Death is an illusion

[iBrian]

Your diagnosis is so far off the mark, but you do have that ever impressive BS going for you. This is exactly my point there are those that can find time and can experience the veil and then you have those that cannot, clearly the reason for the BS in neurotheology. A degree I don't think qualifies you for much more then the paper it is written on when it comes to things that have to be experienced, this is why you will never figure it out. For thousands of years Christianity has been medicating and killing those that can figure things out, this has changed our evolution and I believed dumbed down the world greatly. how sad. The reason people get so badly done is because you try to become yourself first and this is when he starts to rip you apart so you do not figure him out. You will also see that people that are or were badly done, life traumas tend to be the ones that suffer this problem most.

There is a god mind and it is here to judge you like it or not. I could go on for hours about this but I have no want to.

Powessy

This sort of personal attack is not welcome here. I would have removed it but it has already been replied to and discussed, so there's little point removing it now. Either way, a reminder to all to discuss the posts, not the poster.

In that regard, while powessy's story is interesting, I would rather direct the focus away from one individual's experience and make it inclusively wider. After all, with thousands of years of written spiritual experience, I would expect there to be much more to be said on the matter.

 

[Alif Balaam Yashin]

Neither of us is in any position to assess what this actually means.

Why not? Do you have a degree in Neuroscience? Have you spent 40 years in the Occult? Have you written four books about this stuff?

 

[TheLightWithin]

Why not? Do you have a degree in Neuroscience? Have you spent 40 years in the Occult? Have you written four books about this stuff?

When he first presented it, you made it a mental health issue.

Also, who assesses something like this over the internet?

Also, what's with the feisty attitude? Who needs it!

 

[powessy]

I don't know of what you speak...but this part is worth exploring as to how it relates to a miscarriage or abortion. When either of these runs out of time...is there a difference as far as the being?

The problem is that you need to become yourself everything here or you will have to become something again, you have to accrue time in life to get time after this life time to figure yourself out. What I am saying is the soul never figured itself out it will find time in another womb or reincarnation right away. I remember time in the womb, my first memory was dark shadows the space was big and dark and i was scared. I know that there was space all around me and time was in jumps as i would awaken and then like disappear, I think this was due to me becoming myself. They say you have to become yourself many times to become yourself all the time.

I know minds teach us in the womb so I often wonder when I was at the earliest time figuring myself out.

Powessy

 

[powessy]

There are three mysteries ... one physical, one mental, one spiritual.

1: The as-yet unfathomed depths of the ocean.
2: The infinite dimensions of time and space.
3: The Ground of Being.

Yes here, here and here. How do you define (mental) here, as we can figure things out? See there is a problem as universes go. Let me see how to say this.... We will keep losing time until we become nothing here. Imagine the universe an hour glass and in the top is everything here in this universe we can see. The bottom of the hour glass is everything not here in the top of the hour glass(I say nothing here). The sand in the lower half of the hour glass must run completely out of time before it can become something again. The problem is how can we figure ourselves out in the end of time when no time remains. Billions of years from now who cares right, well that is why god got involved. In the end of time minds remain lit up until they too start to fall into ("absolutely nothing here figure absolutely nothing out"). This is why god taught nothing inside of himself his desire was to find away that no thing would ever become nothing here again. He could allow all yourselves to become yourselves again and to never have to become nothing again.

Just more thoughts about thoughts. Thank you

powessy

 

[Thomas]

Yes here, here and here.

Well 'here' physically, of the first; 'here' mentally as we can conceive beyond the limits of our physical reach; and 'here' spiritually as 'here' is everywhere ...

How do you define (mental) here, as we can figure things out?

I'd define mental as in the processes of the mind ... the issue is 'figuring things' out that themselves have no limit, no 'periphery' or 'edge' because the mind is open to the limitless infinite ... I'm not sure we'll ever develop a true 'theory of everything' because too often that comes with a priori assumptions ... and when you approach the Ground of Being there is just ... being ... nothing to figure out ...

