006.

  1. Blackrose

    Blackrose Luciferian Witch

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    I was just wondering if there were any other people here whom may follow a vampiric path. If so, what kind of vampyrism, and do you believe that vampyres are preditores?
     
  2. moseslmpg

    moseslmpg Well-Known Member

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    What do you mean by vampirirc path exactly?
     
  3. 17th Angel

    17th Angel לבעוט את התחת ולקחת שמות

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    lol.....


    Path 1: Immortal creatures of the night, that have insane traits, speed, strength and so on? They, really reall,reaaaaally do not exist.

    Path 2: people that "think" they are Vampires, and cut themselves and others to get "super duper" powers and also diseases?
     
  4. moseslmpg

    moseslmpg Well-Known Member

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    I was asking someone that actually knew, but I think your perception of "path" 1 is erroneous.
     
  5. Blackrose

    Blackrose Luciferian Witch

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    I was refering to those that feed upon the lifeforce or psychic energies of others. Then there are those paths which use the invocation of different architypical forces generally called godforms and seek to absorb them into theirselves.

    There are those that do drink blood. In my opinion though the blood only serves as a psychic link to draw upon the lifeforce of psychic energy of the one the blood comes from.

    Blessings Bright & Dark,

    Blackrose
     
  6. moseslmpg

    moseslmpg Well-Known Member

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    I see, thank you. Would this be any kind of energy or specifically energy as it pertains to the etheric body? The ingestion of blood is more understandable in that context than in the context of psychic energy, IMO. I take psychic energy to refer to the astral body, but I could be wrong.
     
  7. Blackrose

    Blackrose Luciferian Witch

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    You bring up a good point with your question. It is my understanding that different kinds or types of vampyres work with various different forms of energy. Some are emotional vampyres, some sexual vampyres, but in general from what I have learned thus far the main focus is the strengthening and care of the astral body so as to avoid the second death, (in other words the survival of the astral body after physical death).

    I have heard the energy refered to as mana, chi, vril, most vampyres tend to just call it "blood", refering to life essence.

    Hope this helps your understanding.

    Blessings Bright & Dark,
    Blackrose
     
  8. EnlightenKisses

    EnlightenKisses New Member

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    If someone could help me i would really appreciate it.

    My name is Samantha. I'm 16. And im Atheist. My family is Christian,and i use to be a Christian. Though a few things in my life have happend and im afraid i've lost my faith in that religion.
    Im really interested in learning about different religions. And one of those different religions i really want to learn more about is Vampirism. I've read a few things here and there, but im afraid it still hasn't given me the information i was hoping on reciecing. Not only do i want to learn Vampirism i was also hoping on learning about Wiccan and Satanism. The reason i want to learn about thses religions is because they are not ones that i've learned much about.They are religions that my family believes are bad and stupid and rediculous. My family has no idea that ive turned to a life of not believing in any religion. But i think its my choice. So if anyone can help me on any of the above topics you can instant message me my screen name is EnlightenKisses for AIM, and Enlightenkisses16 for Yahoo. Im on AIM more so i perfer if you could instant message me there. Thank you.
     
  9. Francis king

    Francis king Well-Known Member

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    dear sweet enlightenment kisses... please do not trouble urself with silliness like vampire and satanism... vampires do not exist, and nor do satanists, really, they just think they do... as ur only 16, u would not be accepted into any decent coven (a group of witches) until u were at least 18, and as I'm new here and am not sure of the rules I do not know if u will be around here long enough to read this post, butI hope u do... when we are young, and brought up with faith, we like to rebel, and a lot of us, me included, try to become "darker" than we are, to rebel against our parents, the church, etc, etc, but really, its all a waste of time, and u'd be better off focusing on ur career and ur future than all this rubbish.. hopefully one of the mods will see ur post and cut it up, and take out ur addys, and I'll tell u why, shall I? cos if u really are a 16 year old kid, then ur offering urself up on a plate to all kinds of weirdoes who eat lil kids like u for breakfast, and while that might seem oh so very exciting to you now, the reality of life is somewhat different. Pain, misery, violence, drinking blood, hurting ppl, its not big, and its not clever either... grow up kid... if u want to learn about these things, then great, I admire ur enthusiasm, but u can read books, u can surf the net, and then u can decide... if u want some sweaty old man teaching u about Crowleys sex magic, great, but really, kiddo, get some sense...
     
  10. 17th Angel

    17th Angel לבעוט את התחת ולקחת שמות

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    Re: If someone could help me i would really appreciate it.

