Sick of the bailouts.

Netti-Netti said:
Bill Clinton had a hand in all this because he signed the
Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

If Bush and his experts had a problem with it, they could have done something. They had 8 years.

In 2001 Bush announced his "every American in a home" policy. Nobody was even paying attention when this transpired. Apparently this policy was going to facilitate home ownership even for folks who couldn't afford it.

The Bush administration instituted a highly deregulated approach that created the conditions for predatory loan programs that no responsible government would have tolerated if it was genuinely interested in protecting the nation.

An average kid in junior high could have plotted out the trajectory for how this was going to play out. Where were the Bush economics experts?
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Indeed...and then we got bombed, and everything changed. Since then there have been 27 different attempts (that we publically know of), to kill us...I think the man has his hands full...

In the mean time...what are you doing to help matters? Besides my occupation, I spend time at the soup kitchen down town.

I think some one like you would do a similar thing? :eek:
 
Quahom1 said:
Maybe because the fundementals of the economy, are sound, else we'd be in a depression at 35% unemployment...(so much for the "bone head" response). :rolleyes:
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Q, I kinda think McCain knew he blew it with that comment which is why he barely allowed the ink to dry on its reporting before he rushed ideas out to the public.:) earl
 
earl said:
Q, I kinda think McCain knew he blew it with that comment which is why he barely allowed the ink to dry on its reporting before he rushed ideas out to the public.:) earl
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Mayhap you are quite correct ! But then again, "gimpy" might be smarter than any of us give him credit for...time will tell...:eek:
 
Netti-Netti said:
In short, there are no real solutions here. So far, all that has happened is that investors aren't freaking out as much as before - which of course could change as soon as the next financial company comes forward asking for a government bailout. There have been no real structural changes of any kind and none are in sight.
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I entirely agree. Just wasn't sure based on your first post if you were pondering as to why they did what they did. I'd heard it discussed extensively on NPR.

There is no way to win; our dollar will be devalued on the world market either way. Not sure if it is less devalued one way or the other.
 
path_of_one said:
I entirely agree. Just wasn't sure based on your first post if you were pondering as to why they did what they did. I'd heard it discussed extensively on NPR.

There is no way to win; our dollar will be devalued on the world market either way. Not sure if it is less devalued one way or the other.
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If the dollar were backed by the gold standard, yes (we don't have enough gold). But since it is backed on capital (Americans' abilities to produce), then the answer is no.

One of the reasons the US left the Gold Standard after Black Tuesday (29 October 1929).

12.6 million shares traded in less than an hour...
 
Netti-Netti said:
The bail out solution is very deceptive with respect to both of these intended goals. The bailout is going to mean a whole lot more government debt. That means the government will come up with more funny money. The effect of that will be a further devaluation of the dollar.


The bailout does not really help the confidence of foreign investors because it proves that the US financial industry is just a house of cards that can't stand on its own

In short, there are no real solutions here. So far, all that has happened is that investors aren't freaking out as much as before - which of course could change as soon as the next financial company comes forward asking for a government bailout. There have been no real structural changes of any kind and none are in sight.
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Unfortunately, I agree. I'm waiting for more shoes to drop. We'll keep temporarily patching stuff as it arises as debt mounts. Bush may yet end up a socialist before he leaves office.:) earl
 
earl said:
Unfortunately, I agree. I'm waiting for more shoes to drop. We'll keep temporarily patching stuff as it arises as debt mounts. Bush may yet end up a socialist before he leaves office.:) earl
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End up as one? Where have you been? He's been a socialist from the beginning!
 
Dogbrain said:
End up as one? Where have you been? He's been a socialist from the beginning!
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Too true. Unfortunately, his motto is something like "Squeeze every dollar from Main St. and give it to the corporations and already rich."

Sadly, socialism doesn't have to be for the ordinary people.
 
another slam dunk in the making

Without any formal assessment of the situation, the speedy debt deal is effectuated. They'll be phoning in the order. Something like: " Heya, hows about you print me up a trillion dollars of funny money to keep them investors from freakin'! "

Only one man will be in charge of those funds: Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson. Who will supervise him?
 
Re: another slam dunk in the making

...I think the man (Bush) has his hands full...
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This is why the President delegates to professionals who do have time.


Netti-Netti said:
Only one man will be in charge of those funds: Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson. Who will supervise him?
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We probably shouldn't make too much of this, but Mr. Paulson is former CEO of Goldman Sachs, which is now being investigated by the FBI for subprime hankypanky. From a 2007 article:
Goldman Sachs was one of the top 10 sellers of C.M.O.’s for the last two and a half years. From the evidence I see, Goldman was doing this for years. It might have sold very roughly $100 billion of the stuff in that period, according to ABAlert. Goldman was doing it on a scale of billions even when Henry M. Paulson Jr., the current Treasury secretary, led the firm.
​
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/02/business/02every.html?pagewanted=print

Interesting that after he became Treasury Secretary, Mr. Paulson never saw a need to address an issue that had been directly relevant to the operations of his former company even when he was its CEO!

Have a great day.
 
Face it, it was and is greed and John Q. Public that is at most fault and at most risk.

You can blame all you want mortgage companies for selling loans to people who can't afford them. But why did people buy? Why did they buy houses at inflated prices? Why did they take mortgages they couldn't afford? Why did they falsify info to get the mortgage? Why are they so financially irresponsible to not get a lawyer, not read the contract and sign their lives away on for 99% of them the biggest expense of their life?? GREED. Greed on the mortgage company, greed on the folks that bought it.

