radarmark
Quaker-in-the-Making
If one must have a master or a guru or one must study, Laozi, Huineng, and Gautama could not be mystics. That just does not make a lot of sense to me.
About mystics
- Thread starter Thomas
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taijasi
Gnōthi seauton
The Buddha had no bhikkus? I'm confused. I don't follow you at all.
I'd sum things up according to the Cheers I just watched. I saw the last two minutes, nothing more, so I have no idea how the rest of the show goes ...
... but Woody is in the bar, pretty much alone, and Robert Eurich (?) walks in. I don't even remember who this famous bloke is supposed to be; maybe you all do? Anyway, he's some kinda celebrity.
Woody yells back to Rebecca that he's there, and she tells him to quit screwing around. I think he yells it to other folks, and they are just as dubious. Sam finally walks downstairs as Woody's heading out the door, apparently invited by the celebrity to come to a party or something. Sam is carrying a case of beer, so he does not see Robert Eurich, although he stands right there at the DOOR.
So there is another joke, Sam tells Woody: Sure, go ahead and enjoy the party ... kind of laughing, I mean after all, Woody's obviously high or something, right?
No. He just subscribes to a different tradition, believes in different magical words and silly dances, all that rigamarole. Purple robes, red robes, yellow robes, blue; eats dandelions, not roses, and what do you do? blah blah blah
Woody goes up the steps to the street with Bob Eurich, Sam looks out the window and pauses for a second, then shakes his head ... Naaaa, couldn't be!
Pardon my intrusion, and PLEASE, do make the most of it ... Enjoy your discussion! I just don't care for Krishnamurti, or his Pathless Land of Truth; but I have made that clear elsewhere. I've also made my own beliefs fairly clear on another thread, on occultists, so I don't need to restate that here. It did, however, strike a nerve, so I do apologize if I was a bit hasty.
Like I said, what you don't know not only won't hurt you, in many cases (otherwise quite the reverse) ... it may help more than you realize (or, again, perhaps the reverse). I only hope for the speedy enlightenment of all the intellectual masturbators, and I gladly include myself in that lot, but in MY book, what's good for the goose is good for the gander. We may believe differently, but because I believe in Gnosis, it's like either acknowledging an elliptical earth, and black holes at the center of every galaxy, or it's denial. In these cases, you can argue it makes no difference.
Really? It makes no difference whether you believe in a Christ within? Sure it does. It also matters whether you do like to stroke the old mental cucumber, and ascribe all this business to some theological nuance, or whether you will do your best to try and MEET A PERSON at this level of intersecting Essential Divinity, say in the grocery store, in an AA meeting, or in the pew beside you. Keep up the noodle-stroking, and I say you may do no one any real harm. Yes, I should know
On the other hand (ha!) ... when you aren't so determined to reach the point of orgiastic explosion, it's just possible, I have discovered, to SEE what Christ meant, to KNOW what St. Paul sought to elicit [literally, as well as in your mind] ... and even to join in with the effort. OR, we can always keep up the tail-chasing, such that every additional word I type - is wasted effort.
Glad to know - that yours, aren't! [wasted words, wasted effort]
radarmark
Quaker-in-the-Making
Andrew. I have met several that I believe are of the caliber of soul you focus on. None said (to me) "follow me". Instead (per the sudden school) they said "keep focusing". Maybe in the great chain of being I am on rung one, that does not bother me.
Bikkus are who breathed in Gautama. He himself had no master, nor did Huineng. I believe it only takes one case of showing a Tatha-gatha who did not have a sifu or roshi (in the flesh--and from the Pali Canon, I see no evidence of anything beyond the Buddah mind, Busho or Tatha-gatha-garbha).
It depends on what you mean by a Christ within. Christ, the Logos, is the Light Within, that which enables us to have numinous ("mysical") experiences. And (IMHO) the G!d Within is that which is (or fills) those experiences. Like I said, this is just my path and I am only comfortable discussing it with Friends in Meeting. If that is acceptable to how you see it, we are saying the same thing.
