PersonaNonGrata
CODinside
i might be acting foolisly to ask this but did jesus return to his father virgin?
my grandpa never let me to water the garden.
my grandpa never let me to water the garden.
taboo?
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Susma Rio Sep
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Man in everything but sin
What I know from my Catholic faith is that Jesus is man in all things except sin. But I am now a postgraduate Catholic.
About being a virgin for a guy, if we would talk about physical integrity, there does not seem to be any to talk about; for unlike in women with a hymen there is no such tissue remnant in a guy.
What we have as guys is the prepuce which is a far cry from a hymen.
So we are talking about sexual sensations in connection with being virgen or not with guys.
In this regard, since sexual sensations as such can occur even in sleep or in semi sleep conditions, we can say that Jesus did have sexual sensations, just as he did experience hunger.
The question is whether Jesus had intercourse with a woman or with a man or did self-gratification with Himself?
And also the other question that might be the one really being asked is whether Jesus had committed sexual offenses during his 33 years.
If you ask me, I don't know, except that if you believe the doctrine of the Catholic Church which is common to traditional Christians, then you have to believe also that Jesus did not commit any kind of sexual activities that amounted to any kind of sin however minor.
The matter is now how to understand sin during the times of Jesus. I read somewhere that during His times engaged couples could have already sexual intercourse prior to actual marriage. That's the reason why Mary was exceptionally virtuous, namely, she did not have any sexual contacts with Joseph, not during engagement and not during marriage. Did they get married at all? But all this is from the lips of Mary which Christians are to take as truthful: "I know not man".
Did Jesus have any sexual activities at all that were not considered sinful during His days?
I have no answer, except that as Catholics we are to believe that he never commit any sinful acts. Non-sinful sexual acts, did he do any?
But why would I be curious about his non-sinful sexual acts if any; I am not curious except if I were some kind of a voyeur which I am not.
Maybe we should ask the OP what are his reasons or purposes in asking the question whether Jesus went up to the Father a virgin. He says he's curious; but there are reasons for curiosity, unless it is the kind that is concerned with why the length of a circle is equal to 3.1416 times the diameter (am I correct), academic or scientific or mathematical quest for knowledge.
Is the curiosity of the OP somewhat similar to a neighbor asking whether the postman stays too long in the next house on occasions delivering mail matters there?
Susma Rio Sep
What I know from my Catholic faith is that Jesus is man in all things except sin. But I am now a postgraduate Catholic.
About being a virgin for a guy, if we would talk about physical integrity, there does not seem to be any to talk about; for unlike in women with a hymen there is no such tissue remnant in a guy.
What we have as guys is the prepuce which is a far cry from a hymen.
So we are talking about sexual sensations in connection with being virgen or not with guys.
In this regard, since sexual sensations as such can occur even in sleep or in semi sleep conditions, we can say that Jesus did have sexual sensations, just as he did experience hunger.
The question is whether Jesus had intercourse with a woman or with a man or did self-gratification with Himself?
And also the other question that might be the one really being asked is whether Jesus had committed sexual offenses during his 33 years.
If you ask me, I don't know, except that if you believe the doctrine of the Catholic Church which is common to traditional Christians, then you have to believe also that Jesus did not commit any kind of sexual activities that amounted to any kind of sin however minor.
The matter is now how to understand sin during the times of Jesus. I read somewhere that during His times engaged couples could have already sexual intercourse prior to actual marriage. That's the reason why Mary was exceptionally virtuous, namely, she did not have any sexual contacts with Joseph, not during engagement and not during marriage. Did they get married at all? But all this is from the lips of Mary which Christians are to take as truthful: "I know not man".
Did Jesus have any sexual activities at all that were not considered sinful during His days?
I have no answer, except that as Catholics we are to believe that he never commit any sinful acts. Non-sinful sexual acts, did he do any?
