Within Al-Baqara......... having faith?

[Bishadi]

What a wonderful set of reading that shares many areas of wisdom.

Allow me a few lines to show anyone who likes to observe good material

002.002
This is the Book; in it is guidance sure, without doubt, to those who fear Allah;

002.006
As to those who reject Faith, it is the same to them whether thou warn them or do not warn them; they will not believe.

002.008
Of the people there are some who say: "We believe in Allah and the Last Day;" but they do not (really) believe.

002.009
Fain would they deceive Allah and those who believe, but they only deceive themselves, and realise (it) not!

In viewing the whole progression herein with the three translations offers good common sense. CRCC: Center For Muslim-Jewish Engagement: Resources: Religious Texts

It seems a part of having faith is to follow the same progression shared within the previous religious teaching;

002.021
O ye people! Adore your Guardian-Lord, who created you and those who came before you, that ye may have the chance to learn righteousness;

002.027
Those who break Allah's Covenant after it is ratified, and who sunder what Allah Has ordered to be joined, and do mischief on earth: These cause loss (only) to themselves.

002.062
Those who believe (in the Qur'an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.

seems to remain faithful to Allah requires faith in the Last Days

which makes sense with

002.106
None of Our revelations do We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, but We substitute something better or similar: Knowest thou not that Allah Hath power over all things?

Is there more to having 'faith' in the 'Last Days' ?

Is this found within the combining of the 3 religions of Abraham?

Any opinions as to what that means?

 

[c0de]

002.008
Of the people there are some who say:"We believe in Allah and the Last Day;"but they do not (really) believe.

----------------------------------------

Is there more to having 'faith' in the 'Last Days' ?

Is this found within the combining of the 3 religions of Abraham?

Any opinions as to what that means?

Hello Bishadi,

There is a difference between the "last days" and the "Last Day".
The Last Day, is the Judgment Day. The last days, are the few
centuries before the final end. If you look at that verse again,
it says that Muslims are required to believe in the Last Day,
which is Judgment Day. This is true for all the Abrahamic faiths.

 

[Bishadi]

Hello Bishadi,

There is a difference between the "last days" and the "Last Day".
The Last Day, is the Judgment Day. The last days, are the few
centuries before the final end. If you look at that verse again,
it says that Muslims are required to believe in the Last Day,
which is Judgment Day. This is true for all the Abrahamic faiths.

i was noting that before but was provided for

002.080And they say: "The Fire shall not touch us but for a few numbered days:" Say: "Have ye taken a promise from Allah, for He never breaks His promise? or is it that ye say of Allah what ye do not know?"

 

[c0de]

I think you are again misinterpreting the
meaning of the verse you are quoting.

002.080 And they say: "The Fire shall not touch us but for a few numbered days:" Say: "Have ye taken a promise from Allah, for He never breaks His promise? or is it that ye say of Allah what ye do not know?"

This refers to the people who do evil things in life and
say that they will only be in hell for a little while and so
lose their fear of God. God is warning them that their
time, however long in hell, will be such that they should
never lose their fear of it.

 

[Abdullah]

What a wonderful set of reading that shares many areas of wisdom.

Allow me a few lines to show anyone who likes to observe good material



In viewing the whole progression herein with the three translations offers good common sense. CRCC: Center For Muslim-Jewish Engagement: Resources: Religious Texts

It seems a part of having faith is to follow the same progression shared within the previous religious teaching;
seems to remain faithful to Allah requires faith in the Last Days

which makes sense with



Is there more to having 'faith' in the 'Last Days' ?

Is this found within the combining of the 3 religions of Abraham?

Any opinions as to what that means?

Salaam Bishadi

002.062
Those who believe (in the Qur'an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.


Here's the context of that verse:

... The light of their [all the Prophets] message was one, in which sense the Qur'an says, "We do not differentiate between any of His messengers" (Qur'an 2:285), showing that previous religions were the same in beliefs, and though differing in provisions of works, and now abrogated by the final religion, were valid in their own times.