"Mental masturbation" or "monkey-mind" or "over-intellectualization"--well, it is my greatest sin (even greater than killing in the heat of battle, I think). I am not a joiner. As some of my Native American friends have told me, "if Christ appeared to you in the flesh now, like Thomas you would ask to probe the wounds, and even then you probably would not follow". I can live with that. Surrender to something other than the beyond (the numinous experience) just does not appeal to me. I do not do dogma or authority well (Class of '68 Berkeley High School).
Bikkus are who breathed in Gautama. He himself had no master, nor did Huineng. I believe it only takes one case of showing a Tatha-gatha who did not have a sifu or roshi (in the flesh--and from the Pali Canon, I see no evidence of anything beyond the Buddah mind, Busho or Tatha-gatha-garbha).
It depends on what you mean by a Christ within. Christ, the Logos, is the Light Within, that which enables us to have numinous ("mysical") experiences. And (IMHO) the G!d Within is that which is (or fills) those experiences. Like I said, this is just my path and I am only comfortable discussing it with Friends in Meeting. If that is acceptable to how you see it, we are saying the same thing.
"Mental masturbation" or "monkey-mind" or "over-intellectualization"--well, it is my greatest sin (even greater than killing in the heat of battle, I think). I am not a joiner. As some of my Native American friends have told me, "if Christ appeared to you in the flesh now, like Thomas you would ask to probe the wounds, and even then you probably would not follow". I can live with that. Surrender to something other than the beyond (the numinous experience) just does not appeal to me. I do not do dogma or authority well (Class of '68 Berkeley High School).
Bhaktajan II
Hare Krishna Yogi
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How Long did WWII Last?
remember: The answer must include parties of the Axis that had been inflicting populations with warring behavior by national armies.
The Second Sino-Japanese War (July 7, 1937 – September 9, 1945) was a military conflict fought primarily between the Republic of China and the Empire of Japan. From 1937 to 1941, China fought Japan with some economic help from Germany (the Soviet Union (1937–1940) and the United.
After the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor (1941), the war merged into the greater conflict of World War II as a major front of what is broadly known as the Pacific War. The Second Sino-Japanese War was the largest Asian war in the 20th century. It also made up more than 50% of the casualties in the Pacific War if the 1937–1941 period is taken into account.
Although the two countries had fought intermittently since 1931, total war started in earnest in 1937 and ended only with the surrender of Japan in 1945.
The war was the result of a decades-long Japanese imperialist policy aiming to dominate China politically and militarily and to secure its vast raw material reserves and other economic resources, particularly food and labour.
Before 1937, China and Japan fought in small, localized engagements, so-called "incidents". In 1931, the Japanese invasion of Manchuria by Japan's Kwantung Army followed the Mukden Incident.
The last of these incidents was the Marco Polo Bridge Incident of 1937, marking the beginning of total war between the two countries.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Sino-Japanese_War
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And:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korea_under_Japanese_rule
Korea was under Japanese rule as part of Japan's 35-year imperialist expansion (29 August 1910 to 15 August 1945). Japanese rule ended in 1945 shortly after the Japanese defeat in World War II.
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Apparently, some entity such as Hollywood or fiscal accountants or advertisement barkers (newpapers) inform us when the War Starts and when it ended.
There's no business like show business I know ... everything about it is appealling ...
remember: The answer must include parties of the Axis that had been inflicting populations with warring behavior by national armies.
The Second Sino-Japanese War (July 7, 1937 – September 9, 1945) was a military conflict fought primarily between the Republic of China and the Empire of Japan. From 1937 to 1941, China fought Japan with some economic help from Germany (the Soviet Union (1937–1940) and the United.
After the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor (1941), the war merged into the greater conflict of World War II as a major front of what is broadly known as the Pacific War. The Second Sino-Japanese War was the largest Asian war in the 20th century. It also made up more than 50% of the casualties in the Pacific War if the 1937–1941 period is taken into account.