    Define Satanism........
     
  11. moseslmpg

    moseslmpg Well-Known Member

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    Francis, there are such things as Satanists in the same way that there are such things as Christians.

    Samantha, vampirism is not a religion so much as it is a set of practices, I think. If you're an athiest though, I think you'll have a hard time with Wicca and theistic Satanism, and I'm not sure you're talking about Wicca either, but satanic-ish witchcraft (I believe there is a difference). Athiestic religions are like Buddhism (sort of), philosophical Satanism, IPU-ism, maybe Discordianism, etc.

    But then you say you don't believe in any religion, so it sounds like you're just doing this to be rebellious which I think, frankly, is stupid if that is the case. If you're not going to believe in religion and all that stuff, just don't. If you want to be rebellious get some piercings and tattoos and dye your hair half pink and half octarine.

    Anyway, I'm done with my rant...Here are some sources, for better or worse.
    Temple of the Vampire
    Xeper.org - Home
    Satanism and the history of Wicca
    Wicca, the religion
    SATANISM: Real & imaginary
    Vampirism and vampyrism

    The first two are brotherhoods.
     
  12. path_of_one

    path_of_one Embracing the Mystery

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    As far as I have come to understand it, talking with self-proclaimed "real vampires" (which does not equate to the fictional/legendary ones) and doing a bit of research over the last couple years, vampirism can mean several different things. This is based on a fair bit of research, both of literature and conversations/interviews with self-proclaimed vampires. I'm an anthropologist and this growing trend, particularly among young people, has been of some interest to me.

    First, there is the mythic vampire. The ancient European myths of vampires were more likely than not ordinary people who died early and/or in accidental and sudden ways. Unhappy with their untimely deaths and lonely for companionship, they had astral or spirit selves that would leave their graves at night and come back to claim the lives of the living, seeking to bring friends, family, and neighbors into the Otherworld with them. These myths are fairly easy to explain, because at the time they proliferated, people had no idea what caused disease and death, life expectancy was short, and people did not understand the process of decay, either. So they thought that when whole families died, the dead were coming back for the living (rather than knowing that germs had infested the household). And when they dug up "vampires," they thought that there was evidence for their nighttime activities (body cavity filled with blood, longer nails, groaning sound if they nailed a stake into the body, etc.). They didn't know these were normal processes in decay.

    The myths were transposed onto people who were bloodthirsty and mass murderers. So Vlad the Impaler, a particularly scary guy (but also a folk hero for defending his homeland successfully) became the basis for what would later be Dracula. Elizabeth Bathory, a royal who was obsessed with youth and killed peasant girls in order to bathe in their blood (basically, what we'd call today a loony sociopathic murderer nutcase), also became entwined in the legends of vampires.

    People also began mixing up the traditional Eastern Europoean vampire myth with myths of succubi/incubi. These were supposedly demons that fed on sexual energy. They were a convenient way for otherwise decent, chaste men and women to blame their sexual dreams on someone other than themselves. There are a bunch of other vampire-like things in various cultures' mythic traditions that get wrapped up in the modern version as well, but it's mostly the above.

    Cut to the writing of "Dracula," and the image of the vampire is transformed from a ruddy-faced bloated peasant guy who died early to a pale, beautiful and sophisticated immortal with super powers.

    No wonder people are in love with vampires nowadays. Who doesn't want to be beautiful, live forever, and have super powers?

    So, now you get a few things going on in modern culture. Self-proclaimed vampires do not all agree on who (or what) they are.

    There is vampirism as a religion, complete with church, ritual, and ethical guide. This has nothing to do with drinking blood.

    There are vampires who believe they were born with "vampiric spirits" and are not really human. Kind of like vampires clothed in human bodies. They often identify with the otherkin movement, if you're familiar with that. So some people think that "real vampires" (aka human living vampires) are one category (or species, if you will) of otherkin. Other categories include various types of elves, fairies, dragons, etc. These often claim certain powers- among the most common are acute eyesight and hearing, sensitivity to electricity, and rapid healing.

