Cognitive Dissonance

[Tao_Equus]

Cognitive dissonance... that uncomfortable feeling you get when you hold two opposing or mutually contradictory opinions. I think I see a lot of it round here, and I am accused of it often enough too. But to what extent should we accept...or even embrace it?
It is uncomfortable. We like resolution, certainty, consistency. We tend to jump on each other pretty fast if we spot even a glimmer of it. And I think each of us goes out of their way to make sure it cannot be attached to us. I have seen here many genuine and heartfelt laborious, circuitous rationalisations just to throw a veil over CD. Can this site be called a CD self-help group? Is that why we come here?

 

[wil]

an example please.

 

[Tao_Equus]

an example please.

Here is one..

an example please.

Well really that is an example of someone being reluctant to commit for fear of...
But in the spirit of your question..

Look at Earls persistent accusations against me, or his equally persistent inability to concede there is no evidence to support life after death in any of the NDE pseudo-data he presents. Come on Wil, there are thousands of examples in these pages.. am I really that unclear?

 

[wil]

I meant one of yours, not your perceptions of same in others.

 

[Snoopy]

"In 1956 the US psychologist Leon Festinger introduced a new concept in social psychology: the theory of cognitive dissonance. When two simultaneously held cognitions are inconsistent, this will produce a state of cognitive dissonance. Because the experience of dissonance is unpleasant, the person will strive to reduce it by changing their beliefs."

Cognitive Dissonance

s.

 

[iBrian]

Cognitive dissonance... that uncomfortable feeling you get when you hold two opposing or mutually contradictory opinions.

It doesn't have to be an uncomfortable feeling - much about spiritual exploration deals with uncertain or difficult to define concepts. In fact, I'd even suggest it's healthy, because by allowing different opinions/viewpoints to be regarded as valid, you're not closing them off to your development.

I remember coming across a nice phrase from somewhere ages ago - "Accept everything; believe nothing."

In other words, it's good to be able to assimilate different ideas, give them respectful consideration, even if they may be at odds with other ideas - because some part of it may, through further searching, turn out to be very useful.

I think it's all an important part of keeping your mind open to the many possibilities of existence.

 

[Tao_Equus]

I meant one of yours, not your perceptions of same in others.

Ooooops...sorry

Lets say my attraction to an essentially purposeful Gaia theory vs evolution theory.

 

[Tao_Equus]

It doesn't have to be an uncomfortable feeling - much about spiritual exploration deals with uncertain or difficult to define concepts. In fact, I'd even suggest it's healthy, because by allowing different opinions/viewpoints to be regarded as valid, you're not closing them off to your development.

I remember coming across a nice phrase from somewhere ages ago - "Accept everything; belive nothing."

In other words, it's good to be able to assimilate different ideas, give them respectful consideration, even if they may be at odds with other ideas - because some part of it may, through further searching, turn out to be very useful.

I think it's all an important part of keeping your mind open to the many possibilities of existence.

I agree 100%, was my reason for making the thread

 

[Snoopy]

Ooooops...sorry

Lets say my attraction to an essentially purposeful Gaia theory vs evolution theory.

OK so...

If this is your example of two inconsistent cognitions for you:

Q1. Are you experiencing cognitive dissonance?

Q2. If yes, are you striving to reduce it by changing your beliefs? (or don't you have any beliefs...oh jeez I only just spotted that fatal flaw!)

s.

 

[Tao_Equus]

OK so...

If this is your example of two inconsistent cognitions for you:

Q1. Are you experiencing cognitive dissonance?

Q2. If yes, are you striving to reduce it by changing your beliefs? (or don't you have any beliefs...oh jeez I only just spotted that fatal flaw!)

s.

Har har har

A1: Yes
A2: No, I feel confident that the two are not mutually exclusive, that both are correct, that it is a lack of data that appears to make them dissonant.

 

[wil]

Har har har

A1: Yes
A2: No, I feel confident that the two are not mutually exclusive, that both are correct, that it is a lack of data that appears to make them dissonant.

and you think others don't utilize the same logic?

Was there CD when allopathic medicine denied accupuncture? And when it became acceptable (within their terms and insurance documents)what changed?

 

[Snoopy]

Har har har

A1: Yes
A2: No, I feel confident that the two are not mutually exclusive, that both are correct, that it is a lack of data that appears to make them dissonant.

So what does this do to the Cognitive Dissonance Theory proposed by Festinger, which I outlined above? (Perhaps your two cognitions are not inconsisent for you and therefore not actually two examples appropriate to cite in respect of the theory?)

s.