But why would I be curious about his non-sinful sexual acts if any; I am not curious except if I were some kind of a voyeur which I am not.
Maybe we should ask the OP what are his reasons or purposes in asking the question whether Jesus went up to the Father a virgin. He says he's curious; but there are reasons for curiosity, unless it is the kind that is concerned with why the length of a circle is equal to 3.1416 times the diameter (am I correct), academic or scientific or mathematical quest for knowledge.
Is the curiosity of the OP somewhat similar to a neighbor asking whether the postman stays too long in the next house on occasions delivering mail matters there?
Susma Rio Sep
juantoo3
....whys guy.... ʎʇıɹoɥʇnɐ uoıʇsǝnb
Kindest Regards, Susma!
Glad to see you back!
Glad to see you back!
Susma Rio Sep
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Jesus' virginity a non-issue
Thanks, Brian and Juantoo, for the re-bienvenu.
The way I see it, sex nowadays is so liberated as a taboo. It would seem to be as embarrassing as having to ask for the bathroom in an emergency.
Think the worst of Jesus in regard to sex to reach your own conclusion whether He went back to the Father a virgin or not.
Important thing is that there are sex acts nowadays that are no longer in the category of sinful acts, even among Christians. For example, same sex acts among even non legally married couples -- of the same sex.
As I said, the question of sinful sex acts is more pertinent. By that I mean the violation of some obligation from justice. For example, sleeping with a stranger other than one's lawfully or even religiously bound partner, is a violation of the what we call conjugal duty of fidelity.
I can grant that Jesus could have had a normal sex life but not a sinful one, in that respect. So He could have gone back to the Father, having experienced everything human, except again, sin. What is that about "I am a man, and I don't count anything human alien to my nature"? So with Jesus the man.
No, that question is a non-issue, for me. Jesus the man lived and worked and died, and He means a lot to a lot of peoples, wether He died a virgin or not, does not take away His worth.
But I am a postgraduate Catholic, and talking as one.
Pachomius2000
Thanks, Brian and Juantoo, for the re-bienvenu.
The way I see it, sex nowadays is so liberated as a taboo. It would seem to be as embarrassing as having to ask for the bathroom in an emergency.
Think the worst of Jesus in regard to sex to reach your own conclusion whether He went back to the Father a virgin or not.
Important thing is that there are sex acts nowadays that are no longer in the category of sinful acts, even among Christians. For example, same sex acts among even non legally married couples -- of the same sex.
As I said, the question of sinful sex acts is more pertinent. By that I mean the violation of some obligation from justice. For example, sleeping with a stranger other than one's lawfully or even religiously bound partner, is a violation of the what we call conjugal duty of fidelity.
I can grant that Jesus could have had a normal sex life but not a sinful one, in that respect. So He could have gone back to the Father, having experienced everything human, except again, sin. What is that about "I am a man, and I don't count anything human alien to my nature"? So with Jesus the man.
No, that question is a non-issue, for me. Jesus the man lived and worked and died, and He means a lot to a lot of peoples, wether He died a virgin or not, does not take away His worth.
But I am a postgraduate Catholic, and talking as one.
Pachomius2000
PersonaNonGrata
CODinside
more murmur about his virginity and more
As i am new here, i guess yer older, as everyone appreciates your back, so i am ;
As a guy, a dude, a being that was born and grown up in a islamic country (however secular it is) my knowledge of christianity is only based on personal curiosity of mine. (That is unfair dont you think? you have better chances then i do for choosing the right religion on your behalf. i guess im going to open a new thread for that). As ive known quite a lot about muhammed's love life (that he has married 20+ times, for the sake of women (!)) i really out of curiosty would like to know how things worked for christ:
I really dont give a.. anything if he was virgin or not.
Also i would like you to know that this thread wasnt meant to take any worth from him (which no one can, tough) and to take things even further; even if he was homo(bi, trans, ..whatever)sexual, that, also, will take no worth from him of him being a 'very good and model guy' on my own perspective which your religion WONT.
shame...