See there is a problem as universes go.

There is as long as one's confined within a universe/multiverse context ... universes are themselves a mode of being

... We will keep losing time until we become nothing here.

I'm not sure how you reckon this. Time belongs to the finite world of multiplicity.

Imagine the universe an hour glass and in the top is everything here in this universe we can see.

The 'all-possible' within the context of this universe?

The bottom of the hour glass is everything not here in the top of the hour glass (I say nothing here).

The phrase in parenthesis throws me.

I would picture an hourglass, with all-that-is-possible in the top half, trickling through – in time – to realisation in the bottom half.

This universe, being one of finitude and contingency, means what which is realised is never quite as perfect as that which is possible – in this world it's always possible to go one step more ...

The sand in the lower half of the hour glass must run completely out of time before it can become something again.

Where is that sand running to?

The problem is how can we figure ourselves out in the end of time when no time remains.

When time ends, so do 'we' as figuring-out entities ...

Billions of years from now who cares right, well that is why god got involved.

God ... the Ground of Being ... is never not-involved.

In the end of time minds remain lit up until they too start to fall into ("absolutely nothing here figure absolutely nothing out").

It seems here you are talking about a mind transcending time, which is entirely possible and actual, outside of time there is nothing to figure out.

The nature of 'personal' being is it is relational. The idea of 'relation' is intimately tied up with 'person', all persons exist in relation, to themselves and to others, one's own being is as mysterious as the being of one's neighbour. It is in relation that we discover something of ourselves, of others, of the world, and so on ...

This is why god taught nothing inside of himself his desire was to find away that no thing would ever become nothing here again.

This places contingency on God, which I think is an error.

The nature of 'being' and 'becoming' is that every universe is a becoming, an emergence from and an eventual submersion into, the Ground of Being. Not 'everything' will emerge because the Ground is Infinite, and is not a collection of things, it's pure Is-ness, and Is-ness has no number, no limit ...

... Just some thoughts back ...

 

[otherbrother]

Some of those beings will possess the faculty of mind, and some will not, but being-ness, being prior to all, possesses all faculties within itself

If this physical (temporal and spatial) reality has any relationship with a greater reality of a different dimension, one can only conclude that it is via “mind.” The mind that prays to “God” is the door to the House.
Zen-like riddle I came up with:
If the door is the house,
that’s okay.
You’ll get where you need to be
anyway.

If we pray, the prayer itself, the action of the other-dimensional thing in our head, may get us to the House of the Lord even if there would happen to be no Lord or House there. Translate “I and the Father are one” into my deepest mind and Universal Mind are one.
And implied is that Christ was not referring to himself exclusively, but to any human who enters into spiritual experiences and growth.

 

[Alif Balaam Yashin]

When he first presented it, you made it a mental health issue.

Also, who assesses something like this over the internet?

Also, what's with the feisty attitude? Who needs it!

I stated the facts, no one suffers from mass auditory hallucinations without something going wrong in their brain . . . either that or someone is making shit up.

 

[otherbrother]

I stated the facts, no one suffers from mass auditory hallucinations without something going wrong in their brain . . . either that or someone is making shit up.

I saw a vision when my son was in a coma. Also one other time after deep meditation. Visual hallucinations usually associated with toxicity and delirium, sometimes mania. Auditory hallucinations are usually associated with schizophrenia, but my own mystical experiences keep me open to auditory mystical experiences as well. Deep mental states might break the mental health rules at times.
Lately I am strongly considering the benefit of hallucinogenic drugs along with responsible guidance to help people have spiritual experiences that they can learn to illicit without drugs later on. Everyone has some degree of dopamine and the like, but some may have so little that they need a boost to get the connectivity ball rolling. My sons rightly call me a natural pot head, so people like me probably don’t need the chemical boost. The world lacks connective experiences other than addictions which are like a false god. Our busy, achievement oriented culture pulls us away from wholeness brain activity and chemistry.