 

[Tao_Equus]

and you think others don't utilize the same logic?

I think everybody does. Forgive me if I am wrong but I feel like you are wrongly assuming I'm out to hang someone. It was just something I was thinking about earlier. There is no sucker punch.

Was there CD when allopathic medicine denied accupuncture? And when it became acceptable (within their terms and insurance documents)what changed?

Why don't you tell me?

 

[Tao_Equus]

So what does this do to the Cognitive Dissonance Theory proposed by Festinger, which I outlined above? (Perhaps your two cognitions are not inconsisent for you and therefore not actually two examples appropriate to cite in respect of the theory?)

s.

But they are. They have me vexed old chap. I say I "feel confident", but when I read it again there are doubts. I am not at all sure that I am not attaching wishful thinking to Gaia theory.

 

[wil]

No I'm not thinking you are sucker punching anyone. I think what you are descibing is what happens when something intuitive meets scientific discourse.

As I understand it Tesla was the intuitive sort, couldn't prove what he knew, but simply built inventions that worked based not on science and research but as much on intuition and internal knowing...pissed Edison off.

What you are describing is what has confounded religions as science proves them wrong and confounds scientists when they find the likes of acupuncture and energy work have validity.

 

[Snoopy]

I am not at all sure that I am not attaching wishful thinking to Gaia theory.

Perhaps the theory holds true then; and this is the crystallisation of the dissonance...the beginning of a change in a belief?

It seems intuitively true to me. I thought about my own beliefs and soon came up with my idea of being ethical in not eating meat but also being aware of what eating dairy products means. I have never been comfortable with this but haven't resolved it or changed my behaviour. (or...I've just bought a vegan cook book...maybe there's hope!)

s.

 

[Tao_Equus]

I think what you are descibing is what happens when something intuitive meets scientific discourse.

They are both inputs in my example for sure.

As I understand it Tesla was the intuitive sort, couldn't prove what he knew, but simply built inventions that worked based not on science and research but as much on intuition and internal knowing...pissed Edison off.

I think Edison must have used a fare share of intuition too, but I get your point. Thinking earlier I had an intuition that there was something valuable in CD that I am missing. But I cannot grasp it.

 

[Tao_Equus]

Perhaps the theory holds true then; and this is the crystallisation of the dissonance...the beginning of a change in a belief?

I do not have beliefs remember And I am serious. I do not. I do not believe in Gaia theory... I am attracted to it...subtle difference perhaps but a difference none the less. Even evolution theory I do not believe to be a complete theory. I just have an opinion it is pretty close to the mark.

It seems intuitively true to me. I thought about my own beliefs and soon came up with my idea of being ethical in not eating meat but also being aware of what eating dairy products means. I have never been comfortable with this but haven't resolved it or changed my behaviour. (or...I've just bought a vegan cook book...maybe there's hope!)

s.

Would the smell of a T-bone sizzling on the BBQ test your resolve?

 

[Snoopy]

I do not have beliefs remember And I am serious. I do not. I do not believe in Gaia theory... I am attracted to it...subtle difference perhaps but a difference none the less. Even evolution theory I do not believe to be a complete theory. I just have an opinion it is pretty close to the mark.

And you accuse PoO of pedantry. Sheesh! I noticed earlier today you said you believed something or other. I only didn't point it out at the time cos I thought it would have just been persisting with the silliness.*

I'd let you say "I believe that evolution represents the best current theory to explain speciation" without me accusing you of being a theist you know! It's not the slippery slope to the priesthood!

*but if you wish to persist! -

"It is my belief I have answered every question you have asked me to answer" (post 13)

http://www.interfaith.org/forum/scientific-fundamentalism-11730.html#post207299

Would the smell of a T-bone sizzling on the BBQ test your resolve?

Oh gawd yes I'd be incredibly tempted. You're joking aren't you. Aren't you? Or do you really not get it?

s.

 

[Tao_Equus]

And you accuse PoO of pedantry. Sheesh! I noticed earlier today you said you believed something or other. I only didn't point it out cos I thought it would have just been persisting with the silliness. I'd let you say "I believe that evolution represents the best current theory to explain speciation" without me accusing you of being a theist you know! It's not the slippery slope to the priesthood!

I never believed it was!

Oh gawd yes I'd be incredibly tempted. You're joking aren't you. Aren't you? Or do you really not get it?

s.

lol, sizzle, sizzle sizzle... cold beer, setting sun.... not much better in life in my book.
Out of interest...what are your ethical concerns?
I was joking but what might I not really get?