Grandpa ones said 'They were all human beings, son. Do not bother'. He never let me to water th garden, though! ) RIP granndy.
Ah@nda Susma ;Susma Rio Sep said:
As i am new here, i guess yer older, as everyone appreciates your back, so i am ;
As a guy, a dude, a being that was born and grown up in a islamic country (however secular it is) my knowledge of christianity is only based on personal curiosity of mine. (That is unfair dont you think? you have better chances then i do for choosing the right religion on your behalf. i guess im going to open a new thread for that). As ive known quite a lot about muhammed's love life (that he has married 20+ times, for the sake of women (!)) i really out of curiosty would like to know how things worked for christ:
I really dont give a.. anything
if he was virgin or not.Also i would like you to know that this thread wasnt meant to take any worth from him (which no one can, tough) and to take things even further; even if he was homo(bi, trans, ..whatever)sexual, that, also, will take no worth from him of him being a 'very good and model guy' on my own perspective which your religion WONT.
shame...
Grandpa ones said 'They were all human beings, son. Do not bother'. He never let me to water th garden, though! ) RIP granndy.
Susma Rio Sep
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Suggestion for a topic
Thanks, Persona, for your reply.
I am don't know for sure why you are interested to know whether Jesus went back to the Father still a virgin.
Whatever your answer, I would be enriched by another view from another person who takes the trouble to contribute his thoughts on a topic.
Are you, if I may inquire, a conservative Muslim or a liberal Muslim? I understand that Muslims in Lebanon are rather liberalized. Lebanon seems to be a very secular society notwithstanding that it is Muslim in terms of society and culture and civiliization. I could be wrong though.
I like to exchange views with Muslims. Please start a thread on what you think are non-bargainable stands of every Muslim who takes his religion seriously.
Right away I want to ask your opinion or even stand on what is a true religion, and whether Islam is the true religion.
On my part, as a Catholic I was brought up to believe that there is a true religion and a true church. it is the Catholic faith and the Vatican Roman Catholic Church.
At present I consider myself a postgraduate Catholic. What is that? Think 'post' and think 'graduate' and think of them in a figurative but no less meaningful way, and you will get to know what I consider myself to be, a postgraduate Catholic.
Regards,
Pachomius2000
Thanks, Persona, for your reply.
I am don't know for sure why you are interested to know whether Jesus went back to the Father still a virgin.
Whatever your answer, I would be enriched by another view from another person who takes the trouble to contribute his thoughts on a topic.
Are you, if I may inquire, a conservative Muslim or a liberal Muslim? I understand that Muslims in Lebanon are rather liberalized. Lebanon seems to be a very secular society notwithstanding that it is Muslim in terms of society and culture and civiliization. I could be wrong though.
I like to exchange views with Muslims. Please start a thread on what you think are non-bargainable stands of every Muslim who takes his religion seriously.
Right away I want to ask your opinion or even stand on what is a true religion, and whether Islam is the true religion.
On my part, as a Catholic I was brought up to believe that there is a true religion and a true church. it is the Catholic faith and the Vatican Roman Catholic Church.
At present I consider myself a postgraduate Catholic. What is that? Think 'post' and think 'graduate' and think of them in a figurative but no less meaningful way, and you will get to know what I consider myself to be, a postgraduate Catholic.
Regards,
Pachomius2000
PersonaNonGrata
CODinside
Islamic concerns
Selamun Aleykum Pachomius2000,
And i would like you to go and read my thread titled > 'Religion for fools', i couldnt find anything more to write regarding your essay above.
Allah bagislayicidir, Allah esirgeyendir..
Selamun Aleykum Pachomius2000,
And i would like you to go and read my thread titled > 'Religion for fools', i couldnt find anything more to write regarding your essay above.
Allah bagislayicidir, Allah esirgeyendir..