New here:Do they feel emotional pain in heaven?

R

RSV_Ecosse

New Member
Messages
2
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
Scotland
Hi, I'm new here.

I've never been very religious although I do believe there is a god.

Been a firefighter for 17 years and I love my job.

I am also a keen motorcyclist.

Last week, when on a ride out with a few biking friends, we had a tragic accident. One was killed pretty much instantly after a collision with another vehicle on a corner.

He was a paramedic. I was left to stay with him after the accident as the other two had gone on ahead and were unaware of what had happened.

I could do nothing for him, I knew he had gone as soon as I did all the normal checks I would have done if I was on duty. Stayed with him until the ambulance crew arrived, who were his colleagues from the same station, which made it even worse.

The funeral was today. It was very emotional. I struggled to cope.

I only knew him for a short time, but I felt an instant connection between us because of the respective vocations we had. He did also.

Spoke to his wife a few times on the phone before the funeral. It was very hard to do so. At the funeral today, I spoke for the first time with his wife and mother, face to face. It was a full service funeral with many of his colleagues attending.

I'm feeling pain. But I know that its nothing compared to the immeasurable pain his wife is feeling, as well as his mother, close family and friends.

To cut a long story short, and I know no one will have an answer to this, but if his soul has gone to heaven, does it still feel pain once it gets there?.

How can he not be looking down at his wife who is simply beside herself just now, and not be crying and feeling pain because of them being left behind and having to look towards overcoming an almost insurmountable task?. Or his mother?. Or his friends?.

I'm sorry if that sounds like a silly question to ask. As I said, I'm not religious in a big way, but although I've dealt with hundreds of road accidents, this one is just tearing me up inside and I cant see a way out in a hurry just now.

My mind is pretty chaotic just now, never thought I would see myself posting on a forum of this nature on a subject like this.

I have a good support network from my wife, colleagues and friends etc, but i just wondered if anyone here had maybe experienced a similar loss or had asked this question before?.

Thank you for reading my words.
 
Hi RSV,

I am so very saddened to hear of your loss, yet there is nothing I could say that would help your pain right now. As a fellow motorcyclist I am sorry to see another rider down. When I lost my son to a wasting disease years ago, I don't think I worried too much for his own pain, because I honestly believed he was in a higher state, though I felt his compassion for the pitiful wretch I had become because of my grief. I used to talk to him when no one was around, tell him about what I was doing, the games we used to play and the movies we loved. Most of the time I just broke into uncontrollable sobs and cried for what seemed like hours. I think now that for nearly two years I was just a little insane. Though it will be eleven years this october that he went away, every now and then, the pain stabs me when I least expect it. I think I will always have that inside me, but now it seems okay. It's hard to explain, but as the pain of losing him faded over the years, it just became part of what I am, and what my heart is made of. I loved him so, and I am quite sure he is on to bigger and better things, who really knows?
I thought for a long time the grief would kill me, and then sometimes, I was afraid that it wouldn't and I would have to continue living with it.
All I can really tell you is that it gets better, and eventually you can sit with it, and embrace it, embrace that part of you that is so very wounded, the part of you that hurts for others who hurt like you. I'm afraid that this is the price you pay for loving someone who may go on before you do, and you are left behind not knowing how to continue. Perhaps you look about you and wonder why the world can keep going when such a terrible thing has happened. Yes, this is the price for love, and in time maybe you will decide if it is worth it.

Peace
Mark
 
Dear RSV,

I, too, am sorry to hear of your loss, and it makes me wince a bit to know that a fellow biker has gone down. I find myself still drawn to thoughts of a friend who passed over about 2 years ago. Though I miss him dearly, I believe with more faith, passion and zeal the same things that I have essentially believed for 17 years, since I was 17. My friend, and yours, are both okay - and no, there is not emotional pain in Heaven.

If you've seen the movie Ghost, then you understand. If you haven't, rent it, watch it. Also consider What Dreams May Come, with Robin Williams. And rest assured that soon after your friend's passing, he was received by loving friends. These helpers, some known to him and others unknown, all bear the light of wisdom, and the calm born of a deep understanding of the process & nature of death & dying. Some have learned since their own death, and were sent. Others bring a deeper touch and presence. Some may be `angels,' all may have been perceived as such (no flapping wings with feathers, but the Beauty is indescribable!).

