Fear of God

[Lunitik]

i'm sure i know a joke about this.

"what did the first fundamentalist say to the second ?

I am right you are wrong

No I am right you are wrong "

seriously though they could almost be the same person. maybe they are

How can you call me a fundamentalist?

It is defined as "strict adherence to a specific doctrine", I have no doctrine.

In fact I go on saying you cannot find truth in any book, that life is the guru, that you cannot learn what truth is, it must be experienced.

Tell me, how is this fundamentalism?

I say truth is here now, scriptures talk about something there then. Each can help you along the way, but none contain truth because truth cannot be spoken. Jesus comes close if you have ears to hear, for only the poetry of a parable can point with any accuracy - yet his meaning is frequently missed.

I only implore all to encounter and know truth directly - this is the true revelation.

 

[Lunitik]

Fear of God is "Avoiding the facing of the Fact that we are aware of when that God-chagrin is bearing down upon on one's conscience"

This fear is damaging, for it will cause you to run from the encounter.

I have said fear is something only the mind experiences, yet you can watch this struggle and remain utterly uninvolved because you are not the mind. This is the purpose of things like mantra and yoga, it is to create some space between the being and the mind. In meditation, this space becomes even more distinct... as I'm sure you have encountered.

The heart will only embrace God, for it has longed to face Him ever since it has become separate. Indeed, that space between it and mind is a drawing closer to God. In truth, it has never left God, yet it has given power to beliefs which are otherwise, it is merely an undoing of this so the heart is perfectly comfortable with it. The whole practice is merely to get the mind out of the way so it does not interfere, without its distraction everything happens naturally because it is already the case in reality. It is only necessary to remember it is so, but we have invested much in the fallacy we experience, all of this has to be overcome - but viewing it as a fight gives it more power. It is difficult, yet such a simple thing, you just have to find out what is actually the case without any belief. It is not coincidence that a Krishna devotee sees Krishna, a Jesus devotee sees Jesus, you are still in illusion - simply find out who is observing it all.

This one was in Jesus and Krishna and Buddha and Muhammad, this one is within everyone. Find out who it is, this is the only way to know who you truly are. Intellect cannot know it, for it is unfathomable, you must encounter it for yourself. This is exactly that which I say cannot be contained in a book, for it is life itself. All else is mere illusion, for until you realize what you are how can you look on the world rightly?

 

[Princely]

No, scripture tells the future, what will happen when everyone serves the Lord.

The Lord says this; "I will purify the lips of the people so they will all call upon the name of the Lord to serve Him with one accord."

"I'm going to make right a measuring line and justice a level".

 

[Etu Malku]

No, scripture tells the future, what will happen when everyone serves the Lord.

The Lord says this; "I will purify the lips of the people so they will all call upon the name of the Lord to serve Him with one accord."

"I'm going to make right a measuring line and justice a level".

I'm certain most scriptures attempt prophecy, Revelations certainly does.
And they do it with guilt and fear.

 

[Lunitik]

No, scripture tells the future, what will happen when everyone serves the Lord.

The Lord says this; "I will purify the lips of the people so they will all call upon the name of the Lord to serve Him with one accord."

"I'm going to make right a measuring line and justice a level".

Do you realize that the future is only meaningful in the mind? Believing you know what will occur in the future gives a certain comfort to the mind, for now it can imagine what will happen after it dies. The future has no meaning for the heart, it is simply unborn, only the present is ever alive.

When you trust the present completely, future and past never come in, the problem is prophecy is often self fulfilling. There are movements in the world today seeking to create the destruction they believe will happen, what if it is not how it was intended to happen? Man has constantly been insisting that these prophecies will occur in their lifetime, many have spent their entire lives trying to figure out what the prophecies mean...

Even Jesus has said he does not know, yet his followers insist they do... strange.

 

[Lunitik]

I'm certain most scriptures attempt prophecy, Revelations certainly does.
And they do it with guilt and fear.

Revelation is actually the enlightenment of John, apocalypse means the lifting of a veil - it is the same as waking up in the Buddhist sense, or liberation in the Hindu sense. It is not prophecy at all, but man does not understand its real meaning. I just hope we don't destroy this earth before figuring this out.

 

[Lunitik]

The man who is truly surrendered is not concerned what might happen in the future, for he knows all will happen as it must. Whether he makes it through whatever happens or it brings this life to an end, it does not matter for he knows that which is eternal in him, he knows that cannot die.

This is something which Krishna tries to convey in the Gita, we are simply playing a part, the enjoyment is in seeing how that plays out. If you become too involved, it will cease being enjoyable, you have to be detached to really soak it in. This is why man is so addicted to television, but in truth this is the way life itself is: the witness is perpetually watching life play out.

What interest can there be in a movie when you already know the outcome?