    There are other vampires who believe they have a physical condition or deficiency that causes them to crave blood and/or energy from other people. They claim a variety of symptoms if they fail to get these needs met (not the least of which is intense thirst and hunger, and migraines), and they also claim a variety of allergies, such as sensitivity to sunlight and allergies to certain foods. These, on the surface, will appear to be saying they are the same thing as the otherkin vampires (same symptoms, behaviors, etc.) but there is a big difference- what vampirism means to them. For otherkin vampires, they believe they are really vampires. It is a definition of who they are, and they typically embrace it, becoming involved with training themselves to feed on energy and/or being comfortable with blood-drinking. For many vampires who believe they are humans, vampirism is a condition that they feel they have to live with, and they would prefer to find a "cure." They do not believe it is a spiritual condition, but rather a physical one, and there are lots of theories floating around the vampiric world about what the cause is, ranging from genetic mutation to virus.

    Then there are those who don't believe they HAVE to be vampiric at all, but embrace the lifestyle. They are attracted to blood-drinking and such activities as a fetish or a lifestyle, though they do not claim to have any symptoms if they go without it. Those who believe they really ARE vampires, and can't help their desire for blood and/or energy, are often rather annoyed at those who they perceive to be copying them without any of what they feel are the legitimate reasons to do so.

    And there are some that will tell you they really are the REAL vampires, the immortal ones. Some will say they can change YOU into a vampire. Everyone else thinks they are nutcases. Of course, the outside world speculates about the oddity of a bunch of people who believe they are really vampires in spirit (or a bunch of people who believe they crave blood) calling other self-proclaimed vampires crazy.

    Most of the vampires who believe they are otherkin or have a condition are pretty normal in other ways. Most you would not guess are vampires. They are not all goths, and most have normal lives, homes, jobs, and even kids. There are vampire groups that meet, generally around the metropolitan areas. It isn't that hard to find them. Some are organized and some are just groups of friends that hang out together. There are certain clubs that are frequented more often than others by self-proclaimed vampires, but the kind of blood-drinking in public thing is uncommon and those places are (not surprisingly) not advertised. Most self-proclaimed vampires are very much against that sort of thing and feel that safety and respect with their donor is very important.

    So, there is your long version of the different varieties and brief history of vampirism. The last site mentioned above has a decent selection of Websites that will explain details- the last, by religioustolerance.org, has an excellent selection of Websites as well.

    Psychic vampirism, particularly, was associated with Anton La Vey's Satanism, but the two are not bound to each other. As far as I know from the readings I've done on La Vey and the few Satanists I've encountered (none of them theistic, but rather, like La Vey, atheist), none have participated in blood-drinking or violent activities of any sort. I've never talked with a theistic Satanist who really believes in Satan, so I can't speak to that.

    I would not encourage people to haphazardly get involved in vampirism or the vampiric community. While most of the people I have talked with are decent folks who have normal jobs and lives and these people generally follow an ethical code about blood-drinking and energy-feeding (and even encourage all sorts of safety measures, like getting blood tests done on your donor and being monogamous in feeding), there are some true nutcases who believe themselves to be immortal. There are some who seem sociopathic or psychotic. There are some who, because of the popularity of vampires among youth, use it as a way to get close to minors and are basically your run of the mill sexual predators. There are also people who believe they hunt vampires, and these are equally wacky.

    So tread carefully, not because mythic vampires exist, but rather because some humans can be really delusional and hurtful to others.
     
  13. iBrian

    iBrian Peace, Love and Unity Admin

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    I have a friend who runs a goth magazine who recently published a book about modern vampires. I've only read the intro, but it immediately dismisses the idea that there are Dracular-like figures roaming wild, but instead there are modern forms of vampire along the lines as desribed above.

    There is also, I believe, a very clear set of medical conditions that can easily provide vampire-like attributes. I wrote a piece on clinical vampirism years ago for another site - I'll just repaste it here:

    Clinical Vampirism

    There are a number of scientifically recognised and accepted medical conditions that have great similarities with classic physical manifestations of the "vampire".

    Most of the following (excepting XP and HED) come under the general medical grouping of Porphyria, all of which are relatively rare genetic disorders:

    • Xeroderma Pigmentosa (XP)
    • Hypohidrotic Ectodermal Dysplasia (HED)
    • Acute Intermittent Porphyria (AIP)
    • Variegate Porphyria (VP)
    • Hereditary Coproporphyria (HC)
    • Plumbopophyria (PP)
    • Porphyria Cutanea Tarda (PCT)
    • Erythropoietic Protoporphyria (EPP)
    • Congenital Porphyria (CP)
    One of the greatest commonalities regarding symptoms includes not simply acute photosensitivity, but severe skin damage caused by prolonged exposure to Ultra-Violet light, whether it be from sunlight, halogen lights, or even types of fluourescent lighting.