Your friend was very likely present at his funeral. This was almost certainly a return for him, since in recent days he has been shown and taught much. In some ways, there may still be emotional pain, but I can assure you of this: it will lessen. We move on, to a greater Light, and to the Loving company of friends & family (if recently passed), and caring people - various helpers, who "know the ropes."

Now, or increasingly, the only thing that will bring emotional pain to your friend, is for us to forget that he is still with us in Spirit, as we often say of Christ Jesus, or of other various Saints and Holy Ones. We must accept this, on Faith, if that is the language we are used to. And we must try to understand that to grieve for him, draws him back to us, and with the depth of our pain - he is saddened, and feels incredible pity for us, because he very much wants to assure us - that he is right there. For something that all of us should know so well by now, it is one of the hardest and most painful things with which we seem to universally struggle. If his physical presence would reassure, why not the spirit?

I think, in all honesty, it is important for you to consider that. And if your friend said to you, "yes, I do miss you guys," ... I think you would hear a pause, and then he would say, "I do, but I also know a peace here, an assurance that things are going to be alright, and that I'm in very good company - every single moment." I think he would want to share something of that world with you.

And so he can, and probably will. If you find that you've visited your friend in a dream, don't be surprised. If a fellow paramedic mentions that, you can smile. He hasn't disappeared. The one thing that we most want to know - is that he is alright. The universe has amazing ways of letting us know if this isn't the case, yet equally effective ways to assure us that it IS ... which is almost always so.

Peace be with you, and assurance,

Welcome to CR,

andrew (taijasi)
 
Maybe there has to be a movement from self-love, from emotional pain associated with "self"..............and a genuine openess/selflessness that can share in the suffering of others. For me, enlightenment is not necessarily free of suffering, but is free of a suffering that ultimately revolves around preoccupation with "self", with self-concern.

The Dalai Lama has a favorite verse from a Buddhist text, which goes something like..............."So long as space and time exists, so too may I exist, alleviating and sharing the suffering of the world." Perhaps our ultimate concern should be, not to be "free" of emotional pain, or to hope the same for others, but to share with others the necessary pain of being human, of our basic imperfection.

Is it "enlightenment" to look upon the suffering of others and yet be "free" of emotional pain? Should we really hope this for another? Maybe the time will come when "every tear is wiped from every eye" and all shall move on together to a realm where "all shall be well, and all manner of thing shall be well" (Julian of Norwich) Until then, maybe the way is to seek to share all things with others............

I think this is the lesson from the Buddhist story of Kisagotami and the mustard seed. Kisagotami had lost a husband and one of her children. Finally her last child had died. She wept for help. Someone told her to ask the Buddha if he was able to alleviate her suffering. "Yes, if you can bring me a mustard seed from a house that has known no pain." Kisogotami goes off to seek such a seed, but receives the same answer from every house.........yes, they have a mustard seed, yet their house too has known death and suffering. She learns the lesson that "The grief which all hearts share grows less for one." She then buries her child.

And another favorite story of mine, from the book "The Wisdom of the Zen Masters".....

Master Shaku Soen liked to take an evening stroll through a nearby village. One day he heard loud lamentations from a house and, on entering quietly, realized that the householder had died and the family and neighbours were crying. He sat down and cried with them. An old man noticed him and remarked, rather shaken on seeing the famous master crying with them: "I would have thought that you at least were beyond such things." "But it is this which puts me beyond it," replied the master with a sob.
 
Thank you for the warm welcome and kind words, everyone.

Paladin and Taijasi, those are very helpful and moving things to say.

I really appreciate them.

Some very interesting reading within the replies. I have been browsing these forums for a bit now and I never thought I would say this, but I think I have discovered a religious side of me that I never knew was there before.

It's only been a few days since the funeral and its not any easier, but I guess time will help ease the pain a little. At least thats what I'm hoping.

Thank you once again.
 
Hello, and Peace, RSV---

I just saw this conversation. Probably by now, you have progressed through many phases of the grief process. My sincere condolences for your immediate loss.

