NFL or pandemic?

wil said:
No Friends Left?

https://churchleaders.com/outreach-...owd-churches-dying-due-to-friendlessness.html
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This is the sentence that I focused upon....

“They’re nice to you, but no one becomes your friend.”

I think we are very lucky if we have half a dozen true friends, but nearly all my neighbours are nice and that is what makes my local community to pleasant.

Before Covid I would go cycling around the countryside on Sunday mornings (East Kent, England) and would often go in to chapels and churches if they were open for services which is usually the only time when they are unlocked. In CofE churches the average congregation on Sundays was about 5 or 6 very old people but the Catholic Church (Herne) would have larger numbers present....... and then I discovered the Riverside Church, busting to full with Christians. I found it because a sign directed me to its cafe which is open all the time, offering tea, coffee a selection of biscuits and cakes and a range of free newspapers, a very pleasant break from the pedals of my bike! :) The Riverside was an old industrial building with car park that some Christians bought and developed, offering halls for company meetings, a centre for day-child-care, other services and of course, a church. And The Riverside Church at Swalecliffe, Whitstable has just taken off. (I don't mean miraculously, I'm just messing about with metaphors! :) )

The Salvation Army still thrives and its hall is still used by various groups, for services and on Thursday at noon anybody can go along for a 'soup and friendship' event, and I have been to this a couple of times.

The Jehovah's Witness Kingdom Hall is very large (I think) but the congregation is so large in this town now that it has been split in to East and West JW congregations. The welcome there is huge, which I can't criticise at all, even though I have no close friends there.

And on....and on...... I do think that Christianity is waning in England but 'Church' is growing, and by that I mean Friendship in the community. I'm not a Christian but I do respect the growing congregations of the new communities.
 
RJM said:
Not making friends seems a shallow reason for leaving church? Is that why people join?
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Yes.......... for friendship, but then I never did find any deep waters. :)
My late wife was a Bahai and I took her to many Bahai events where everybody was very pleasant and friendly. Our families were very pleasant and friendly. In 1976 we made a mistake because the mobile home park where we lived limited families to two children and we were going to have a third child. My wife and two kids needed a temporary home until I could sort out a mortgage on a little home and so we asked our families if they could help, just for a few weeks.

Oh Boy........ how to find out true friends! My sister wouldn't offer help in her big home because she explained that once a mother/child have been admitted to a home then they cannot be made to leave later; great excuse!The Bahais were asked if any Bahai might be able to help for a short time and that we could pay a rent, but the Secretary for Bahais in England just kept repeating 'We don't give money!' during that call..... totally focused upon money. My Granny received my wife and kids in to her home, but fell ill a week later and was admitted to hospital after which time my mother arrived and put my wife and kids out on the street on a Wednesday late afternoon while I was at work 60 miles away. You couldn't make this up...... My Father took my family in for two months while I got a mortgage.......

Jesus got it right! When told that his family were outside come to 'talk' with him he explained that the people around him, with him, for him, following him ... these were his true family........... Let us find our true families, and if that includes your blood relatives then I think that you are truly blessed.
 
badger said:
Oh Boy........ how to find out true friends!
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I'm sorry for what happened to you and your family.

I've had that kind of experience myself. Surprising and painful at the time, to discover who turns away. Good friends are a rare treasure.
 
My basic question...as usual left in my mind and not in the OP.

Is it "No Friends Left"? Or is it the isolation of the pandemic that got folks out of the habit...and once out of the habit don't feel the need?

Or is it the NFL? We have chosen another "god" to worship (a soccer team, auto racing, bike riding, golf...) Another "god" that fills the community and friend and group think camaraderie many humans crave?

Appears to me to be a combination.

The Sunday obligation crowd has waned...and the church (imo) is sustained by a number of groups... There are those that gravitate to administration and service, those that like to sing so also meet a couple times a week for choir practice, those that feel good doing charity work or outreach, they all need to be there for the Sunday only crowd that comes and puts money in the till because ... well because their parents or the book or someone told them it was the right thing to do...and it makes ya feel better giving money where things are going on..

