Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heaven?

[wil]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Sorry I should explain what I mean. Picture this. A divine being talking to say GOD that is being sent by the father to earth above a place that conception is going to take place. As soon as the sperm and egg unite the divine being is sent down into the egg and then sealed in it. This is why incarnated beings are always a series of miracles involving the body which are seal openings and bindings. I hope this makes sense to you.

Then that would be yes....to everyone....spiritual beings having a human existence....most completely unaware.

 

[donnann]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Then that would be yes....to everyone....spiritual beings having a human existence....most completely unaware.

Ok picture a big giant angel. Literally a giant compared to a human being but looks like a human being. You are the smaller version of this , you will never be as big. So its a no.

 

[donnann]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Then that would be yes....to everyone....spiritual beings having a human existence....most completely unaware.

One more thing the incarnated being is in somewhat weak human condition and is always identified by the miracles all of them happening to its body . Someone that is only human trying to claim they are literally a prehuman divine being is no different than what the fallen angel did. So in one way your right everyone has their own divine self but encoded within your own cell is a number that is your highest self and that number cannot be changed so someone can never become something they are or were not. Created in the image of like god but not god.

 

[donnann]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

oh yeah Jews For Jesus, forgot about them.

I understand his hebrew name was Yeshua not Jesus and how do any of these relate to 888 and what is the significance of 888 ?

888 refers to the human body that is one with its spirit and soul so thats the purpose for the incarnation. However there are 10 its 101010 but some of them are sex related which I wont discuss.

 

[donnann]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

One more thing the incarnated being is in somewhat weak human condition and is always identified by the miracles all of them happening to its body . Someone that is only human trying to claim they are literally a prehuman divine being is no different than what the fallen angel did. So in one way your right everyone has their own divine self but encoded within your own cell is a number that is your highest self and that number cannot be changed so someone can never become something they are or were not. Created in the image of like god but not god.

Ill post later tonight when I have a lot less distractions and am a lot less annoyed.

 

[Amica]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Between Jews, Christians and Muslims, only Christians believe Divine can incarnate. Outside these Abrahamic faiths, many have believed in incarnation: pagans, Druze, Bahai, Mithraism, etc. So, monotheistically speaking some who belong to monotheistic faiths believe it Jesus to be the only incarnation. Polytheistically, the history gives enough evidence to us that the world have many incarnated saviors way before Jesus.

 

[Etu Malku]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Probably the reference is to the "gematria", an ancient system of alphabetic numberals in which the letters are divided into three series of nine each, standing for 1-9, 10-90, 100-900 (extra letters are needed to bring the set up to 27). "Yeshua" was yod-shin-waw-'ayin = 10+300+6+70 = 386. I don't know what spelling is used to get "888" out of it.

EDIT: got it. Greek was "Iehsous" iota-eta-sigma-omicron-upsilon-sigma = 10+8+200+70+400+200

lucifer in English Gematria Equals: 444
lucifer in Simple Gematria Equals: 74
jesus in English Gematria Equals: 444
jesus in Simple Gematria Equals: 74

 

[radarmark]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

I still like what my bride of 35 years says "they are all the same soul coming back again and again" or what the Native American Church says "what makes you think Christ Jesus cannot come back as a Peyote button?".

Pax et amore omnia vincunt.

 

[wil]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

There are no miracles and everything is a miracle....depending on your definition.

I believe that as well as

We are all divine, all incarnate, or none of us are...depending on your definition.

note former is and and latter is or ... depending on your defintions.

 

[radarmark]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

No mind? Never Matter!

Believe in everything, nothing is sacred.

Believe in nothing, everything is sacred.

 

[Thomas]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Now I could say we've all incarnated into the human community....

Yes you can, but that's a generalisation, and as such misses the point.

Or we could say according to the various stories there were many....

Generalisation again.

The Bible mentions Melchisideck as having no parents, of which Jesus was labeled a priest in his order...

So ... ?

the only begotten of the continually begotten

That's wrong. The Son is begotten, the Father is not begotten.

God bless,

Thomas

 

[Thomas]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Maybe I should have first defined my definition of incarnation.

To understand what Christianity is saying requires you understand what Christianity means by what it says, not what you mean.

My definition of a circle could be 'something with five sides' — which is not going to help my kids doing their geometry homework.

To me incarnation is when a heavenly being is sent into the human body for the purpose, a mission of sorts from GOD to help humanity in some way.

We-e-e-e-ll, that's very vague, and open to all sorts of misinterpretation. For example: What happened to the human who's body is was?

I believe a human spirit doesn't come into existence until the sperm and egg unite and comes from a union of the two parents consciousness ...

OK, but that's not what Christianity believes.

... where as heavenly beings have a prehuman body soul and spirit that is literally one and exist in the heavenly kingdom prior to coming into the human body.

They don't believe that either, so you're on your own here, I think?