ARMs adjustable rate mortgages, interest only loans, negative mortgages, they've been around for a long time, but greed jumped in and everyone got over extended.

So the real estate boom made a correction, which is common, but folks couldn't handle the correction and their interest rate going up simultaneously and their pie eyed idea of the future...

Then once real estate started having issues JQP got scared and the slow down started.

Same thing in the stock market. Used to be you couldn't play unless you bought a block (100 shares) and then you paid a broker his fee, etc so only the financially savvy were in the game. Then came ameritrade and online purchasing of one, ten or one thousand shares of anything. And JQP got in the game, along with our 401Ks and directable retirement programs in mutual funds we all became experts and started playing where we don't belong. So what happens, when stocks are going thru the roof JQP is buying trying to ride the wave and in order to buy, someone must sell and the financially savvy are taking profits and selling...and when it collapses JQP is selling but in order to sell someone has to buy, so the financially savvy are buying... Rule of the game in the stock market, as the financially savvy know, buy low-sell high. What does JQP do, buy high-sell low and whine about what happenned to my money and why are those damn rich guys making out???

So our illustrious Conservative Republicans have now put forth the most socialist program since the New Deal and are attempting to use treasury dollars to bail out John Q. Public and save the nations banking system from collapse.

We need financial education in schools to the point that every child is very leary of revolving credit and dumping savings into the stock market. Because it is obvious that collectivley their parents don't know this stuff.
 
wil said:
Face it, it was and is greed and John Q. Public that is at most fault and at most risk.

You can blame all you want mortgage companies for selling loans to people who can't afford them. But why did people buy? Why did they buy houses at inflated prices? Why did they take mortgages they couldn't afford? Why did they falsify info to get the mortgage? Why are they so financially irresponsible to not get a lawyer, not read the contract and sign their lives away on for 99% of them the biggest expense of their life?? GREED. Greed on the mortgage company, greed on the folks that bought it.

ARMs adjustable rate mortgages, interest only loans, negative mortgages, they've been around for a long time, but greed jumped in and everyone got over extended.

So the real estate boom made a correction, which is common, but folks couldn't handle the correction and their interest rate going up simultaneously and their pie eyed idea of the future...

Then once real estate started having issues JQP got scared and the slow down started.

Same thing in the stock market. Used to be you couldn't play unless you bought a block (100 shares) and then you paid a broker his fee, etc so only the financially savvy were in the game. Then came ameritrade and online purchasing of one, ten or one thousand shares of anything. And JQP got in the game, along with our 401Ks and directable retirement programs in mutual funds we all became experts and started playing where we don't belong. So what happens, when stocks are going thru the roof JQP is buying trying to ride the wave and in order to buy, someone must sell and the financially savvy are taking profits and selling...and when it collapses JQP is selling but in order to sell someone has to buy, so the financially savvy are buying... Rule of the game in the stock market, as the financially savvy know, buy low-sell high. What does JQP do, buy high-sell low and whine about what happenned to my money and why are those damn rich guys making out???

So our illustrious Conservative Republicans have now put forth the most socialist program since the New Deal and are attempting to use treasury dollars to bail out John Q. Public and save the nations banking system from collapse.

We need financial education in schools to the point that every child is very leary of revolving credit and dumping savings into the stock market. Because it is obvious that collectivley their parents don't know this stuff.
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In other words, we pay for it now...or our children will pay even more for it later...
 
Quahom1 said:
In other words, we pay for it now...or our children will pay even more for it later...
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Clearly either way.

I'm not savvy enough to know that what the powers that be are attempting will work or not. In a few years they'll either be geniuses or idiots. The big thing is that we as a people need to quit running at every scare...it is our flight/stampede whilst the media moans that exacerbates the issue.
 
Fortunately only about 1/3 third of our retirement savings are in mutual funds. Didn't McCain suggest awhile back that one should allow Medicare retirement plans to include the option of privatized stock market investing?;):) earl
 
earl said:
Fortunately only about 1/3 third of our retirement savings are in mutual funds. Didn't McCain suggest awhile back that one should allow Medicare retirement plans to include the option of privatized stock market investing?;):) earl
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Indeed, and mutual funds are a smart "moderate" investment. When stocks drop, bonds pick up and vice versa. It's a steady growth plan that makes the most sense.
 
wil said:
Clearly either way.

I'm not savvy enough to know that what the powers that be are attempting will work or not. In a few years they'll either be geniuses or idiots. The big thing is that we as a people need to quit running at every scare...it is our flight/stampede whilst the media moans that exacerbates the issue.
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Wall Street told the government "give us the money and go away". Not a great start...

the bill itself is only three pages long, not a great deal of thought gone into it...

idiots over geniouses at this time...
 
earl said:
Fortunately only about 1/3 third of our retirement savings are in mutual funds. Didn't McCain suggest awhile back that one should allow Medicare retirement plans to include the option of privatized stock market investing?;):) earl
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Funny thing is it is the money market funds that are going to need bolstering. In order to entice folks over to the interest rates of Xbanks money market rates they have invested in junk bonds, futures and housing packages...those money market accounts will be included in the bail outs.
 
wil said:
Funny thing is it is the money market funds that are going to need bolstering. In order to entice folks over to the interest rates of Xbanks money market rates they have invested in junk bonds, futures and housing packages...those money market accounts will be included in the bail outs.
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Depends on what the Mutual fund contains, no? Munincipal bonds and energy stocks, laced with agricultural and stable core corporations, would be very wise to invest in.

Of course as with any investment, past performance does not guarantee future prospectives. That is why there is the element of chance versus the potential for high return.
 
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