 

[Lunitik]

Of course, mind does not enjoy surprises, it wants to know everything, it wants to be prepared for all possible outcomes. It destroys what is beautiful about life, it is hardly surprising that the more we turn to it the more depressed people become. At least in the past they could make believe certain things, but all logic comes to an inevitable conclusion: death.

It is because mind itself understands it cannot exist for long, yet this conclusion brings about the seeking for something which cannot die so it is perfectly right. All disasters and war is to drive this same conclusion home, when there is more war in the world, it simply creates the environment for more to wake up. There is nothing else in it, it just provides all with a slap, a bucket of cold water is poured on everyone... existence forces us to look at life more closely.

This gives an insight into why all is already perfect... something any sage will insist is the case. It is because everything is constantly moving towards the same realization.

Some simply move ahead of the others, but all share this destiny.

 

[NiceCupOfTea]

How can you call me a fundamentalist?

It is defined as "strict adherence to a specific doctrine", I have no doctrine.

In fact I go on saying you cannot find truth in any book, that life is the guru, that you cannot learn what truth is, it must be experienced.

Tell me, how is this fundamentalism?

I say truth is here now, scriptures talk about something there then. Each can help you along the way, but none contain truth because truth cannot be spoken. Jesus comes close if you have ears to hear, for only the poetry of a parable can point with any accuracy - yet his meaning is frequently missed.

I only implore all to encounter and know truth directly - this is the true revelation.

simple a fundamentalist in my book is someone who is very rigid and fixed in their thinking, and you are very rigid and fixed in your thinking. Therefore you are a fundamentalist IMO.

 

[Lunitik]

simple a fundamentalist in my book is someone who is very rigid and fixed in their thinking, and you are very rigid and fixed in your thinking. Therefore you are a fundamentalist IMO.

My whole approach is to cease thought, so this is a very strange statement indeed.

Once thought is silenced, now you enter the heart, and it is from the heart which I speak.

The heart is not rigid, but certainly I am insistent on entering it.

This is what you fight when you fight my words though, for it is in the heart that God resides. You are as the fallen angels, you want to be distinct from God, you place your will above his, and so you will suffer - for will is only desire by a different name.

I understand this is impossible, I try to break down the illusions which make it seem so.

 

[Princely]

Do you realize that the future is only meaningful in the mind? Believing you know what will occur in the future gives a certain comfort to the mind, for now it can imagine what will happen after it dies. The future has no meaning for the heart, it is simply unborn, only the present is ever alive.

When you trust the present completely, future and past never come in, the problem is prophecy is often self fulfilling. There are movements in the world today seeking to create the destruction they believe will happen, what if it is not how it was intended to happen? Man has constantly been insisting that these prophecies will occur in their lifetime, many have spent their entire lives trying to figure out what the prophecies mean...

Even Jesus has said he does not know, yet his followers insist they do... strange.

Don't you see how you twist the words of Jesus because you do not understand scripture and the power of God. He said he did not know the exact time when the end would come but he did predict he would be handed over to sinners and other prophesies.What I told you was scripture from the lord and He will make it happen with or without you.

 

[Lunitik]

Don't you see how you twist the words of Jesus because you do not understand scripture and the power of God. He said he did not know the exact time when the end would come but he did predict he would be handed over to sinners and other prophesies.What I told you was scripture from the lord and He will make it happen with or without you.

I have twisted nothing, and I know the power of God quite well.

I simply say Jesus is not God, but rather God is within him - it is God which is Christ, the anointing which unveils the Holy Spirit, it is this same Spirit of God which resides in each of us. Without this, Jesus is nobody, yet the Christians worship the man without understanding this.

Realize it is by God's power, that Jesus himself has merely realized his very powerlessness, and this is the surrender he teaches. You must hate your own life, you must drop everything you think you are to find that Christ within. You must accept God's will, and drop your own completely. Then you are perfect as the father is perfect, for now there is no distinction at all.

This is the great conclusion of Shankara, the father of the Advaita school: that Atman - the soul - is not distinct from Brahman - the spirit. Merge them and oneness is known, for anatta is the realization - that soul has never been real, there is only God.

Even in Catholicism, this is accepted truth, that eventually the soul must merge with God. In Christianity, though, everything is done after physical death... why the delay? It is because this represents extinction of the personal being, yet it is only illusion and desire which makes it so in the first place...

Find what is really the case!

 

[Lunitik]

Every religion says this, so few understand what is meant.

Every drop must eventually return to the ocean, why delay the inevitable?

 

[Etu Malku]

My whole approach is to cease thought, so this is a very strange statement indeed.

Once thought is silenced, now you enter the heart, and it is from the heart which I speak.

And what exactly is 'heart' to you? Why and how from silencing thought do enter this? How do you speak from this?

I understand this is impossible, I try to break down the illusions which make it seem so.

You are, are you?