 

[otherbrother]

I saw a vision when my son was in a coma. Also one other time after deep meditation. Visual hallucinations usually associated with toxicity and delirium, sometimes mania. Auditory hallucinations are usually associated with schizophrenia, but my own mystical experiences keep me open to auditory mystical experiences as well. Deep mental states might break the mental health rules at times.
Lately I am strongly considering the benefit of hallucinogenic drugs along with responsible guidance to help people have spiritual experiences that they can learn to illicit without drugs later on. Everyone has some degree of dopamine and the like, but some may have so little that they need a boost to get the connectivity ball rolling. My sons rightly call me a natural pot head, so people like me probably don’t need the chemical boost. The world lacks connective experiences other than addictions which are like a false god. Our busy, achievement oriented culture pulls us away from wholeness brain activity and chemistry.

And even if someone has a touch of schizophrenia, if it can be put to good use, count it as a gift to help overly realistic minds open up to mystical possibilities.

 

[powessy]

Well 'here' physically, of the first; 'here' mentally as we can conceive beyond the limits of our physical reach; and 'here' spiritually as 'here' is everywhere ...


I'd define mental as in the processes of the mind ... the issue is 'figuring things' out that themselves have no limit, no 'periphery' or 'edge' because the mind is open to the limitless infinite ... I'm not sure we'll ever develop a true 'theory of everything' because too often that comes with a priori assumptions ... and when you approach the Ground of Being there is just ... being ... nothing to figure out ...


There is as long as one's confined within a universe/multiverse context ... universes are themselves a mode of being

Yes, I believe that this universe is only a galaxy within a much larger universe, and our galaxy contains a universe within it. According to the law of conservation energy is neither created nor destroyed that is true but it can be transformed or transferred. To transform energy can be the loss of time to lose time to change to a lesser state of being. Our sun and all suns in the universe will eventually run out of time and they will become nothing here.

I'm not sure how you reckon this. Time belongs to the finite world of multiplicity.

I believe that universes come into existence find time again and others out of existence where they run out of time and then they must be figured out again.

The 'all-possible' within the context of this universe?

Yes, I believe each universe must be figured out as it comes into time again.

The phrase in parenthesis throws me.

Nothing here is the veil, the top of the hour glass is here in this universe in time and the bottom is in the spiritual.

I would picture an hourglass, with all-that-is-possible in the top half, trickling through – in time – to realisation in the bottom half.

This universe, being one of finitude and contingency, means what which is realised is never quite as perfect as that which is possible – in this world it's always possible to go one step more ...


Where is that sand running to?

The sand is going into itself, it becomes itself inside itself to become something again. I was brought to this room and a man is sitting in a chair not moving I approach from the back, they have his scalp cut back and some sort of circuit board mounted to his scull. they turn this thing on and I am pulled inside of him to find him inside of himself again. This whole event I was wide awake and aware of what they were trying to figure out. I could be wrong but they had to go through a whole lot to try to teach me this.

When time ends, so do 'we' as figuring-out entities ...


God ... the Ground of Being ... is never not-involved.

This again is where we differ on our view of god, I believe he is himself only, the one and only. You see our yourself is filled with many things we are many things to become ourselves here. I will try to explain this, To become yourself in the veil, you need at least five minds, they showed me this as five minds broke away from my mind they moved out away from me and looked like discs these discs came together and everything inside of them went into the sphere it formed, and a man began to start walking inside of the yourself. I often try to explain this also as the lotus flower. Now imagine gods mind as all things inside of his yourself it is only a yourself it is not five minds and god is not who we are so his yourself has nothing inside of it to become him. I say he is just yourself is never yourself. the law of minds is you can figure out anything that finds time inside of yourself, this is why we can not figure him out and he can figure everything inside of himself out.

It seems here you are talking about a mind transcending time, which is entirely possible and actual, outside of time there is nothing to figure out.