    Many of the above genetic conditions also feature additional symptoms. Anaemia is a common denominator, and another possible symptom is the receding of the gums (making the canine teeth appear more like fangs). Also small sores, closely resembling puncture marks, can form upon the skin.

    Varieties where discolouring occurs can also be apparent, including a pronounced darkness about the eyes, and dark red staining all about the mouth. Certain physical peculiarities, especially in the facial area, can also occur (I refuse to use the word "deformities" here).

    Some of these genetic conditions can be diagnosed either at birth or at an otherwise very young age, as like with muscular dystrophy. Others can take years, even decades, before the relevant symptoms become apparent, as like with multiple sclerosis. Many sufferers of the above conditions have a thousand fold increase likelihood of developing specific cancers, especially in the organ of the skin, such as melanoma variants. Some of the above conditions are even terminal, the body being unable to repair tissue damage caused by the condition.

    I would like to hesitatingly suggest that anyone who suffers from one of the porphyria conditions, or even XD or HED, but remains undiagnosed (especially one of the varieties that only develop in the onset of adult life) may find themselves in a confused state as to their condition. As the physical disorder worsens, and "vampire-like" symptoms develop, it is not unimaginable that such a person may begin to associate themselves personally more and more with the cultural symbol of the "vampire".

    Following are a few short passages and following links relating to clinical vampirism:

    PASSAGES:

    1/ Porphyria as a diagnosis for vampiric myth and legend:

    Their lack of medical knowledge about diseases, some of which are quite rare and hard to explain even to this day was a large factor in the spread of vampire lore. Along with the fact that very uneducated people have always had a tendency of being overly superstitious also contributed to the vampire legend.

    In 1985 Dr. David Dolphin, Ph.D., a professor of chemistry at the University of British Columbia presented his theory that blood-drinking vampires were not vampires at all but rather victims of a disease known as Porphyria.(Dresser, Norine. American Vampires p171) " Porphyria is an incurable genetic disease which affects at least 50,000 patients in the U.S. that causes sudden symptoms of severe pain , respiratory problems, Skin lesions and sometimes death."(Dresser, Norine. American vampires p171) "Porphyria may well have been responsible for many a vampire tale - especially since the disease is hereditary" (Garden, Nancy. Vampires p98) A person that is affected by Porphyria can seem very scary to the average person since the disease causes the persons gums to tighten. That causes their teeth to be seen much more prominently as well as causing their teeth and
    nails to gain a fluorescent glow.

    These traits could then go on to explain the fact that many vampire stories described the vampires as giving off a greenish glow. Victims of this disease are likely to be deformed in other ways as well but usually in the facial area. Because of the skin lesions suffered by victims of Porphyria they are usually very sensitive to light which would cause them to not venture out of their homes until night.

    2/. HOW DO I KNOW IF ANYONE HERE IS A VAMPIRE (MYSELF INCLUDED)?
    Presume that if someone claims to be a vampire, they are - even if only in their own minds. Remember that "behaviour is attitude in action" and that, probably, whoever thinks like a vampire (right or wrong) might act like a vampire. For now we'll try to avoid the question of which philosophy is correct, "to do is to be", or "to be is to do".

    3/ Xeroderma pigmentosa is a life-threatening, inherited skin disorder. Individuals are born without the ability to repair damage done to their skin cells by the ultraviolet light in sunshine. They rapidly develop skin crusting, scarring, and cancers. Affected individuals must avoid all sunlight, fluorescent light, halogen light, or any other source of ultraviolet light.

    4/ WHAT IS PORPHYRIA ?

    Porphyria is a fairly uncommon condition. It is not one condition, but a group of several related diseases. Most of these are inherited but some may be acquired. People with porphyria may develop skin problems or a condition known as the acute attack. In all the porphyria, the basic dilemma is that excessive amounts of porphyrins and their precursors accumulate in the body. It is under-diagnosed [my emphasis - Brian].

    Many sufferers are completely asymptomatic. All living things, including healthy people produce porphyrins. In porphyria, there is an atypical accumulation of porphyrins as the result of enzyme defects; this results in illness. Our bodies convert two simple substances, 5-aminolaevulinate (ALA) and porphobilinogen (PBG) known as porphyrin precursors, into more complicated substances called porphyrins.