Although the two countries had fought intermittently since 1931, total war started in earnest in 1937 and ended only with the surrender of Japan in 1945.
The war was the result of a decades-long Japanese imperialist policy aiming to dominate China politically and militarily and to secure its vast raw material reserves and other economic resources, particularly food and labour.
Before 1937, China and Japan fought in small, localized engagements, so-called "incidents". In 1931, the Japanese invasion of Manchuria by Japan's Kwantung Army followed the Mukden Incident.
The last of these incidents was the Marco Polo Bridge Incident of 1937, marking the beginning of total war between the two countries.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Sino-Japanese_War
&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
And:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korea_under_Japanese_rule
Korea was under Japanese rule as part of Japan's 35-year imperialist expansion (29 August 1910 to 15 August 1945). Japanese rule ended in 1945 shortly after the Japanese defeat in World War II.
&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
Apparently, some entity such as Hollywood or fiscal accountants or advertisement barkers (newpapers) inform us when the War Starts and when it ended.
There's no business like show business I know ... everything about it is appealling ...
taijasi
Gnōthi seauton
radarmark,
Thanks for the clarification ... though totally voluntary on your part, it's quite helpful for me. I should pay more attention to the Intro forums!
I'm with you now on what you're saying about the Buddha, or Christ, or others of like mind. I do believe in something beyond Nirvana, or *Maha Para Nirvana* ... yet I think it will be awhile before we get there - even in intellectual understanding (the Noetic: which often, though not always, precedes a direct experience of what lies beyond). I've posted on this elsewhere, quoting from an author who has experience that I don't.
It seems to me that the harder we try to nail down & define the Christ within, or Buddha Nature the more easily it eludes our grasp - even intellectually. It is a bit like the fish trying to swallow the ocean, and this (except in certain fables) will never occur.
Namaskar
Thanks for the clarification ... though totally voluntary on your part, it's quite helpful for me. I should pay more attention to the Intro forums!
I'm with you now on what you're saying about the Buddha, or Christ, or others of like mind. I do believe in something beyond Nirvana, or *Maha Para Nirvana* ... yet I think it will be awhile before we get there - even in intellectual understanding (the Noetic: which often, though not always, precedes a direct experience of what lies beyond). I've posted on this elsewhere, quoting from an author who has experience that I don't.
It seems to me that the harder we try to nail down & define the Christ within, or Buddha Nature the more easily it eludes our grasp - even intellectually. It is a bit like the fish trying to swallow the ocean, and this (except in certain fables) will never occur.
Namaskar
radarmark
Quaker-in-the-Making
“It seems to me that the harder we try to nail down & define the Christ within, or Buddha Nature the more easily it eludes our grasp - even intellectually. It is a bit like the fish trying to swallow the ocean, and this (except in certain fables) will never occur.”
That is why I am a "Sudden Schooler". I used to make up the most outrageous conspiracy theories (several of which became web-fantasy). Like my nephew and I had a Kennedy assassination scenario with five hit squads (one even under the manhole cover). After McVeigh made his (in my opinion, neo-psychotic) allegations about the million Russians in Canada, ready-made concentration camps, and UN homing devices under HMMWVs (he even broke into a Fort and checked for this), Jerry and I said "never again".
Hard for me to keep that over-intellectualization of mine under control.
That is why I am a "Sudden Schooler". I used to make up the most outrageous conspiracy theories (several of which became web-fantasy). Like my nephew and I had a Kennedy assassination scenario with five hit squads (one even under the manhole cover). After McVeigh made his (in my opinion, neo-psychotic) allegations about the million Russians in Canada, ready-made concentration camps, and UN homing devices under HMMWVs (he even broke into a Fort and checked for this), Jerry and I said "never again".
Hard for me to keep that over-intellectualization of mine under control.