I do however believe in reincarnation where once a human spirit exists and the body dies that spirit can be born again into the human body.

Ditto.

So do you think say for example that men like moses or buddha were these incarnated beings?

If you mean incarnate like Christ ... no, and nor do I think they claim to be, and I think the Buddha would say the question is invalid anyway?

God bless,

Thomas

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

That's wrong. The Son is begotten, the Father is not begotten.

Maybe you can explain how this works...

The father is not begotten, so there was never a beginning... cool, whatever, logic and religion rarely coincide.

What exactly was God doing before he created the Universe? Why did he decide to create this existence? Even if you say there was a prior existence, God has still preceded it because he was not begotten. Where has he come from in the first place? Was God bored in heaven? Also, if the Father and Son are One, how can one beget the other? I'm confused.

When it boils down to it, none of this really matters at all, it is not going to help anything, it just appeases our intellects so we can move onto the next question. That is all such statements can ever do: create more questions.

 

[Thomas]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

The texts say I have sent you saviours for a reason.

Whoa! What texts? What do they mean by the term 'saviour'?

God bless,

Thomas

 

[Thomas]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

The christian concept of jesus is that when he took on a human body in the separated condition of non oneness that when that human body rose with his prehuman divine body that the human body was no longer separated.

Who's feeding you this? I'd ask for your money back. It's no Christian concept I've ever heard.

So then you have a divine being with his divine body that was never separated from his soul and spirit but also his human body that became one with the human soul and spirit and the power to use either.

No. The 'divine' by (Christian) definition is not corporate, is not composed or parts, and transcends all forms such as 'body', 'soul', and 'spirit'.

God bless

Thomas

 

[Thomas]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

All divine beings are angelic beings or some says gods or goddesses depends on what terms are used.

Again, not in Christianity they ain't ... angels are not divine, they're angelic ...

There is an argument that polytheism was 'resolved' by relegating the gods to the angelic orders, but there's more to it than that.

In the same way Greek philosophy would argue that a God, to be God, must be Absolute and Infinite, and therefore there cannot be two or more gods, any more than there can be two absolute or two infinites.

So in the journey from polytheism to monotheism, angelology might be a nice solution, but it's gone a lot further than that now.

Angels, in the Christian Tradition, are, I think, radically different from angels in the Hebrew Tradition — but bananabrain might correct me there.

God bless,

Thomas

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

donnann: Jesus is simply an enlightened being.

You ask what happens to the human soul when this occurs? It never was to begin with, it is ego which insists we are something separate but we all have our being through God - we have never been separate, any of us. The enlightened person has simply gone into death - samadhi - and has retained nothing of himself afterwards, all that is done is God's will now, there is no possibility of free will.

Jesus has certainly been guided towards a very particular teaching, that of love for all and the ceasing of sacrifices. This will have been delivered through intuition, it is not true to say God has spoken from a cloud or whatever else - these are symbolic at most. If Jesus is God incarnate, then all enlightened people to ever exist have been God incarnate - that is at least millions of people since the dawn of man. Jesus has benefited from the Roman Empire adopting his faith to unify the Empire, but he wasn't even the only rabbi doing "miracles" in Israel at the time - thus likely not the only enlightened being present in that small part of the world.

Of course, Christians won't like this statement, but it is better than letting you try to wrap your head around all this incarnate stuff...

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Again, not in Christianity they ain't ... angels are not divine, they're angelic ...

There is an argument that polytheism was 'resolved' by relegating the gods to the angelic orders, but there's more to it than that.

In the same way Greek philosophy would argue that a God, to be God, must be Absolute and Infinite, and therefore there cannot be two or more gods, any more than there can be two absolute or two infinites.

So in the journey from polytheism to monotheism, angelology might be a nice solution, but it's gone a lot further than that now.

Angels, in the Christian Tradition, are, I think, radically different from angels in the Hebrew Tradition — but bananabrain might correct me there.

God bless,

Thomas

In Christianity, God cannot be absolute or infinite because humans are not God and retain souls after death - thus there is somewhere where God is not. Also, angelic beings too, apparently God is not where they are according to your statement here...

 

[Thomas]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

To take on a human body you have to incarnate into the human skin. To do this at the point of conception the divine being descends into the egg and is sealed.

Maybe in your world, not in my (Christian) world.

We believe the Incarnation is a divine nature manifesting Itself in and through human nature ...

God bless,

Thomas

 

[Thomas]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Polytheistically, the history gives enough evidence to us that the world have many incarnated saviors way before Jesus.

Perhaps, but the Incarnation as understood of Jesus is different from the gods who walked among men ... so whilst that statement might be generally correct, once you look into the theological claims, and the metaphysucal principle, then no, I think in that instance Jesus Christ as the Incarnate Son of God and Second Person of the Blessed Trinity is unique.

God bless,

Thomas