As usual these are just my observations... I enjoy reading yours....

As for church sizes...JWs typically have a max of 150...then they split and the community throws up another hall (what I have seen stateside) and after that it usually has to do with population density. Urban churches like packed houses squished side by side...suburban likes a little more space in the pews and rural churches like to sit in family groups with lots of land between them.
 
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Cino said:
I'm sorry for what happened to you and your family.

I've had that kind of experience myself. Surprising and painful at the time, to discover who turns away. Good friends are a rare treasure.
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Yes....so true.
But once found, how wonderful they are. :)
 
wil said:
My basic question...as usual left in my mind and not in the OP.

Is it "No Friends Left"? Or is it the isolation of the pandemic that got folks out of the habit...and once out of the habit don't feel the need?

Or is it the NFL? We have chosen another "god" to worship (a soccer team, auto racing, bike riding, golf...) Another "god" that fills the community and friend and group think camaraderie many humans crave?

Appears to me to be a combination.

The Sunday obligation crowd has warned...and the church (imo) is sustained by a number of groups... There are those that gravitate to administration and service, those that like to sing so also meet a couple times a week for choir practice, those that feel good doing charity work or outreach, they all need to be there for the Sunday only crowd that comes and puts money in the till because ... well because their parents or the book or someone told them it was the right thing to do...and it makes ya feel better giving money where things are going on..

As usual these are just my observations... I enjoy reading yours....

As for church sizes...JWs typically have a max of 150...then they split and the community throws up another hall (what I have seen stateside) and after that it usually has to do with population density. Urban churches like packed houses squished side by side...suburban likes a little more space in the pews and rural churches like to sit in family groups with lots of land between them.
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I think you've got this accurately, that lots of folks who attend churches do do for lots of different reasons and always have done, apart from big C Christianity.

But new churches are springing up here with Christianity-with-new-ideas priests and congregations, focused upon care in the community and services offered. As a pagan I just get the feeling that Jesus would be pleased.
 
I haven't attended an organized church service since I was a kid, long before Covid was even thought of. But when we did attend, there was never a sense of fellowship. At least, not at the churches we had access to at the time.

Part of the problem was, half the time we didn't have money for the collection plate and we were often looked down upon because of it. That or pitied by the congregation and not treated in equal standing. This happened time after time at different area churches. That didn't sit well with my mom, so after a while she stopped taking us and encouraged us to read the Bible at home. Oddly enough, in doing so we felt closer to God than we ever did in a church setting and IMO, learned more than we otherwise would have.

It's no wonder of the seven churches listed in Revelations, only two did Jesus not find fault with, Philadelphia and Smyrna.
 
badger said:
new churches are springing up here with Christianity-with-new-ideas priests and congregations, focused upon care in the community and services offered
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Unity focuses on the bible being utilitarian...personally and communally useful in this life without concern for the next.

Unitarian has a social consciousness aspect to it..

As do Quakers...

What is old is new again.
 
Namaste Jesus said:
we didn't have money for the collection plate and we were often looked down upon because of it. That or pitied by the congregation and not treated in equal standing
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I felt that as a kid...and when I got into unity with 2 little twins I had very little excess funds. But that was not an issue. And then from volunteering (community aspect) I believe I got more respect than I deserved.
 
wil said:
Unity focuses on the bible being utilitarian...personally and communally useful in this life without concern for the next.

Unitarian has a social consciousness aspect to it..

As do Quakers...

What is old is new again.
Click to expand...

I do not know enough about the Quakers, other than that they will lend their meeting house in Canterbury to any kind group that needs it.
I think that the laws in the Old Testament were definitely useful for this life, for the strength, security, cohesion and health of a whole people, only needing a few changes to bring them up to date.

I'm a very strong advocate for the 'Now' of this life first and foremost. I was dead for countless billions of years before, and although that was alright I do think that the Now is a great gift not to be snubbed or dismissed.
 
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