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]As for today, only Islam is valid or acceptable now that Allah has sent it to all men, for the Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace) has said, [/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"By Him in whose hand is the soul of Muhammad, any person of this Community, any Jew, or any Christian who hears of me and dies without believing in what I have been sent with will be an inhabitant of hell" (al-Baghawi: Sharh al-sunna 1.104). [/FONT]
​

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]This hadith was also reported by Muslim in his Sahih by `Abd al-Razzaq in his Musannaf, and others. It is a rigorously authenticated (sahih) evidence that clarifies the word of Allah in surat Al 'Imran [/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"Whoever seeks a religion other than Islam will never have it accepted from him, and shall be of those who have truly failed in the next life" (Qur'an 3:85) [/FONT]
​

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]and many other verses and hadiths. That Islam is the only remaining valid or acceptable religion is necessarily known as part of our religion ...[/FONT]

read on: Universal Validity of Religions

however I'll just add a note to that article, and that is that it is reported that a reliable trustworthy traditional Scholar [Shaykh Hamza Yusuf] has said [to the extent]... that the interpretation from the Quran by Martin lings and frithjoff chuon, etc, that the previous divine religions are still valid is not kufr [dont take a person out of the folds of Islam] but only biddah [foul innovation] due to it being a highly nuanced interpretation [such an interpretation gives leeway for us to consider adherants of such an interpretation as misguided, but who knows, the verdict with Allah may not change], but I have to warn that the person who I heard this from turned out to be a verry unreliable person, for he supported someone arguing that Jesus or Adam [pbut] had litterally Allah's spirit [i.e, part of Allah] blown into him ] ...

Ali bin Abi Talhah narrated from Ibn `Abbas, about,

(Verily, those who believe and those who are Jews and Christians, and Sabians, whoever believes in Allah and the Last Day) that Allah revealed the following Ayah afterwards,


(And whoever seeks religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers) (3:85).

This statement by Ibn `Abbas indicates that Allah does not accept any deed or work from anyone, unless it conforms to the Law of Muhammad that is, after Allah sent Muhammad . Before that, every person who followed the guidance of his own Prophet was on the correct path, following the correct guidance and was saved.

Tafsir.com Tafsir Ibn Kathir

Hope that helps

Peace

 

[Bishadi]

I think you are again misinterpreting the
meaning of the verse you are quoting.

it's possible, as anything is possible

i did go over it again, it seems as if as you combine more lines, that in doing so there is much more to discuss

002.081
Nay, those who seek gain in evil, and are girt round by their sins,- they are companions of the Fire: Therein shall they abide (For ever).

to seek in gain (their cause (selfish)... will live in the hell of their choice, (kind of like living in the hell, one creates)


002.082
But those who have faith and work righteousness, they are companions of the Garden: Therein shall they abide (For ever).

and it was shared earlier that it is good to have faith is in the 'days' to come...

such to do good, within truth (garden/nature does not lie).......... then in truth they shall live

002.083
And remember We took a covenant from the Children of Israel (to this effect): Worship none but Allah; treat with kindness your parents and kindred, and orphans and those in need; speak fair to the people; be steadfast in prayer; and practise regular charity. Then did ye turn back, except a few among you, and ye backslide (even now).


so prehaps the truth is in the 'covenant' as shared in each belief system otherwise to 'turn back' a few will backslide

the old covenant is of the promise; the days of truth, the revealing

i can see your opinion but 'the cow' is pretty much talking about the same thing .......... within its over-all message............ trust Allah will provide (do good and have faith in the coming)

am i OK with assuming you don't believe 'having faith' has anything to do with the same promise within Judaism and Christianity?

 

[c0de]

am i OK with assuming you don't believe 'having faith' has anything to do with the same promise within Judaism and Christianity?

Remember Bishadi, we Muslims believe that promise was
fulfilled with the coming of the Prophet Muhammad PBUH.

so prehaps the truth is in the 'covenant' as shared in each belief system otherwise to 'turn back' a few will backslide

The verse you quoted already reveals exactly what the covenant was:

1. Worship none but Allah;
2. treat with kindness your parents and kindred, and orphans and those in need;
3. speak fair to the people;
4. be steadfast in prayer;
5. and practice regular charity

and it was shared earlier that it is good to have faith is in the 'days' to come...

such to do good, within truth (garden/nature does not lie).......... then in truth they shall live

The word "garden" in used in the Quran is reserved for Paradise/Heaven.
That this is the reward the righteous will get after Judgment Day.
When you read those verses in their proper context, this becomes
very clear.

to seek in gain (their cause (selfish)... will live in the hell of their choice, (kind of like living in the hell, one creates)

This interpretation is correct. Those who work evil may
very well be debased in this very life. Those who work good
may be rewarded in this life as well. But the final reward/punishment
will be given on Judgment Day (after death).

i did go over it again, it seems as if as you combine more lines, that in doing so there is much more to discuss

You may combine as many verses as you want Bishadi, but
there is no promise of anything about the last days other
then the destruction of this world, followed by the Last Day,
i.e. Judgment Day, which is then followed by the afterlife.

