Turtles and Humans Have Much in Common

coberst

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Turtles and Humans Have Much in Common

I had once concluded it to be natural that when confronted by a new idea humans tended to do a turtle; withdraw into their shell until the coast was clear.

After some time posting in cyberspace I have modified my view somewhat. I think that we tend to display two types of turtle responses to our encounter with new ideas.

The terrapin withdraws quickly into its shell and the snapping turtle hisses, spits, and snaps when such an encounter happens. I suspect that cyberspace has allowed many people to display a more vulgar attitude than they would in face-to-face encounters.

I think that age is a factor in this equation. The young tend to be snappers and the older tend to be terrapins. I think that our teachers and professors have imprinted on the minds of their pupils that there is a legitimacy aspect to knowledge. That knowledge introduced by the teacher is legit and the rest should be avoided when possible.

Instead of graduates eager to learn and to earn we have constructed an educational system that qualifies citizens for a life of mindless production and consumption. Instead of turtles we need cats as a model for schooling.

A cat travels through the forest alert and curious to all that is in her range of perception. Instead of withdrawing into a shell the cat stealthily examines everything in its path. After a quick examination the cat very well may dart away for cover. The cat is, I think, more likely to survive in a dynamic and dangerous world than is the turtle.

Everyone is ignorant of 99.9999…% of the knowledge in the world. Understanding this fact I think is the first step toward setting each one of us free from any embarrassment we might feel about our ignorance. We should use our ignorance as a catalyst for discovering the joy of learning to understand what ever portion of the world’s knowledge that interests us.

We were born smart enough but we weren’t born intellectually sophisticated enough to handle this high tech world we have invented.

What is the difference between “being smart” and “being sophisticated”? I would say that we can use the handyman and his tool box as a good analogy for comprehending this difference. The number and quality of the instruments in a handyman’s tool box is a measure of his smartness and his experience using those tools is a measure of his sophistication.

If a handyman has only a hammer then every job is a job that will get hammered on. If that handyman has a great tool box but has experience only with a hammer then that handyman will look for things that can be hammered into place.

What’s in your tool box that you can use efficiently?

Do you know how to become more intellectually sophisticated? Become a self-actualizing self-learner.
 
Turtles and Humans Have Much in Common

I had once concluded it to be natural that when confronted by a new idea humans tended to do a turtle; withdraw into their shell until the coast was clear.

After some time posting in cyberspace I have modified my view somewhat. I think that we tend to display two types of turtle responses to our encounter with new ideas.

The terrapin withdraws quickly into its shell and the snapping turtle hisses, spits, and snaps when such an encounter happens. I suspect that cyberspace has allowed many people to display a more vulgar attitude than they would in face-to-face encounters.

I think that age is a factor in this equation. The young tend to be snappers and the older tend to be terrapins. I think that our teachers and professors have imprinted on the minds of their pupils that there is a legitimacy aspect to knowledge. That knowledge introduced by the teacher is legit and the rest should be avoided when possible.

Instead of graduates eager to learn and to earn we have constructed an educational system that qualifies citizens for a life of mindless production and consumption. Instead of turtles we need cats as a model for schooling.

A cat travels through the forest alert and curious to all that is in her range of perception. Instead of withdrawing into a shell the cat stealthily examines everything in its path. After a quick examination the cat very well may dart away for cover. The cat is, I think, more likely to survive in a dynamic and dangerous world than is the turtle.

Everyone is ignorant of 99.9999…% of the knowledge in the world. Understanding this fact I think is the first step toward setting each one of us free from any embarrassment we might feel about our ignorance. We should use our ignorance as a catalyst for discovering the joy of learning to understand what ever portion of the world’s knowledge that interests us.

We were born smart enough but we weren’t born intellectually sophisticated enough to handle this high tech world we have invented.

What is the difference between “being smart” and “being sophisticated”? I would say that we can use the handyman and his tool box as a good analogy for comprehending this difference. The number and quality of the instruments in a handyman’s tool box is a measure of his smartness and his experience using those tools is a measure of his sophistication.