The nature of 'personal' being is it is relational. The idea of 'relation' is intimately tied up with 'person', all persons exist in relation, to themselves and to others, one's own being is as mysterious as the being of one's neighbour. It is in relation that we discover something of ourselves, of others, of the world, and so on ...


This places contingency on God, which I think is an error.

I think of nothing as something like the langoliers from Stephen kings book. Nothing consumed everything for they could figure out anything and become anything. Another way to understand nothing is they rip themselves into two pieces then four then eight and so and so on until they are able to figure anything out at any stage. Nothing ripped everything apart until they found something they could not figure out, god, they then went into god until there was absolutely nothing outside of god he was now everything inside of himself. This is the part I don't get completely for god was already inside of himself and he at this time was not everything inside of himself. Again we differ but these thoughts were told by the son as the father/ son /holy ghost.

The nature of 'being' and 'becoming' is that every universe is a becoming, an emergence from and an eventual submersion into, the Ground of Being. Not 'everything' will emerge because the Ground is Infinite, and is not a collection of things, it's pure Is-ness, and Is-ness has no number, no limit ...

... Just some thoughts back ...

Thank you for your thoughts about my thoughts.

Powessy

 

[Alif Balaam Yashin]

I saw a vision when my son was in a coma. Also one other time after deep meditation. Visual hallucinations usually associated with toxicity and delirium, sometimes mania. Auditory hallucinations are usually associated with schizophrenia, but my own mystical experiences keep me open to auditory mystical experiences as well. Deep mental states might break the mental health rules at times.
Lately I am strongly considering the benefit of hallucinogenic drugs along with responsible guidance to help people have spiritual experiences that they can learn to illicit without drugs later on. Everyone has some degree of dopamine and the like, but some may have so little that they need a boost to get the connectivity ball rolling. My sons rightly call me a natural pot head, so people like me probably don’t need the chemical boost. The world lacks connective experiences other than addictions which are like a false god. Our busy, achievement oriented culture pulls us away from wholeness brain activity and chemistry.

Auditory hallucinations aren’t exclusive to psychosis—they’re also common in religious experiences, meditation, and ritual states. Hyperactivity in the temporal lobes can create intense mystical experiences, including hearing divine voices, angelic commands, or demonic whispers. Studies show that intense prayer, fasting, and chanting increase dopamine levels and reduce activity in the prefrontal cortex. This can enhance spontaneous auditory phenomena, making gods, spirits, or ancestors seem to speak. In dissociative states, the brain disconnects from the sense of self, making it easier to experience external voices, visions, and commands from an "otherworldly" source.

 

[otherbrother]

I am a father of 4, and a husband for almost 30 years now. I spent five years in college with a concentration in computer science and electrical engineering. I spent three years in the military prior to college. I don't do anything to alter my mind or perception of the world I love life and all it has to offer. I have had thousands of out of body experiences and astral experiences prior to the voices I hear, 12 years ago.

Time is said to be all things that we perceive around us. As things become nothing here they are said to lose time not change or anything. They say as things lose time they just go inside of themselves to become something again just less time. You can go inside of yourself until there is no time and you are no longer able to figure anything out. Chances are the atoms in your body have done this many times since the beginning of time, memories may exist more so in some atoms then others.

I believe that God only wishes that you be true to yourself, I know as we near death that things will be very silent as minds stop trying to figure you out or teach you things.

good luck to you


powessy

Like “be true to yourself.”

 

[Thomas]

If this physical (temporal and spatial) reality has any relationship with a greater reality of a different dimension, one can only conclude that it is via “mind.” The mind that prays to “God” is the door to the House.

You might say so ... I happen to think otherwise, but again, it's how we prioritise.

I regard being as prior to mind.

If we pray, the prayer itself, the action of the other-dimensional thing in our head, may get us to the House of the Lord even if there would happen to be no Lord or House there. Translate “I and the Father are one” into my deepest mind and Universal Mind are one.

Well taken in isolation there are a number of ways of reading that text.

