Z, you said, "...the soul as it is the body of the/from the seed [atom-self], the mind is in essence non physical and hence is both timeless [in base form] and not when encapsulated in form." --> I think there is more to what we did before we had human bodies, and there is more to what we will do after we finally set aside human bodies for the last time. Our time in human bodies is tiny and microscopic, compared to the age of the entire universe. "...how else can it be understood properly but for a connecting mind. fish are quite individual too, so here perhaps we can see levels of the idea, ranging from non-individualistic then in degrees to very individual as with humans. not only are we individuals but we are all very much more different than any animal." --> I think there is a missing link in this idea. I see our consciousness as having been animals at one time, and we have now been "promoted" to human. This makes more sense to me. "...i meant on this earth we are the highest, equally so the human form i believe to be the most dextrous." -->It makes me wonder about forms that exist on all levels all the way to the top. "...generally speaking - outside of this forum - don’t you find that there is a bit of a duel going on and that it drags people to one side or another as duels do?" --> I do. And I see it going on here at this Forum too.