If a handyman has only a hammer then every job is a job that will get hammered on. If that handyman has a great tool box but has experience only with a hammer then that handyman will look for things that can be hammered into place.

What’s in your tool box that you can use efficiently?

Do you know how to become more intellectually sophisticated? Become a self-actualizing self-learner.

Plato's influence is important within esoteric Christianity and what you are describing is part of Plato's cave analogy where we remain attached to shadows. The shell you describe is the habitual nature of cave life.

It remains this way because in a normal human being, our thought, emotion, and sensations would work in harmony and give us a realistic connection with the external world. As we are, the emotions, thought, and sensations are separate and each does its own thing.

A good pianist is such because his hands obey his mind and the emotions color the music. If they were separate, one couldn't play well. We can learn to play the piano but we cannot learn to play ourselves.

Plato describes the right relationship between body, mind, and emotions:

Later in book IV of the Republic, Plato writes that Socrates argued:

”…But in reality justice was such as we were describing, being
concerned however, not with the outward man, but with the inward, which
is the true self and concernment of man: for the just man does not permit
the several elements within him to interfere with one another, or any of
them to do the work of others, --he sets in order his own inner life, and is
his own master and his own law, and at peace with himself; and when he
has bound together the three principles within him, which may be
compared to the higher, lower, and middle notes of the scale, and the
intermediate intervals --when he has bound all these together, and is no
longer many, but has become one entirely temperate and perfectly
adjusted nature, then he proceeds to act, if he has to act, whether in a
matter of property, or in the treatment of the body, or in some affair of
politics or private business; always thinking and calling that which
preserves and co-operates with this harmonious condition, just and good
action, and the knowledge which presides over it, wisdom, and that which
at any time impairs this condition, he will call unjust action, and the opinion
which presides over it ignorance.”

This would be a balanced person capable of "presence" which includes all the tools in the tool box. As we are though we retreat into our shell and respond out of balance, and habitually, with no conscious self awareness so consequently retain and react to the warped view of reality we subjectively acquire and celebrate as the "educated" man.
 
A good pianist is such because his hands obey his mind and the emotions color the music. If they were separate, one couldn't play well. We can learn to play the piano but we cannot learn to play ourselves.

Reason and practice helps the pianist learn to play the piano, the emotions help the pianist to play music.
 
The cat is, I think, more likely to survive in a dynamic and dangerous world than is the turtle.[/quote]

You greatly under-estimate turtles. Cats might be more romantic to human prejudices, but that makes them no more evolutionarily fit than the lion is truly "king" of animals.
 
Reason and practice helps the pianist learn to play the piano, the emotions help the pianist to play music.

But music can be of different qualities. Most music serves the purpose of expressing and justifying our normal emotions while for some, music serves the purpose of experiencing a quality of emotion that is normally concealed by these normal emotions.

A lot of what for some reason is called Christian music is only an expression of emotions appropriate for Christendom but in reality the essence of Christianity seeks to transcend in sacred music so as to experience a quality of emotion we rarely experience but experientially indicates something greater than our normal habitual turtle existence
 
*in the correct tone which he has mastered...* "Why so serious?" :)

Can I ask a question... Do I -have- to become more intellectually sophisticated?

No. Like most you can be content with cave life or being like the eagle conditioned to react like a chicken in a barnyard. Only a few can really desire individuality or to become what they are.

"A man found an eagle's egg and put it in a nest of a barnyard hen. The eaglet hatched with the brood of chicks and grew up with them. All his life the eagle did what the barnyard chicks did, thinking he was a barnyard chicken. He scratched the earth for worms and insects. He clucked and cackled. And he would thrash his wings and fly a few feet into the air.

Years passed and the eagle grew very old. One day he saw a magnificent bird above him in the cloudless sky. It glided in graceful majesty among the powerful wind currents, with scarcely a beat on his strong golden wings. The old eagle looked up in awe. "Who's that?" he asked. "That's the eagle, the king of the birds," said his neighbor. "He belongs to the sky. We belong to the earth - we're chickens." So the eagle lived and died a chicken, for that's what he thought he was."