I would suggest the 'my deepest mind' remains something of a mystery because it is not, in fact, 'mine' ...

And implied is that Christ was not referring to himself exclusively, but to any human who enters into spiritual experiences and growth.

Again, a possible assumption if read in isolation.

Read in context of John 10, and John generally, that exclusivity is exactly what he's referring to.

It is possible for 'I' and 'You' to be one with the Father, but only in and through Him, the Son.

 

[Thomas]

This again is where we differ on our view of god, I believe he is himself only, the one and only.

As do I.

You see our yourself is filled with many things we are many things to become ourselves here. I will try to explain this, To become yourself in the veil, you need at least five minds ...

This all gets way too speculative and complicated for me.

 

[otherbrother]

Like “be true to yourself.”

Powessy said this: “I have had thousands of out of body experiences and astral experiences .,,”
Today on Palm Sunday our Sunday School class reviewed a book about the Bible New Testament book of John, specifically the account of the tomb stone being rolled away and the eventual discovery of the resurrected JC. My take on the whole story is that it symbolizes a new way to be in our physical selves, in our bodies. The tomb is the mere body or self overly nailed to, attached to, dependent on, the material aspect of our being. The gross, high resistance, entropy-bound, flesh container is like a tomb of the True Self if oneself identifies too much with it. The spirit or energy self (astral body?) must leave and come back in an energized/animated and spiritually transformed version if one’s physical existence is to be more than a prison or tomb or closed off box unable to be made vital by God energy.
So I began to wonder, should our church teach us astral projection techniques? And then I thought about the risk of confusion and getting lost. After that, though, I realized that our spirits move outside the tomb in baby steps that resemble astral projection and may be preparatory to it. I also agree partially with the participant here in the forum who focuses on Brahman and says my interest in subtle energy leads to being wooed into superstition associated with “spirituality.” Then I realized this not to be so IF one does not cling to external projections of the energy aspect of whole self or True Self, and when one does not mentally push oneself away from Divine Other by assuming duality or mutual exclusion, as opposed to understanding that Divine Other and True Self are one and the same at the deepest level of seeing and originating one’s ongoing physical existence/being. If we operate from a sufficiently deep zone, God is with us. Which aligns with the notion that intentionality, a realization that one’s own mind CHOOSES the spiritual, energetic, quantum entangled, ways operating or being in a material form prevents woo/superstition. In this (mindful) way, the spirituality is not a magical something out there that we passively hope to enter in or swoop down and save us.
Perhaps the baby steps to astral projection and remote viewing would be to practice being mindful of the subtle energy flow going on as we love someone, others. Self expands beyond its previous borders, leaves to some degree its tomb, enlarges its aura. At the same time we practice transcending body, in big or small ways (preferably building up gradually to the big ways), we are being spiritually transformed into a more porous self, an ego transcending self. Even experiencing God’s presence is an intentional exercise of one’s own spirit, even though it is temporarily experienced as an other. It is only an other because our clinging to physical reality has estranged ourselves from our own spirit which is seamlessly connected to God. Experiencing God’s presence then is perhaps a baby step toward intentional astral projection. Krishnamerti’s (sp?) “expansiveness” comes to mind.

 

[otherbrother]