 

[Lunitik]

You will only avoid experiencing life as the ocean, its sheer vastness, its total power, it is available to you. First you must cease life as the drop, you must surrender what you are now to know what you have always been.

You are the alpha and omega, yet you are convinced it is not so.

 

[NiceCupOfTea]

to some people God, Allah whatever you want to call it is a mythical creature that will punish them in the afterlife for being naughty, and if thats true then it would be wise to fear this creature, perhaps these believers create this demonic entity with the power of their own belief so for them its true they will be punished by this creature of their own creation.

however in islam and Christianity "the fear of God" is supposed to be more of a reverential awe, rather than what we know as fear today.

 

[Lunitik]

And what exactly is 'heart' to you? Why and how from silencing thought do enter this? How do you speak from this?

Heart means center, it is here that the Higher Self can be found. If you will look into chakras, it is the fourth, and thus where the lower and upper three meet. If you have experienced oneness, what has actually happened is that this chakra has opened.

It is not really the silencing of the mind which helps, but various schools teach mastering the mind to see that you are not it. It is the common situation that the Self becomes identified with the mind, and this is what is called the Lower Self. When you can move this into the heart, now the Higher Self is there - in truth, it is the one same Self, just now it is more aware of its true nature.

When you reside in this center, when the mind is no more the master, you begin to tap into the universal consciousness - what you have called universal unconsciousness, yet it is still part of awareness that it is unconscious. The further you go into this, the simpler it becomes to stay there. The words do not actually come from that place though, the words are an attempt to address what has arisen there in language.

This is the problem all who have known run into: there is a desire to express, yet all expressions fall short, no words are adequate. It is the only way to convey though, and it is inevitably going to be confused when heard by others. This is why many live in seclusion, they have realized the impossibility and stopped trying to express it, yet others persist and hope at least a few can understand.

If even one can hear, it is worth it.

 

[Lunitik]

It is not that identification moves to the heart, I have said that wrong.

It is that false identifications have dropped, now you enter the heart naturally.

Truth is a byproduct of dropping the false, it is the only thing which cannot be dropped, but no fallacy can stand any honest inspection.

Many react negatively to this, it is because they can see how impotent the mind is when inspected. If it drops, what will remain? They cannot understand that it is just the dropping of false beliefs and perspectives, what you are has empowered the mind, you have made it the master.

You simply need to see who you are.

 

[Lunitik]

Becoming aware of that which is aware of all things, that which is the true self, this is enlightenment, this is self-realization.

This is the goal, if you want to call it such. Now you understand omnipresence, now you understand omniscience, you learn to be careful of omnipotence. These are all qualities of the Self, by whatsoever name you wish to call it, it is simply Truth.

No one can have a monopoly on the Self, no words can express the Self, everything is merely an expression of it... what to say of the expresser? Every attempt will limit it, for whatever position you take, it can only be half. You can only point someone inwardly and say "it is there, look yourself".

Is there any intrinsic quality within? Is there any form there? All you will find if you go deeper is light. Deeper still, you simply melt into the light. This cannot be your purpose though, the purpose is only to surrender the mind, to utterly let go. This is the key to finding the Self, and all have said this is so. Do not mistake what is being let go to be your true self though, only that which watches it is the real you.

Again you can see whether this can go anywhere, can you drop it? If you can, this is not yet it. It is the one who has observed this even...

Go deeper.

 

[Princely]

I have twisted nothing, and I know the power of God quite well.

I simply say Jesus is not God, but rather God is within him - it is God which is Christ, the anointing which unveils the Holy Spirit, it is this same Spirit of God which resides in each of us. Without this, Jesus is nobody, yet the Christians worship the man without understanding this.

Realize it is by God's power, that Jesus himself has merely realized his very powerlessness, and this is the surrender he teaches. You must hate your own life, you must drop everything you think you are to find that Christ within. You must accept God's will, and drop your own completely. Then you are perfect as the father is perfect, for now there is no distinction at all.

This is the great conclusion of Shankara, the father of the Advaita school: that Atman - the soul - is not distinct from Brahman - the spirit. Merge them and oneness is known, for anatta is the realization - that soul has never been real, there is only God.

Even in Catholicism, this is accepted truth, that eventually the soul must merge with God. In Christianity, though, everything is done after physical death... why the delay? It is because this represents extinction of the personal being, yet it is only illusion and desire which makes it so in the first place...

Find what is really the case!

Once you walk in the light of the Lord you will see His face and know His love.

As it is you are only in the dark because your heart is filled with the light of man. The flesh is useless, the words I spoke to you are spirit and life.

If only you recognized Gods gift and who it is who's posting to you, you would ask him and he would give you living water.

Anyone who drinks the water I give him will never become thirsty, the water I give him will be like a fountain inside him rising up to provide eternal life.

The Lord sent me , we are One. I am son of man and yes my Father is greater than I.