What is the Christian perspective of Muhammed (pbuh)?

Discussion in 'Christianity' started by dailogue is the best, Jan 25, 2008.

  1. islamis4u

    islamis4u Vision To Spread Islam

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    The Bible ascribes sons by the tons to God. (a) 'Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the SON OF GOD." LUKE 3:38 (b) "That the SONS OF GOD saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took wives of all which they chose. ". . when the SONS OF GOD came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown." GENESIS 6:2 and 4 (c) " . . Thus- saith the Lord, Israel is MY SON even my FIRSTBORN." EXODUS 4:22 (d) " . . and Ephraim is my FIRSTBORN," JEREMIAH 31:9 (e) " . . Thou (o David) ART MY SON; this day have I (God) BEGOTTEN thee. " PSALMS 2:7 (TONS A ton is 2000 lbs weight, that is about a thousand kilograms.) ("FIRST BORN:" How can there be two "firstborns"?) ("BEGOTTEN" How can God beget David at the age of forty? "This day'?) (f) "For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the SONS OF GOD. ' ROMANS 8:14
     
  2. Pico

    Pico New Member

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    Yeah, being called sons of God is a blessing. It is reserved for people God chooses. But Jesus was different. He was God the Father's beloved Son.

    Those two are from the NIV.
    The NLT translation renders it like this:

    There is quite obviously a very distinct bond between God the Father and Jesus his Son.

    One of the cool things is, that when we have faith that God raised Jesus from the dead we literally become children of God.


    We are also made holy.


    Honestly, it really blows my mind how great God is :)
     
  3. islamis4u

    islamis4u Vision To Spread Islam

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    What you says nothing proves that Jesus(PBUH) is God.......... rather you are doing saying anything which you your ownself little confused... The only thing which makes Jesus(PBUH) God is term 'beloved'??? thats awkward....
     
  4. cyberpi

    cyberpi Interfaith Forums

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    Don't you think Jesus was also a believer??? If not then what was the purpose of being tempted in the desert?

    It also referred to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, which I was reading Jesus as saying that they were living somewhere else and that God was still their God at the time that God said it.

    If you were bound up and thrown in a prison, would the people you knew say that you were living, or that you were dead? If you left the prison would the people there say that you were living, or that you were dead? If someone comes and demolishes your house are you dead? How could you rebuild your house if you are really dead?

    If death means that the flesh is stopped like a broken machine... then sure, the text says that the flesh of Jesus was stopped. But the definition of living or of life in Jesus's words is much more than the flesh. Therefore so can the definition of death be much more than the physical body... and in fact in the Gospel Jesus used the word 'death' or 'dead' to mean something entirely different. People the world calls living, Jesus says they are dead... and people the world calls dead, Jesus says they are living. Jesus may not have flesh that you recognize today... but he is still living. I am not referring to 'in our memory' either.

    If the Qur'an is to be dismissed with the definition of words as the world has defined them... then the gospel itself has already been dismissed on the exact same grounds. Jesus called the dead living and the living dead... you might explain to me that he was talking about a spiritual death. So why then is the Qur'an held to a different standard?
     
  5. Pico

    Pico New Member

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    No. First I said that Jesus called God his Father, which made him equal with God (I kinda wondered a little off topic there too). He almost got murdered a few times for saying that.

    Then someone said that other people are called "sons of God." Angels are referred to this too in the Old Testament.

    But I replied saying that with Jesus it's a different kind of relationship between Him and God the Father, because He was God the Son.

    Jesus also says that "If you have seen me, you have seen the Father."

    "And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me." (Like He did in those quotes from my last post.)

    "...you are ready to kill me, because you have no room for my word. I am telling you what I have seen in the Father's presence."

    "Any sin or blasphemy against the Father or the Son can be forgiven." (Why would saying anything against Jesus be considered blasphemy?)
     
  6. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    Attacking one's belief in his own courtyard is not the wisest move to make...

    Your own "logic" has refining requirements.
     
  7. cyberpi

    cyberpi Interfaith Forums

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    Matthew 9:11 And when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto his disciples, "Why eateth your Master with publicans and sinners?"

    Disagreement is good food and a courtyard is a great place for a banquet.
     
  8. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    If this is the case, then Christ would have debated them 'til the cows came home...but he didn't. They weren't there for knowledge or enlightenment, just for themselves and their own agenda...
     
  9. cyberpi

    cyberpi Interfaith Forums

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    Then you belong to the courtyard of hypocrites, Quahom1. Go and dwell in the courtyard that you have called your own. Consider that yet another rebuke.
     
  10. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    1.a person who pretends to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that he or she does not actually possess, esp. a person whose actions belie stated beliefs.

    2.a person who feigns some desirable or publicly approved attitude, esp. one whose private life, opinions, or statements belie his or her public statements.

    Which is it?
     
  11. greymare

    greymare New Member

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    I thought name calling was a little beneath your intelligence, cyberpi, clearly, i was wrong
     
  12. cyberpi

    cyberpi Interfaith Forums

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    Shame on you for thinking that I was name calling.

    You serpents, you generation of vipers, how can you escape the judgment of hell?
     
  13. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    Easy. We accepted Christ's offer of salvation. Now he works with and through us, despite our "faults".

    And we smile and breath relief, because we can focus on what is really important in life.

    Wish you the same.

    v/r

    Q
     
  14. cyberpi

    cyberpi Interfaith Forums

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    Well then stop being a hypocrite and suffer others, and hear their judgment in your courtyard just as you wish them to hear your judgment in theirs. If you are focused on what is important then you will not be fretting your beliefs being 'attacked' by mere words.
     