Powessy said this: “I have had thousands of out of body experiences and astral experiences .,,”
Today on Palm Sunday our Sunday School class reviewed a book about the Bible New Testament book of John, specifically the account of the tomb stone being rolled away and the eventual discovery of the resurrected JC. My take on the whole story is that it symbolizes a new way to be in our physical selves, in our bodies. The tomb is the mere body or self overly nailed to, attached to, dependent on, the material aspect of our being. The gross, high resistance, entropy-bound, flesh container is like a tomb of the True Self if oneself identifies too much with it. The spirit or energy self (astral body?) must leave and come back in an energized/animated and spiritually transformed version if one’s physical existence is to be more than a prison or tomb or closed off box unable to be made vital by God energy.
So I began to wonder, should our church teach us astral projection techniques? And then I thought about the risk of confusion and getting lost. After that, though, I realized that our spirits move outside the tomb in baby steps that resemble astral projection and may be preparatory to it. I also agree partially with the participant here in the forum who focuses on Brahman and says my interest in subtle energy leads to being wooed into superstition associated with “spirituality.” Then I realized this not to be so IF one does not cling to external projections of the energy aspect of whole self or True Self, and when one does not mentally push oneself away from Divine Other by assuming duality or mutual exclusion, as opposed to understanding that Divine Other and True Self are one and the same at the deepest level of seeing and originating one’s ongoing physical existence/being. If we operate from a sufficiently deep zone, God is with us. Which aligns with the notion that intentionality, a realization that one’s own mind CHOOSES the spiritual, energetic, quantum entangled, ways operating or being in a material form prevents woo/superstition. In this (mindful) way, the spirituality is not a magical something out there that we passively hope to enter in or swoop down and save us.
Perhaps the baby steps to astral projection and remote viewing would be to practice being mindful of the subtle energy flow going on as we love someone, others. Self expands beyond its previous borders, leaves to some degree its tomb, enlarges its aura. At the same time we practice transcending body, in big or small ways (preferably building up gradually to the big ways), we are being spiritually transformed into a more porous self, an ego transcending self. Even experiencing God’s presence is an intentional exercise of one’s own spirit, even though it is temporarily experienced as an other. It is only an other because our clinging to physical reality has estranged ourselves from our own spirit which is seamlessly connected to God. Experiencing God’s presence then is perhaps a baby step toward intentional astral projection. Krishnamerti’s (sp?) “expansiveness” comes to mind.

I personally have only had two astral projection experiences in the wake state, and one of those was actually in a semi-awake state following a nap. The other astral projection occurred during an intense emotional state. One vision occurred also during an intense emotional state, and walking went on within that vision (astral projection that I was not aware of consciously?). One other vision followed deep meditation. I saw a seed going across seasons, time traveling instead of moving in space.
But I have had MANY experiences in my dreams that suggested I was astrally projecting while in the thin-veil dream state.

 

[otherbrother]

A "yourself" how to translate, you have twelve systems that make you up, each system has a "me" And that me has many mes inside of it, so I am all my mes becoming me to become yourself/myself here. I am a simple system, but a mind it can have a cornucopia of yourselves within it but everything inside of it must be allowed by the mind to become it. To teach a mind is to teach it anything and it can still figure itself out.

Sounds like the mind’s relationship with its own projections. Gestalt therapy advocates developing the skill of reclaiming one’s projections. I did so once in a dream. I reclaimed the angry character as a part of myself and our breathing became one, I realized in the dream that the disowned anger was a part of me, and that I would be better off to integrate that mini me with the overall me. I needed to own my anger.

 

[otherbrother]

I personally have only had two astral projection experiences in the wake state, and one of those was actually in a semi-awake state following a nap. The other astral projection occurred during an intense emotional state. One vision occurred also during an intense emotional state, and walking went on within that vision (astral projection that I was not aware of consciously?). One other vision followed deep meditation. I saw a seed going across seasons, time traveling instead of moving in space.
But I have had MANY experiences in my dreams that suggested I was astrally projecting while in the thin-veil dream state.

Would astral projection skill development now help us transition better at death, when we leave and don’t come back, give up the ghost? Perhaps now that I am old, I’m motivated to practice moving out of my body. As long as I’m still alive, the mind or the silver chord will lead me back to my body, but I’ll also get comfortable leaving it, in preparation for the big one-way trip coming up before too long.

 

[wil]

Perhaps now that I am old, I’m motivated to practice

I think As we age we start reaching for any branch to keep us from falling off the cliff to the unknown. In that alone I am a tad envious of all the folks that think they know...and if there weren't so many outcomes that folks are positive of... I might be inclined to grab that branch too.

But for me....I just figure when the time comes I'll buckle up for the ride!