I know you want to interpret the Quran to fit in with your
theory about the last days in which the world will unite and
everyone will live happily ever after, but according to the Quran,
the "happily ever after" part will come in the afterlife. Not in
this world.

 

[Bishadi]

Remember Bishadi, we Muslims believe that promise was
fulfilled with the coming of the Prophet Muhammad PBUH.

i disagree

The word "garden" in used in the Quran is reserved for Paradise/Heaven. That this is the reward the righteous will get after Judgment Day.
When you read those verses in their proper context, this becomes
very clear.

i disagree and please do not tell me how to read as then you leave yourself open

This interpretation is correct. Those who work evil may
very well be debased in this very life.

Or even to have been mislead can often cause the 'debased.'

Those who work good
may be rewarded in this life as well. But the final reward/punishment
will be given on Judgment Day (after death).

After death is not as important as life as well to know life, removes death from the equation.

Otherwise, i believe you assessment is inaccurate as well suggesting you represent 'muslims' rather than yourself is foolish to say the least.

You may combine as many verses as you want Bishadi, but
there is no promise of anything about the last days other
then the destruction of this world, followed by the Last Day,
i.e. Judgment Day, which is then followed by the afterlife.

Seems that is your opinion.

I know you want to interpret the Quran to fit in with your
theory about the last days in which the world will unite and
everyone will live happily ever after, but according to the Quran,
the "happily ever after" part will come in the afterlife. Not in
this world.

seems the 'religious interpretation' you use is different than others.

that is something you will have to live with

but i really like the quran for what it says, not what you say

 

[c0de]

I don't see anyone here offering you a different explanation of these verses.

 

[Bishadi]

002.042
And cover not Truth with falsehood, nor conceal the Truth when ye know (what it is).

I don't see anyone here offering you a different explanation of these verses.

that is the difference between you and i perhaps, i have no problem thinking all by myself. Whereas many folk are still following leaders rather than standing with 2 feet on the ground and confident.


This thread is sharing what 'the cow' is representing about having faith.

And rather than explor the 'good' you are tapping on me, my capabilities and discounting the works within quran, all because it appears different than what you believe.

In fact, in each post there is not even a care towards truth, just the opinion of your beliefs.

hence why the quran provided the scenario before we even met


002.074

Thenceforth were your hearts hardened: They became like a rock and even worse in hardness. For among rocks there are some from which rivers gush forth; others there are which when split asunder send forth water; and others which sink for fear of Allah. And Allah is not unmindful of what ye do.

002.075
Can ye (o ye men of Faith) entertain the hope that they will believe in you?- Seeing that a party of them heard the Word of Allah, and perverted it knowingly after they understood it.


we both know the 'last chapter' has not been completed and it is all over the quran...........

in fact, the majority of quran is about the future, as prophecy but some just can't see

Not my fault, nor muhammed, and never God's.............

so if you want to discuss, then leave the focus on me OFF the table otherwise, you may not realize it just yet, but it seem i know quran far better than you and i don't care what you call yourself as that don't make you a man.

 

[c0de]

that is the difference between you and i perhaps, i have no problem thinking all by myself.

LOL, clearly you have not taken a look around this section of the forum.

but it seem i know quran far better than you and i don't care what you call yourself as that don't make you a man.

I never said I knew more then you.
If you think you know more then me,
then thats ok too.

Have a good one.

 

[Bishadi]

LOL, clearly you have not taken a look around this section of the forum.

i have and why it seems strange how the focus of truth is not the reason for the articulation

in the very thread above the opener is questioning interpretations, so it appears that some are interested in progression versus regression or oppression

i could care less wht people think about me

it is the knowledge, the furture, the children, 'the truth' that matters

the thread was to allow others to see the combining of knowledge and how 'equally' all three of the ladies are in the same pursuit

nothing is to divide........... it is for the good of equality: understanding and the Peace that will follow the truth!

 

[Bishadi]

021.103The Great Terror will bring them no grief: but the angels will meet them (with mutual greetings): "This is your Day,- (the Day) that ye were promised."