I "lost" a husband of 11 years in 1995. We had a child together who was nine at the time. Plus he was a loving stepfather to my 15-year-old. His was a long and agonizing passage, and he finally moved on on our 11th wedding anniversary.

I just thought I would tell you that I insisted on going home alone that morning, and while I was there, he appeared to me--or a vision was sent to me. He had been so debilitated for so long, but when I saw him, he was jumping around and clicking his heels, and gently shouting, "Look at me, honey! Watch this!"

Now, some might think that I made that vision up to console myself. I know better....:)

I thought maybe I would offer this in response to your question. I hope it doesn't sound too crazy. Lifting you to Love's heart...be well.

InPeace,
InLove
 
RSV_Ecosse said:
Thank you for the warm welcome and kind words, everyone.

Paladin and Taijasi, those are very helpful and moving things to say.

I really appreciate them.

Some very interesting reading within the replies. I have been browsing these forums for a bit now and I never thought I would say this, but I think I have discovered a religious side of me that I never knew was there before.

It's only been a few days since the funeral and its not any easier, but I guess time will help ease the pain a little. At least thats what I'm hoping.

Thank you once again.
Click to expand...

I am so very sorry for what happened to your friend, and to you. Yes, this is a good place...and it is my opinion that the religious side of you was probably always there. You just probably didn't have a reason to recognize it until now. We have been conditioned by today's world to not believe in bad things happening to us and to those that we care about. It is only then that we look for answers...but usually there are none...except for the love and friendship extended to you by others that you may not even know.

I trust that your time here will be useful and satisfying for you.

Peace and love....flow....:)
 
RSV_Ecosse said:
.

I'm feeling pain. But I know that its nothing compared to the immeasurable pain his wife is feeling, as well as his mother, close family and friends.
Click to expand...

I know this is slightly off-topic from what you're asking but I'd just like to reassure you that your pain is real and that you have a right to it, no matter if others are hurting worse. It is very kind of you to think of those who were closer to him. It seems you and he had something really special. It is right to feel the loss and to grieve it.

Here's a thought. I don't know if it's relevant. Based on stories and personal experience, it seems the human can handle only so much pain, and when it goes over that threshhold, the person just feels numb, dazed, in shock. Along that line of thought, it is possible that the pain you are feeling right now is actually sharper and more intense than what his family is feeling right now.

Taking that line of thought another step, it is possible that by the time their accute pain kicks in that your own will have passed enough to be there for them. Because of your own pain and sense of loss you will understand their's. They will sense this deep understanding and appreciate it.

Feel free to ignore if these thoughts are not relevant or applicable.

All the best.

Ruby
 
RSV_Ecosse said:
Hi, I'm new here.

....
My mind is pretty chaotic just now, never thought I would see myself posting on a forum of this nature on a subject like this.

I have a good support network from my wife, colleagues and friends etc, but i just wondered if anyone here had maybe experienced a similar loss or had asked this question before?.

Thank you for reading my words.
Click to expand...

Hi RSV_Ecosse, Welcome to CR.

I'm sorry to hear about your loss. Chaos sounds like a pretty normal response to losing someone you love so suddenly. For what it is worth, I am certain your friend, in the breast of the Lord, experiences peace and belonging even as he continues to project his love back to those still here.

lunamoth
 
I was very saddened by your note Ecosse and just wanted to share that you have my prayers.

Incidents where we suddenly lose a comrad and friend are among the most difficult.

My younger brother was helping move some things to my apartment and one of them was my finch in a birdcage. He grasped the top of the cage and it fell open.. The bird soared to freedom in as straight a line as I had ever seen. I recall feeling startled and then a feeling that it was probably best for that finch and something it must have longed for deeply. Within a year my dear brother had himself winged his flight to the spiritual worlds beyond and while we were grieving for this loss I couldn't help recall how the soul like a bird wings it's flight to true freedom.

As to the soul the Writiings of my Faith indicate that the material body is a temporary condition:

" Man--the true man--is soul, not body; though physically man belongs to the animal kingdom, yet his soul lifts him above the rest of creation. Behold how the light of the sun illuminates the world of matter: Even so doth the divine light shed its rays in the kingdom of the soul. The soul it is which makes the human creature a celestial entity!" ~ 'Abdu'l-Bahá
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top