  15. path_of_one

    path_of_one Embracing the Mystery

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    This seems to be becoming a popular refrain of yours, cyberpi. (1) I think we should all focus on the planks in our own eyes. (2) You sound like you're trying to be everyone's annoying, overbearing mother. You know, the one people let go to voicemail all the time.

    Who is anyone to cast the first stone?
     
  16. cyberpi

    cyberpi Interfaith Forums

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    Shame on you for publicly calling your mother annoying and overbearing here, and for letting her go to voicemail all the time. Honor your mother. Until you become a mother, and even after that... listen to your mother... for some of her words were from God. ;)

    You moderate your way, and I will moderate the overbearing moderators here in my way.

    I submit that you miss the meaning of Jesus there. If there is a plank in my eye, then hearing the words and judgment of others will help me to remove it. I surely won't be removing what I can't see... will I. Therefore I welcome the judgment and I ask you to accept the judgment of anyone and everyone on this thread here... just as you expect others like me to welcome yours.

    Take greymare and Quahom1's words for example... I do NOT consider their words to be stones. Nothing of the sort. If anything, they do me and themselves a service.

    When Jesus said, "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her." He was judging... real people... with words. Not stones... with words. He judged... with words. Likewise I welcome your judgment... I have learned from the exchange in ways that you may not even fathom. You will not stop me from providing my judgment, for I likewise seek the judgment of God.

    If I knew nothing of Islam, and the prophet Muhammed (pbuh), would my eyesight improve by telling Islam4U that it is not wise to bring his judgment here to my courtyard? Heck no. That is a threat. Most of you are ignorant of Islam... and that is your plank. Likewise I'm sure Islam4U doesn't understand your perspective of Jesus... and that is his plank. He is likewise here seeking your judgment.

    How do you like them apples moderators. Anyone who has judged me on this thread... I wish to reward. Whether I consider your judgment right or wrong, just or unjust, whether a fact or an assumption. If you use the words 'Shame on you' to me... then I wish to reward you even more. Whether I agree or disagree with your judgment, I want to hear it. With those in the USA, I will buy you dinner. With those in other countries, I will send you a token of my appreciation. I also especially want to hear on-topic judgments for the OP and Islam4U. Anyone who posts their heartfelt JUDGMENT on this thread, send me your address in PM, and I assure you that you will receive a token of my heartfelt thanks.
     
  17. Quahom1

    Quahom1 What was the question?

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    I read people's words every day Cyberpi. And even though I may not agree with them, I do not call them hypocrites. Nor to I attempt to "shame" them into thinking my way...

    That would be...rude.;)
     
  18. cyberpi

    cyberpi Interfaith Forums

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    What would Jesus do? What would a Christ-ian person do?

    Please don't tell me they would bring an M16 with an M203 grenade launcher to prevent the people from stoning the woman... or call in a GPS guided munition to do the people if an Ace picks up a stone.

    Now that would be... rude. ;)
     
  19. path_of_one

    path_of_one Embracing the Mystery

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    LOL- you are so off base about my mother. I said "everyone's mother" as in a general stereotype of the overbearing motherly hen. LOL You really do not read my posts very closely.

    My own mother is like a saint to me, and I've said so numerous times on CR. I can't imagine a more wise and lovely woman. We're best friends- my sister, my mother, me, and my aunt (my mother's sister). If you knew me better rather than assuming stuff about me, you'd know that. Heck, if you even read my posts you'd know that.

    But thanks anyway for the consistent "shaming." In the absence of an annoying and overbearing mother hen, I can get that fix here on CR from you. LOL

    OK. But I'm really at a loss as to how one can really feel shame based on a remark by some virtual stranger on the internet. It's really kind of amusing, your version of moderating.

    Actually, no, I don't expect others to welcome it. I don't have many expectations of other people. Secondly, I would put forth I am not missing the meaning. Jesus said do not judge, so you will not be judged (Luke 6:37). That's pretty basic language, to me. And here is the full text about the plank, which makes it pretty obvious that I'm doing a straight forward reading:
    Matthew 7:2-4 (New International Version)

    New International Version (NIV)

    2For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. 3"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4How can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye?

    Yep, and he said it is not our place to judge. Jesus could judge people, because in he is the appointed judge for humanity. He is, in Christianity, God (or, alternatively, a specially appointed judge and sacrifice by God).

    Of course I won't stop you. Only you can stop you. I'm just pointing out that your choice of how you mete out your judgment sounds mother hen-ish.

    There is a difference between judgement and discussion. Learning and condemnation. At least, I (and many others I know) see a difference.

    LOL Yum, crunchy. ;)

    Don't feed the moderators... LOL Couldn't help it- for some reason I got the picture in my head of one of those "Don't feed the bears/coyotes/deer" signs at the National Parks. I'm one of those folks that gets random visuals in relationship to stuff.

    Anyhoo, no bribes necessary. Fortunately for you, discussion forums is where everyone comes to discuss.

    But thank you again for dinner; it was tasty. And when you're 'round these parts again, perhaps we could all BBQ and go for a hike.
     
  20. 17th Angel

    17th Angel לבעוט את התחת ולקחת שמות

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    That statement troubles me.... I create a a kid with some girl in a hot one night passionate stand.... I also have a kid with my partner.... But hey I've only got one son..... That other kid? Yeah well I simply choose not to accept that kid as my son....

    I am sure the child welfare benefit agency will understand and let me off supporting that child...

    Being a son of god isn't a choice... Such as being born isn't a choice.... You simply are... There is no reservations... No guest list... No VIP list.... No one is any better nor of more value or level than the next man... Man is equal... Equality is a godly invention.... The opposite however is man made.... And quite alot of us thrive off that illusion huh? :) You may not believe in god, or have as complex and detailed understanding of god than someone else.. But pffftt.... Who cares that doesn't matter.... He believes in you... ;)
     

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