    These are then converted from one type of porphyrin to the next to form haem. Haem is a vital substance in our bodies. Protoporphyrin together with Iron are the building blocks necessary to make haem. Each step on the pathway is completed by a special protein known as an enzyme. In each type of porphyria, a specific enzyme is deficient, and this is why porphyrins accumulate

    The acute attack takes place when the levels of the porphyrin precursors become very much raised for one or other reason. One can think of this as an overloading of the body with porphyrins and their precursors. During such an attack, the affected person may experience abdominal pain, cramps, constipation, nausea or vomiting. They may also show marked anxiety or disturbed behaviour.

    Such attacks can be bad enough to require admission to hospital, and the most severe cases may go on to weakness and paralysis. People have even died of such an attack.
     
  14. moseslmpg

    moseslmpg Well-Known Member

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    A really good book on the subject, that was informative to me anyway, is The Science of Vampires by Katherine Ramsland. She explaines the clinical, psychological, folklore aspects and all that and speculates on how it could be possible in the future to be a vampire. There's also a nice section about the stages of death.

    Also, Michael Greer proposes in his book Monsters, that original vampires are not physical beings at all but etheric beings that feed of etheric energy of people at night. From there, the experiences were concretized into encounters with physical beings and we have the folklore.

    It would be nice if there were some more people here who could explain it from a vampire's point of view.
     
  15. path_of_one

    path_of_one Embracing the Mystery

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    Explain what from a vampire's point of view? And are you talking about human living vampires of various sorts, or are you wishing a mythic, immortal vampire would be available for an interview?

    I could do a fair job describing what human living vampires tell me they experience, but (unsurprisingly) I don't believe the mythic immortal ones exist. Perhaps there are spiritual entities that do vampiric things (i.e., feed off energy), but I don't think that's the same as the traditional vampire myth in Eastern Europe nor the modernized Lestat version.
     
  16. moseslmpg

    moseslmpg Well-Known Member

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    I mean, I wish there was any kind of vampire here and not just people who have researched it. I'm not saying it would clear everything up, but it would be interesting to see which interpretation they ascribe to and what they have to say about the others.

    Also, I don't think Greer was saying that they are the same, just that they started from these encounters. The original vampires are human spirits that have been turned vampiric, for whatever reasons. He goes into how this is related to the Eastern Europe myths and their misinterpretations. The Lestat-ish vampire just seems to be some kind of romanticization in the vein of Dracula, as is common with such subjects nowadays. Anyway, it's very interesting, what is in the vampire chapter in his book.
     
  17. path_of_one

    path_of_one Embracing the Mystery

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    Ah, I understand what you are getting at. There are a few good sites that you can browse and hear human living vampires discuss their own experiences and what their own theories about why they are the way they are.

    I would recommend DrinkDeeplyandDream.com - The Reality of the Modern Day Vampire :: Real Vampire information, support, and interaction. Forums, Chat, more! for some decent articles written from insider perspectives. The owner of the site and her boyfriend are both vampires. She gives some decent interviews on her own perspectives of her vampirism. The site's forum is also useful to find threads on vampires discussing why they feel they are vampires. Most of those threads (vampire origins/theories on causes) can be found in the "Real Vampires: Advanced Thoughts/Discussion" section, but you'll have to register to view it. You won't see the categories and threads if you are not a member. If you look at the site owner (MemoryandDream)'s photo, though, you will see what I mean when I say that you can't necessarily pick a vampire out of a crowd. Unless you are yourself a vampire (at least according to vampires), but that is another issue.

    The other website that is pretty good is Sanguinarius.org for Real Vampires, Blood Drinkers and Vampiric People. It also has lots of informative articles and a large forum with lots of topics. And I don't believe you have to register to view the threads.

    Generally we do not post other forums on this one, but given the specificity of the request and lack of overlap in subject matter, I figured it was easier to just redirect curious people to some sites best suited to answer this.
     
  18. Blackrose

    Blackrose Luciferian Witch

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    How very egotistical and condescending of you, not to mention ignorant and uneducated. I have been a Satanist since I was 16 years old and am damn year 40 now. I have moved on to Luciferian Witchcraft, some Hoodoo, and consider myself a Vampyre. Do you not think that there are a few of us "darker" folk that have kids too. I, myself have a daughter who is 16 and a step-daughter who is 14. You'd better bet nobody would get away with harming either. I'm not even going to bother commenting further to you. I can see you are a closed minded bigot.
     
  19. 17th Angel

    17th Angel לבעוט את התחת ולקחת שמות

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    Forty years old? And you think *keeps straight face* You are a vampire? Curious question.. Still live with your mom?
     
  20. Blackrose

    Blackrose Luciferian Witch

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