Anthony de Mello
(1931-1987) Jesuit Priest

He is speaking of a quality of human individuality most are unaware of having been conditioned to accept cave life or the barnyard.
 
You posted someones ability to REACT. To play yourself is the ability to ACT. Few know the difference

React? Hardly--he was playing himself, directing himself--making all those noises, himself. Too bad you didn't wake up enough to notice.

Truth is, cats are still not evolutionarily more successful than are turtles, no matter how much humans would romanticize one over the other.
 
React? Hardly--he was playing himself, directing himself--making all those noises, himself. Too bad you didn't wake up enough to notice.

Truth is, cats are still not evolutionarily more successful than are turtles, no matter how much humans would romanticize one over the other.

The jungle is composed of different qualities of life in interaction. Everything eats everything else in this arrangement. There is no action but continual lawful complimentary reaction. It is the same with humanity but most do not have the humility to admit it and rather believe their conditioned ego is somehow capable of action. Such imagination only prevents their eventual ability for action.

Wars are filled with people REACTING and believing they are playing themselves. Yet if people were capable of ACTION they would not react in this way and there would be no wars. You, like the majority, do not know the difference between acting and reacting
 
The jungle is composed of different qualities of life in interaction. Everything eats everything else in this arrangement. There is no action but continual lawful complimentary reaction. It is the same with humanity but most do not have the humility to admit it and rather believe their conditioned ego is somehow capable of action. Such imagination only prevents their eventual ability for action.

Wars are filled with people REACTING and believing they are playing themselves. Yet if people were capable of ACTION they would not react in this way and there would be no wars. You, like the majority, do not know the difference between acting and reacting

What war? I'm talking about a guy making music. You, on the other hand, are merely reacting, desperately flailing around for some pathetic excuse to use to lash out at someone who dares not worship you as some kind of sage.
 
What war? I'm talking about a guy making music. You, on the other hand, are merely reacting, desperately flailing around for some pathetic excuse to use to lash out at someone who dares not worship you as some kind of sage.

I am a modern sage. I don't demand worship but just insist you send money. Time to get real. fork it over.
 
The cat is, I think, more likely to survive in a dynamic and dangerous world than is the turtle.[

You greatly under-estimate turtles. Cats might be more romantic to human prejudices, but that makes them no more evolutionarily fit than the lion is truly "king" of animals.

I'm inclined to agree. If all turtles / tortoises / terrapins died off today, and we came back in a couple hundred million years, would we still see cats essentially the same as they are today. Nothing personal against cats, but turtles and their cousins have been around for a very long time, a heckuva lot longer than any particular mammals around today. Turtles date back to early dinosaurs...so do crocodiles / alligators / caimans. ;)
 
No. Like most you can be content with cave life or being like the eagle conditioned to react like a chicken in a barnyard. Only a few can really desire individuality or to become what they are.

He is speaking of a quality of human individuality most are unaware of having been conditioned to accept cave life or the barnyard.

Just curious...where is it you live? You use a computer, so I am guessing there is a good bit of barnyard in your own life... ;)
 
Does that make you a for profit prophet? ;) :D

Yes, Because of my words and my charm, everybody will come to love everybody else. Dr. Phil will be green with envy. It just takes a few extra bucks to actualize it so fork over the dough if you want to see world peace.

Your name will then receive an honored position on the official parchment scroll including all the new "Pioneers for Peace" that have donated to the cause. Your generosity will be celebrated and envied by your neighbors.

Hurry up, send me the cash, and prove to your neighbors that you support true love and peace.
 
Yes, Because of my words and my charm, everybody will come to love everybody else. Dr. Phil will be green with envy. It just takes a few extra bucks to actualize it so fork over the dough if you want to see world peace.

Your name will then receive an honored position on the official parchment scroll including all the new "Pioneers for Peace" that have donated to the cause. Your generosity will be celebrated and envied by your neighbors.

Hurry up, send me the cash, and prove to your neighbors that you support true love and peace.

But I already donated to the Beatles...all you need is love...all we are saying, is give peace a chance...I get by with a little help from my friends...bang, bang Maxwell's silver hammer...coo, coo, ka-choo

And all that jazz... :D
 
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